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Massive M20d latency with Cubase 6.5.4
by dreadlocks on 2012-11-20 12:07:24

Hi. got my M20d today. Hooked it up with L6 to stagesource S and T. Sounds good.  Decided to use it as an audio interface with Cubase 6.5 and downloaded the latest driver.  Now I have an input latency of 525.964 ms. Output latency is 560.612 ms. Checked the control panel: default buffer size is 256, bit depth is 24 bit. in the bottom half of the driver control panel where it reads "ToneDirect & USB audio streaming" the buffer size is the middle between "Extra" and "Medium."  I tried setting a lower buffer size and changed the bit depth but was rewarded with white noise and crackles and pops.  Doing this also does not reduce the Latency readings in the "ASIO StageScape M20d" Cubase Device Setup window.

I am a big user of Line 6 gear, from Variax, to the toneports, kb 37, pod xt, x3, and the pod HD 500.  I have NEVER experienced anything like this with a driver.

My desktop cpu is intel i7 975 extreme, with 12 gig rams, asus pt6 motherboard and very fast ssd drive.  It works like a dream and this is the first time I've ever had any audio interface issues.  Currently the only line 6 drivers on my pc are the m20d and the pod hd 500.  I'm stating all of this to give an overview of my gear so that maybe somebody can help me figure out quite quickly what is wrong, and find a fix.  Anybody with similar issues? Help please, Line 6.



Re: Massive M20d latency with Cubase 6.5.4
by TheRealZap on 2012-11-20 12:13:13

This question has came up a few times. The m20d is not an audio interface and is generally not suitable for this use. from what i understand they may be working on some updates that will make it useful for this, but they are not promising to deliver.



Re: Massive M20d latency with Cubase 6.5.4
by dreadlocks on 2012-11-20 12:53:33

Well... I'm really surprised and I'm really disappointed. It would have been nice if they had mentioned this in their ads or manuals.  And how can they say it is not an audio interface. It really is working as such. My Daws recognize it. It streams back, just that the latency is horrible.  I really hope they address this in the future, as it would take this incredible concept mixer to the next level. Thank you very much for replying. At least now I know. Thanks again.



Re: Massive M20d latency with Cubase 6.5.4
by laven666 on 2012-11-22 07:17:45

Me as well. It's one of the things I had assumed it could do and seems like a major ball dropped if they don't correct it.



Re: Massive M20d latency with Cubase 6.5.4
by Octo777 on 2012-11-24 04:34:45

Indeed, I had been under the assumption that the desk would very much function as an interface given the USB output to DAW that is provided.

Although, it may very well be the case that the sheer amount of DSP involved in making the M20d do all the wonderful things it does, is just too much for it to be used as a regular audio interface.

And I agree, the M20d would be an even more powerful device if they are able to correct these issues.....



Re: Massive M20d latency with Cubase 6.5.4
by ArneLine6 on 2012-11-29 11:34:24

For its intended purpose – as a highly flexible live mixing environment and front end for high quality recording – we are very pleased with how the M20d turned out, but it is important to understand how the audio behavior over USB works.

The M20d was designed first to be a self-contained multitrack recorder. Its ability to do multitrack recording and playback to and from an SD card or USB drive connected directly to the mixer allows for high quality standalone recording of live performances.

USB audio streaming to the computer works very well for multitrack acquisition of the audio channels coming into the mixer, but the M20d was not designed as a replacement for traditional bi-directional sound cards or DAW interfaces. As such, it doesn't allow for low latency thru monitoring. If you require the ability to use computer-based virtual instruments in your live performances, you'll need to connect the audio outputs from the computer into input channels of the mixer.



Re: Massive M20d latency with Cubase 6.5.4
by dreadlocks on 2012-11-30 00:59:30

Hi Andy,

Thanx for some official no bs Line 6 reply. No need to sell us on how great the mixer is, man - We owners coughed up more than two grand for the device - so that's like preaching to the choir.  No one jumps up and buys so a revolutionary concept device (which I had been dreaming about for years) without being crazy or believing in the company (or both).  Line6 users are pretty much guys like yourselves - modern revolutionary dreamers who are not locked in the  "Only the musical devices invented by our grandparents are any good" paradigm.  You guys are our other half. You create the toys we dream of, and yeah we love you for that.  But! - in this instance!  Your AD  guys quite simply F***ed up.   The way you just fessed up and explained exactly the M20ds capabilities, and limitations should have been in the fancy ads, video tutorials and manuals. If Line6 had done that maybe I would have opted for the Presonus StudioLive or Mackie dl1608 which I was contemplating before my favourite company presented The Alternative.  Or maybe I would still buy the M20d, cause I'm a real sucker for your stuff, and there's a lot to love about the M20d. But it would have been a very informed decision. As it was I didn't have all the facts when opting for the M20d.

Currently it's set up in my studio with my stagesource speakers. I am mixing my live show in Cubase 6.5 via Presonus Audiobox 1818vsl to M20d/Stagesource. Wanna make sure that when I hit the road all is balanced and sounding awesome. At first I wanted to do it without the Presonus in between and that's when I discovered the latency.  So now I'm doing it your way (which I had figured out before) but it really surprised me that the Gods (and My Heroes) of Line6 Monkey, easy online connectivity and updates, All Pods cool, great Asio drivers, etc etc could have made the shittiest Asio driver on the Planet since the default windows cubase duplex crap.  This I certainly did not expect from Line 6 and most certainly not in their most modern awesome, and much trumpeted creation - the M20d.  We all thought something was terribly amiss because the info you just gave, was not provided in the way you just did: clearly and honestly - for which we thank you, even if it's late in the game.  Your AD department should register that - even in the fine print, man. We users kinda prefer ALL the facts to the glitz and hype. Kinda let us respect and trust the company more, if you know what I mean.  

Anyway, now you know what we users would like for the M20d (see also the wishlist threads), so if it's at all possible in the future we'd really like that.  And really nuff respect for some official honest explanation and clarification.

(Naw, I'm not pissed off because you guys won't come to your senses and make some new Lefty Variaxes and I'm stuck here with my two old 500s, lusting after the new awesome JTVs, and feeling brushed off and dissed.  That's a separate thread and issue. hmm)



Re: Massive M20d latency with Cubase 6.5.4
by aldergas on 2013-02-03 20:51:34

Your right.

I need super fast asio driver.

I need to use m20d as my primary sound card. 

This feature is essential for me before I buy the m20d.

+1




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