MIDI samples with Helix

[JamieHartnoll]

Hey all, 

I am not very good with technology when it comes to this sort of thing but it seems what I want to do should be achievable:

 

Is it possible using an iPad or laptop to trigger a MIDI loop of a 4 bar riff using the footswitches on the Helix and have it hook up to the tempo of the Helix?

 

We have a keyboard player, but she's unavailable for NYE and just one song we really want to play has a 4 bar brass part repeated 4 times over the choruses and I was hoping I could trigger it from the Helix?

[DunedinDragon]

You can trigger anything from the Helix via MIDI, but getting it in sync with the BPM's your band is playing might be a challenge.  If you all have a click track with the tempo that would make it easier.  But of course a MIDI loop doesn't have any instruments in it.  Just the information for playing the instrument.  For that you'd need a VST and other software.

[JamieHartnoll]

On 12/11/2023 at 4:43 PM, DunedinDragon said:

You can trigger anything from the Helix via MIDI, but getting it in sync with the BPM's your band is playing might be a challenge.  If you all have a click track with the tempo that would make it easier.  But of course a MIDI loop doesn't have any instruments in it.  Just the information for playing the instrument.  For that you'd need a VST and other software.

 

Cool... I don't even know how to begin, what would I need on my laptop (or iPad) to trigger a loop?

 

I can pre-program the instruments, but wouldn't the MIDI loop also have information about tempo and couldn't that be hooked up to the tap tempo feature in the Helix?

 

[cruisinon2]

On 12/11/2023 at 2:50 PM, JamieHartnoll said:

 

Cool... I don't even know how to begin, what would I need on my laptop (or iPad) to trigger a loop?

 

I can pre-program the instruments, but wouldn't the MIDI loop also have information about tempo and couldn't that be hooked up to the tap tempo feature in the Helix?

 

 

I applaud your work ethic, and what you want to do may very well be possible, I honestly have no idea... but for one tune at one gig? You're a better man than I, lol. You could learn 10 other songs to take its place before you get this sorted out.

[JamieHartnoll]

On 12/11/2023 at 8:02 PM, cruisinon2 said:

 

I applaud your work ethic, and what you want to do may very well be possible, I honestly have no idea... but for one tune at one gig? You're a better man than I, lol. You could learn 10 other songs to take its place before you get this sorted out.

 

Well that's just the start isn't it - once I know what I am doing I could apply it to all sorts of things!

[DunedinDragon]

On 12/11/2023 at 2:50 PM, JamieHartnoll said:

 

Cool... I don't even know how to begin, what would I need on my laptop (or iPad) to trigger a loop?

 

I can pre-program the instruments, but wouldn't the MIDI loop also have information about tempo and couldn't that be hooked up to the tap tempo feature in the Helix?

 

This gets into some really complex stuff and I'm not sure I can do it justice in a simple response.  First and foremost you have to understand that MIDI, as it relates to actual music, are just the definition of notes to be played, i.e. C, C#, D, D#....and how hard to play them (velocity), how long they're held (8th note, 1/4 note) as well as some other playing attributes.  How those notes are actually played depends on what kind of virtual instrument it's being played on.  For drums the D might be a kick drum but on a piano or organ or trumpet it will be interpreted to that instrument's sound.

 

Beyond that there are MIDI commands that can be thought of as instructions to an external piece of equipment such as a command to "play a loop" on an external piece of gear.  To do what you're wanting to do most of the time you'd use an external DAW or recording software that has a sequence of MIDI notes on a track that will play those notes through a specific instrument attached to that track containing that sequence of notes.  So in essence you would construct the MIDI note sequence (instructions) on a track and attach that sequence to a virtual instrument plugin such as a trumpet, all of that housed on a DAW on a laptop and connected via MIDI to your controller (Helix). Then at the appropriate time you'd send the MIDI command to that DAW to play the sequence.

 

That's a very rudimentary portrayal of what happens and there's a lot more complexity to it than that, and a world of different options of how you might do it.  But matching that kind of operation to a live performance means both the MIDI sequence and the live band must be in absolute sync with the same tempo.  That's not hard to do, but it is an absolute requirement to make sure they sync up, and there is no room for deviation.

 

That's about as far as I'd care to go in this discussion as you really need to do some of your own study as there are plenty of YouTube lessons on all of the technology components involved in this subject.  I just don't think it would be worth the time and investment it would take to  undertake this kind of thing just for one small piece of one show because it's really not a simple nor cheap thing to setup.

 

 

[cruisinon2]

On 12/11/2023 at 6:38 PM, DunedinDragon said:

But matching that kind of operation to a live performance means both the MIDI sequence and the live band must be in absolute sync with the same tempo.  That's not hard to do, but it is an absolute requirement to make sure they sync up, and there is no room for deviation.

 

 

 

This right here is the rub... unless you're using the Ramones Tempo Method, where the vocalist screams "One, two, three, four!" at the beginning of every song, then it's the drummer who's in charge of setting the pace. He should be the one triggering the samples, and he absolutely has to play to a click track for this to work. Somebody else might be able to get away with it triggering them as long as the tempo is already established and rock solid, but if the drummer is winging it without a click, you're asking for a train wreck, because you'll never sync with the samples properly. Some guys can do it and some can't, even if they're decent drummers...

[datacommando]

On 12/11/2023 at 7:50 PM, JamieHartnoll said:

Cool... I don't even know how to begin, what would I need on my laptop (or iPad) to trigger a loop?

 

Well, that says it all right there - and you want to to do this for one song on New Years Eve.

 

On 12/10/2023 at 11:34 PM, JamieHartnoll said:

I am not very good with technology when it comes to this sort of thing

 

Maybe aim for NYE 2025