Assign Parameter to both Footswitch and MIDI

[drewburson]

I'm controlling my HX Stomp XL mainly with my RJM PBC via MIDI, but I use the foot switches to manually bring in or modify effects on the fly. In particular I have a low pass filter effect that I use regularly, but I often adjust the frequency of the effect. Primarily I will control the effect via the RJM, but I'd also like to have a toggle on a foot switch. It appears however, that I can only assign a MIDI CC or a foot switch to control a parameter though - not both. I just wanted to check and make sure I'm not missing something as I try to figure this out, or if there are other potential ways I could accomplish this. Thanks all!

 

(Note: I realize I could use snapshots, but I currently use them for some other effects, and I would like to keep them separate at this time.)

[phil_m]

You’re correct. One workaround would be to assign the parameter to a footswitch and then use the footswitches MIDI CC to emulate that footswitch via MIDI. The main drawback with this is that you would only have the ability to toggle between the max and min settings you program, rather than recall a specific value with a CC.

[kduck]

I haven't tried this (not at my rig currently), but I think that you could assign a command center command to accomplish this.   Assign the parameter to a MIDI CC (as you have with your RJM) , then set up a command center MIDI command on the desired HX Stomp footswitch to toggle that CC. 

[drewburson]

On 4/4/2023 at 11:35 AM, phil_m said:

You’re correct. One workaround would be to assign the parameter to a footswitch and then use the footswitches MIDI CC to emulate that footswitch via MIDI. The main drawback with this is that you would only have the ability to toggle between the max and min settings you program, rather than recall a specific value with a CC.

 

I can work with two settings. I've tried what you suggest, but it doesn't seem to work. Just to make sure I understood correctly, you're saying I should assign the Low Pass Frequency parameter to be controlled by a MIDI CC, then program the foot switch to send that CC in the Command Center? If so, then I assume that I have to have a full MIDI signal chain loop for it to work? Or is there a way to get the HX Stomp to respond to the messages it's already sending?

[phil_m]

On 4/4/2023 at 3:37 PM, drewburson said:

 

I can work with two settings. I've tried what you suggest, but it doesn't seem to work. Just to make sure I understood correctly, you're saying I should assign the Low Pass Frequency parameter to be controlled by a MIDI CC, then program the foot switch to send that CC in the Command Center? If so, then I assume that I have to have a full MIDI signal chain loop for it to work? Or is there a way to get the HX Stomp to respond to the messages it's already sending?

 

No - I'm saying you should set the Low Pass Frequency parameter to be controlled by a footswitch using the Controller Assign function. The Command Center isn't involved in any way.

 

So let's say you select FS3 as the controller for that parameter. If you look in the manual, you'll see that CC51 is reserved for emulating FS3. So assign CC51 to the footswitch on your MIDI controller, and whenever you press the footswitch on your MIDI controller is effectively mimics whatever FS3 is programmed to do on the XL.

[drewburson]

On 4/4/2023 at 5:56 PM, phil_m said:

 

No - I'm saying you should set the Low Pass Frequency parameter to be controlled by a footswitch using the Controller Assign function. The Command Center isn't involved in any way.

 

So let's say you select FS3 as the controller for that parameter. If you look in the manual, you'll see that CC51 is reserved for emulating FS3. So assign CC51 to the footswitch on your MIDI controller, and whenever you press the footswitch on your MIDI controller is effectively mimics whatever FS3 is programmed to do on the XL.

 

Ugh, I was all ready to say that this worked perfectly...then I realized that, rather than being programmed to have set values that toggle the switch, the HX Stomp is designed so that any MIDI signal on that footswitch CC toggles it to the opposite state regardless of the value. That effectively prevents an external controller from influencing it with presets, as it has no way of knowing the current state of that footswitch. Very frustrating, as it seems very counterintuitive to disallow that kind of control.

[kduck]

@phil_m's approach will definitely work if you are looking to toggle the same parameter values from both the HX footswitch and an RJM footswitch.  I use this myself frequently to activate/bypass effects from either my Helix floor footswitches and/or my Morningstar MC8.  This effectively makes your RJM a remote FS with the same function as the HX FS it is emulating.

 

Another approach is the one I suggested, which is more complex to set up, but will allow you to send several different values from both your MIDI controller and HX FS (or even use an expression pedal) to control the parameter.  Note that I'm assuming that the RJM has similar functionality to the MC8 and that the HX/Helix Floor have the same parameters. 

 

Since the HX doesn't have a MIDI loopback option, you will need to set up a few things on both the HX and the RJM.  I've tested this on my rig and figured I'd document it for others (and myself :)

• HX (Global Settings >> MIDI):
  • MIDI base channel must be different than the RJM base channel (mine is set to channel 8)
  • MIDI thru:  OFF  (otherwise you will get a MIDI loop)
• MIDI Controller:
  • MIDI base channel must be different than the RJM base channel (mine is set to channel 1)
  • MIDI thru: ON (in order to pass the MIDI CC from HX Command back to HX)
• MIDI Cables set up for bi-directional communication:
  • RJM MIDI Out to HX MIDI In
  • HX MIDI Out to RJM MIDI In

Once the above is set up, you can set up your HX effect parameter and footswitch:

1. Map Effect Parameter to MIDI CC (Scream 808 gain in my example)
   1. Set Bypass/Controller Assign to "MIDI CC"
   2. Set the MIDI CC# for the parameter as desired (I'm using CC4 in my example)
   3. 
2. Set up FS in HX Command Center:
   1. Select footswitch you want to control the parameter (FS11 in my example)
   2. Set command type = CC Toggle
   3. Set command MIDI Channel to your HX base channel (ch 8 in my example) or leave on "Base" (both options work for me)
   4. Set command CC# to the value you set in step 1 above (CC4 in my example)
   5. Set the command Dim/Lit values as desired.  You will have to play around to get the MIDI value (0-127) aligned with the parameter values you want
   6. Set the type (latching/momentary)
   7. 

At this point, test your HX footswitch.  It should toggle the parameter between the 2 values you've set in Command Center.  What's happening behind the scenes is this:  1) the HX Command sends a value (0/127) on CC4 Ch. 8; 2) the MIDI controller receives it and passes it back to the HX via MIDI Thru; 3) HX receives the message and applies the value to the parameter. 

 

Now you can set up your RJM to control the same parameter.  Just make sure you are transmitting on the HX MIDI Channel with the correct CC#.  With this approach you can also set up additional HX footswitches set different values for the parameter.  For example, I could have one FS to toggle gain between 0 and 10 (example above), then set up a second FS to toggle between 5 & 7 (following step 2 above):

 

  You can also set up an expression pedal to sweep the parameter across multiple values:

 

...and all 3 can be used together on the same preset/snapshot.

 

Anyway, hope this helps and you find it useful.

[robfawcett]

On 4/5/2023 at 3:05 PM, drewburson said:

 

Ugh, I was all ready to say that this worked perfectly...then I realized that, rather than being programmed to have set values that toggle the switch, the HX Stomp is designed so that any MIDI signal on that footswitch CC toggles it to the opposite state regardless of the value. That effectively prevents an external controller from influencing it with presets, as it has no way of knowing the current state of that footswitch. Very frustrating, as it seems very counterintuitive to disallow that kind of control.

Can you not use the footswitch as LPF ON/OFF but in this case leave it on and use MIDI to set the parameter to specific values for individual patches? I don’t recall the parameter limits of the LPF, but presume that if you set it to the very highest frequency it will effectively be OFF even though active, then when you want it ON use MIDI to adjust the LPF frequency to give the effect you need.