Topaz Posted June 16, 2018 Share Posted June 16, 2018 I was always curious about this. I used a AXSYS2-212 a lot till it got demolished in a vehicle accident. :( I got great tones out of it better than any of L6's newer stuff, but I digress. Point being. We all know the whole modeler into the full range PA mantra. However, my SYS2 a other new offerings from L6, contain 12" speakers. These speakers may be called 'flat response' by L6, but unless my understanding of speakers and physics is wrong, a 12" speaker cone is not gonna give you a full approximate 20hz - 20khz. AFAIK, even some third party's make cabs with only a 12" driver, no horns, made for modelers Normal 12" guitar speakers only go up to around 5.5~6khz. (overtones or harmonics whatever aside) So how does this all supposed to jive together? :-) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
phil_m Posted June 16, 2018 Share Posted June 16, 2018 Well it's FRFR that Line 6 recommends, not just "FR"... That's to say you need full range, flat response, not just flat response. So, yes, a 12" PA-type speaker may be flat response, but it's not going to be full range. The new Line 6 Powercab has a 12" woofer with a coaxial high frequency driver. Now even in it's FRFR voicing, it's not a true FRFR like, say the L3t is, but it still gives a much broader frequency response than just a single 12" speaker. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Topaz Posted June 16, 2018 Author Share Posted June 16, 2018 23 minutes ago, phil_m said: Well it's FRFR that Line 6 recommends, not just "FR"... That's to say you need full range, flat response, not just flat response. So, yes, a 12" PA-type speaker may be flat response, but it's not going to be full range. The new Line 6 Powercab has a 12" woofer with a coaxial high frequency driver. Now even in it's FRFR voicing, it's not a true FRFR like, say the L3t is, but it still gives a much broader frequency response than just a single 12" speaker. Oh yeah, I get that. Then more specifically, how did the AXSYS2 with just 2-12's able to perform 'properly'. The AXSYS2 had cab modeling, so it wasn't using the 12's as it's 'cab model' , so to speak. So how were those 12"s alone able to sound good without being full range? Only thing I can think of is that its amplifier or the modeler itself was tweaked for those 12's. I never tried it but perhaps if the AXSYS had been hooked up to a PA speaker maybe it would've sounded awful, I dunno. Also , didn't Atomic first come out with powered cabs for modelers that only had a 12" in them and no HF drivers? And of course, how could I overlook, doh! The Spider amps and maybe some others just use a 12" speaker. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
codamedia Posted June 16, 2018 Share Posted June 16, 2018 You really don't need full range to model cabinets... but you do need a flat response so the cabinet modeling can draw it's own curve. If you are using the HD (or a Helix) just for electric tones then a flat response (limited range) speaker can be a perfect choice. You will never require the extended range, and would likely end up dialing it all out anyway. It's a great solution for an "amp in the room" experience. IME: Full Range is required (or at least beneficial) when you use your line 6 device for more than just electric guitar. Acoustic instruments, a microphone, keyboards, etc... etc... When balancing those with electric sounds the HD series makes it a little more difficult... as you really do need an HPF (high pass filter) to tame the high end on the electric tones. The Helix adds an HPF to the cabinet block, but the HD series doesn't so I find I need to add another EQ along the way. I prefer to go use an FRFR! Although it may take a little more time and effort to really dial everything in, I know the tones will translate to the FOH (PA) and monitor rigs with no effort. The sound tech can usually set the EQ flat on my channel... adjusting only a little to compensate the room. I send the tech one line for my electric, acoustic, banjo, mandolin, pedal steel and all techs tell me the only thing they ever need to do is mix the level on occasion.... the tones all work with a flat strip. This is just my opinion based on my experience... YMMV Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Topaz Posted June 16, 2018 Author Share Posted June 16, 2018 Thanks again codamedia. I have an XTLive and an HD500X and I do use powered PA speakers with them. I get what you're saying about running electric tones and even though just using a 12" in their modeling amps, as long as the speaker has (more or less) a flat response, that works. I only know the HD's capabilities superficially, but afaik, since the HD series, they are more adapted to running into a normal guitar amp/speaker rig.... or rather have preamp models so you can run directly into your guitar amps power section if you could do so. The XTLive didn't and sounded like s*** anytime I tried despite having some EQ curves for amps besides studio direct Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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