Bad sound to FOH (Somewhat off topic)

[Hillman1312]

Dear Forum,

 

This is slightly off topic, but as I hope you don't mind me asking it here.

 

Today I had a gig and as I always do during rehearsal and previous gig I run the XLR out of my helix into an ART DTI isolator/transformer just as a precaution in case the sound-guy would turn on phantom power. I really never had any issues with that until today as during the (2 minute) soundcheck the sound-guy did not get a good signal and apparently the sound out of FOH was awful. 

 

Initially I thought perhaps the output was way too high so in the Global EQ I lowered the overall output. This didn't seem to work. 

Then, I took out the ART (i.e. connected directly to the stagebox or whatever that is called) after which things worked like a charm.

 

My understanding is that the ART does nothing more than isolate the signal coming out of the Helix from the signal going into the mixing desk. The transformer in the ART is a 1:1 so no gain/ attenuation going on.

 

I'm a bit puzzled as to what may be the reason for the strange behaviour.

Any thoughts ???

 

Thanks

[DunedinDragon]

It's really hard to diagnose what was causing the issue without asking a lot of questions about what the sound-guy was doing at the board and how you were sending the signal to the board (1/4" or XLR).  The ART DTI is simply a hum eliminator which shouldn't have any effect on the tone, just on transient noise.  But then when you say the FOH sounds "awful" that's not very specific.  My only guess is, based on you thinking the signal was too hot, that the sound guy wasn't gain staging your signal correctly on your channel and the signal was either clipping or engaging a limiter...but there's not enough information here to say one way or another.

[Hillman1312]

Thanks,

 

Indeed, I was using XLR out with " mic"  signal. The band just before us used a mic'd cab, so what I did is use the XLR cable connected to that mic and connect that to the ART (via my own XLR cable).

I asked the soundguy if he had compression/ limiter/ EQ going on a the desk but that was not the case (so he said). The way I understood it (but I did not hear it) is that the sound was distorted/muffled (lacking any better way of describing it). But strangely it went away after taking out the ART from the signal chain. Really weird .... I'll test my setup again later this week at rehearsal to double check that the patch cable I used (from the helix to the ART) is not broken.

 

... to be continued I guess..

[DunedinDragon]

Honestly that kind of supports my initial impression that he likely didn't bother gain staging your incoming signal separately from the previous band.  Although both you and the previous band were sending mic level signals, that doesn't mean they were the same signal level, and you were likely a much stronger signal than was the raw microphone signal, especially if you had your XLR disconnected from the Helix master volume knob.  I still can't explain why the ART would cause a problem though.  My bet is he made some changes in your channel he didn't tell you about like dialing down the gain/trim on your channel when you were changing the ART...but who knows.

 

[gunpointmetal]

Soundguy probably had a level wonky on his end and fixed it while you were disconnecting your ART box and was just embarrassed to tell you what actually happened. I watched a soundguy working with a friends band one night spend like 10 minutes screaming at his iPad because he wasn't getting any signal in the mains. Turns out he accidentally hit the MUTE switch on the L/R and since that wasn't usually procedure for him he glanced over it multiple times trouble shooting. lollipop happens, sounds like it got sorted, I would still check my cables, but I wouldn't change my setup unless something was damaged.

[kevin627]

I agree with the previous two posts, the sound guy changed something while you disconnected the art and to save face he may have suggested that your gear was the problem. 
 

Slightly off topic, I have a DI box (dbx DJDI, works well) right now but I’m not a huge fan of sending a signal out of the Helix, having it reduced at the DI box, and then boosting it back up at the mixer preamp. Also I would like to have the option to connect 1/4” to a board when necessary without hum. So I’m considering the Art DTI box. Has the Art DTI box generally been good at eliminating and noise/hum in your signal? @Hillman1312

[CraigGT]

Your Helix could be set to Line level on the XLR's and that would not play well with the desk if you were using a channel previously set up for a mic.

The soundguy should have spotted that though.

 

Craig