powering up the HD 500 with James Tyler Variax VDI cable plugged in causing my buttons to quit responding

[dreaminglad]

I recently updated the firmware on my HD 500 when I restarted my HD 500 my buttons no longer responded. after re installing latest firmware it continued to do the same thing. after numerous attempts to change USB cables and computers I determined it was not a software or connection. I became curious about the voltage needed to power the very ex guitar through the VDI cable and realized it is possibly a strain on the overall voltage supplied to the HD 500. this in my opinion is clearly a manufacturing defect that has been rearing its head for quite some time now. it would be prudent of line 6 and or Yamaha to resolve this issue by supplying better power supplies for users that are using the HD 500 VDI cable to power their Variax guitars

[Charlie_Watt]

I never unplug my JTV and I have never had a power problem with my HD500x.  I don't think this is a design issue.  Maybe you have a defective unit???

[dreaminglad]

I never unplug my JTV and I have never had a power problem with my HD500x. I don't think this is a design issue. Maybe you have a defective unit???

.

my unit is an HD 500 it is not the hd500x which I believe came out because they were aware of several design issues and they addressed them with the new model

[phil_m]

.

my unit is an HD 500 it is not the hd500x which I believe came out because they were aware of several design issues and they addressed them with the new model

 

I have an HD500 also, and what you're experience isn't the expected behavior. So if you power up your HD500 with the Variax not attached, it works OK? And does it work OK if you plug in the Variax after the HD500 is powered on? As far as difference between the HD500 and 500X, they are the same as far as JTV operation is concerned.  Also, the 500X uses the exact same power supply as the 500.

[dreaminglad]

yeahit's only when I power up HD 500 with the Variax attached do I have this problem.it did not start to occuruntil my second firmware update. the most recent firmware update made it even more prevalent. I can plug the Variax into the unit after it is powered up and it will work as expected. I am very troubled that my unit has become so undependable. and I am now reading a lot of cases of similar problems with others and it seems most times to occur after a firmware update

[Charlie_Watt]

Sorry but I have not read anything here that ever suggested that anyone but you have this problem with the Variax VDI interface.

[dreaminglad]

know what has been stated by many users is after the recent firmware updates they have issues number one the USB no longer is recognized by their computer. number 2 buttons stop reacting. number 3 is the Bootup looploop.I have been working in the recording industry for well over 20 years I have used more audio interfaces the most people will ever use. I have owned every line 6 product as far as the pod is concerned since the early kidney bean pod. bye have invested in the rig I'm using now well over $3000. what I am left with is a unit that is malfunctioning because of software flaws and power issues.I think what is truly disgusting me the most about this whole situation is in most of the threads that I have read line 6 or its experts continuously insist that that case is rare and its not happening often which is blatantly a lie and anyone who was working for line 6 is aware of this to continue dialogue with me using that assumption only aggravate me

[silverhead]

Have you opened a support ticket to work directly with Line 6 tech support to help you resolve this? I think that would be your best option.

[dreaminglad]

I will open a ticket but I have read previous threads and what appears to happen in multiple occasions is that line 6 finds that their product needs to be repaired at the user's expense. it would appear to me if a firmware update is causing these issues line 6 or Yamaha should be accountable and responsible and offer the users a resolution that does not cost them $50 100$ .I would not want to throw around accusations. But it would appear that it's a very profitable venture do you have firmware that causes units to malfunction. also when it comes to installing the firmware or software there are no specifications for what type of software what type of computer what type of USB port to use and typically when someone talks the line 6 about this pa different consistently say it must be your connection try a different computer this in my opinion is poor service and the people who are doing the service lack technological skill

[Charlie_Watt]

You have to realize that these updates work 99.9% of the time correctly and that is not what you see here.  You see here folks that are experiencing problems.  It's a very skewed sample of the user community.  I think you are also being very unfair when you suggest that Line6 does this on purpose to make $$.  I can assure you that they do not!  They do not like unhappy customers!  No successful company does.  Revert your FW and see if the problem goes away.  You may have something going bad either in your pod or your power supply.

[dreaminglad]

like I stated previously I don't like to throw around accusations but I do like to point out when things can appear conspicuous.and from my research it appears that your statistics of 99.9 percent are probably off it would appear like 75% would be more accurate. you have to understand my frustrations as a working musician I do not have a lot of funds to spend on gear that I need to make my money. I bought line 6 because my previous experience with line 6 has been exceptional I have never had an issue. I until now have held line 6 in very high regard and promote them relentlessly because I like their products and sounds they produce.it just seems suspicious that line 6 would create a fantastic product like the HD 500 promoted as much as they did within a few months of its release release a new version with very few updates other than possibly power and flash memory that holds data. like I said I am going to file a ticket and I will continue to post on this thread what happens with my ticket the sell the Yamaha is a bit convenient. and the change of policy where they now sale updates and model packs seems that this company is a bit money hungry

[phil_m]

like I stated previously I don't like to throw around accusations but I do like to point out when things can appear conspicuous.and from my research it appears that your statistics of 99.9 percent are probably off it would appear like 75% would be more accurate. you have to understand my frustrations as a working musician I do not have a lot of funds to spend on gear that I need to make my money. I bought line 6 because my previous experience with line 6 has been exceptional I have never had an issue. I until now have held line 6 in very high regard and promote them relentlessly because I like their products and sounds they produce.it just seems suspicious that line 6 would create a fantastic product like the HD 500 promoted as much as they did within a few months of its release release a new version with very few updates other than possibly power and flash memory that holds data. like I said I am going to file a ticket and I will continue to post on this thread what happens with my ticket the sell the Yamaha is a bit convenient. and the change of policy where they now sale updates and model packs seems that this company is a bit money hungry

 

The 500X was released something like three years after the 500 - it certainly wasn't just a few months.

 

As far as selling the model packs, it isn't a new strategy for them at all. They've been doing with the XT and POD Farm lines for over ten years.

 

I get that you're frustrated that you're having an issue. Anyone would be. But you're making some incorrect statements in trying to prove your point.

[davidb7170]

Ummm.... not to throw gas on a fire here, but you might try re-flashing the 500, surprised it hasn't been put forth yet.. Re-flashing has been shown to fix some issues. Maybe the firmware udate didn't install properly, a bit dropped in the communication of the USB or something.

 

I have both the 500 & the 500X. The 500X update went very smoothly -- no unexpected issues occurred on either the 2.61 flash or the 2,62 flash about a week later. The 2.62 flash was available for both the 500X and the 500 at the same time. Like I said, the 500X went fine, but I had a USB connection issue with the 500 update, and the unit did not complete the firmware update -- reported failed. The unit when rebooted, sat at the same UPDATE FIRMWARE screen as when it's doing the update. I did not panic. I disconnected any cables other than the power and the USB (I disconnected the JTV and the power amp). I made sure my USB cable was solidly plugged in and straight. The second try, it took. I have no issues with the operation of the 500 since the update.

 

The USB device not being recognized by the computer is usually a computer issue, not necessarily an HD500(X) issue. If USB communications fail between an external device and the computer, the PC keeps note of it and disables the USB port when that device is again connected to that port. This is why "trying another USB port" is usually recommended, and usually works... 

 

Not hard to fix -- (on a PC) I uninstall the PC USB port or hub in control panel device manager. The Windows device manager recognizes the PC USB port as a new device and re-installs the device & driver, resetting the history of the port, and 9 times out of 10, makes the communications usable again. IF the external device is in fact faulty or failed, this would be a way to find out.

 

I bought my 500X as a backup for my 500 (actually, the 500 now backs up the 500X) - I had an XTLive pedal power connection fail at a gig years ago, and it pretty left me dead in the water -- luckily my gig was less than 5 miles from home, so I made a mad dash home and brought back my Fender combo amp -- all it has is clean or distortion. Made it through the gig, but realized how much I appreciate a slate of FX the PODs offer... I replaced it with the X3Live -- the current product at the time. Since then, I always carry the last pedal as a spare for the newest one. Now it's the 500X with 500 backup. I also carry 2 JTV's for string breakage, and a spare power amp in the car. I'm an engineer and think in terms of contingencies -- you do that if you've been burned by it -- I have been....

 

On the VDI powering the Variaxes, I got my XTL mainly for the ability of it to power the Variax. In 2005, my Variax 300 came with a power adapter - box, you plug a stereo 1/4" cable from the Variax to the box, then a 1/4" guitar cord to the amp. I hate batteries, so I used that, but went to the XTL because of the VDI option. Used it on the X3L, the HD500, and now the 500X. Used it with the 300, my JTV-59, and my 69S. I've had zero issues due to the powering of the Variaxes with the VDI on the pedals. Been doing it since 2005...

 

What I'm saying is try all avenues to get 'er going before the need to resort to sending it someplace for servicing. As an example, if the unit doesn't power up at all, think wall jack, power strip, power adapter, bad cord, bad jack, pedal. Work the problem from simplest to fix towards the hardest to fix. Once you send it away, it's out of use until you get it back and pay for a service repair (assuming it's out of warranty) that may have been something you may have been to correct yourself with a relatively minor solution. Try the first step, then the next, then the next. Eliminate the possibilities one by one... If nothing you can do fixes the issue, then send it for repair, or junk it and get something else.

 

Dave

[davidb7170]

Aww geeze... sorry to the OP -- you did try multiple re-flashes... One other thing I've seen here is to go back to an earlier FW version -- the one you had working right. See if that FW works properly. Then try this update again. If the old one works and the new doesn't work again, then yes, Houston we have a problem...

 

Dave

[Charlie_Watt]

If you think it's the new FW then by all means revert.  I bet it's not the FW since nobody else is complaining about any problems with the VDI interface.

[mdmayfield]

Hang on.... This may or may not have to do with voltage. It's also possible that the cause is similar to this issue: http://line6.com/support/topic/7975-line-6-pod-hd500x-stuck-in-booting-screen/?p=65988

 

I've seen strange issues powering on the HD500 with a Variax plugged in when one of the electrical lines within the VDI connection is not solid (could be the plug-in on either side, or in the cable).

[Charlie_Watt]

The OP claimed that it happened after a FW upgrade.  All I suggested was to revert back to prove that it was or wasn't that.  I agree that it is almost certainly a HW problem, either the cable or one of the connectors.  If it was flawed FW, we would all be having this problem.

[maxnew40]

It seems the OP is waffling in his diagnosis of the problem. First he states that it is an issue with power supply, then decided that it is an issue with the firmware, all without doing any testing that would help narrow down the problem.

 

I have some questions about this that might help narrow down the problem:

 

Are you using the actual line 6 power supply? I have not seen anything out there that puts out the required 3 amps other than the line 6 power supply. The 3 amps is need to power the vairax and POD together.

 

Did you do the required Global reset and pedal calibration after the firmware upgrade? This is not an optional step.

 

Have you tried a different VDI cable?

 

Did you roll back the firmware to see if all the problem went away?

 

This is all basic troubleshooting steps that you should have lots of experience with due to you many years of recording work.

 

-Max

[maxnew40]

Just to add another data point,  I updated this my HD 500 (not HD500X) this weekend and I always have the Variax connected via VDI and I did not have this problem.

 

-Max

[maxnew40]

Hate to keep chiming in, but since we are not seeing any complaints about this issue but  dreaminglad claims to know that lots of people are having this very same issue. Where are these problems being reported or discussed?

 

dreaminglad can you point to us to where you are reading about all these problems. I am always interested in reading other forums that discuss this gear.

 

-Max

[dreaminglad]

the places that I have read other people having this problem or on threads throughout the Internet threads on this site. I am NOT trying to incite a problem but through my research I have quickly realized that for the first time I have bought a line 6 product that is undependable also through my research I realize there really will be no quick remedy without it costing me more money. I reflashed the unit multiple times at one point the unit stopped recognizing the USB port. I was able to remedy those things finally flashing it with the most recent update. only to continue to have the same problem. the person who posted the thread about possible bad power supply. thank you very much it confirms my thinking that it is a lack voltage that is causing the issue I'm experiencing.I do have one question of all the line 6 experts that have been keeping up with this thread does the hd500x have the same power supply that the HD 500 uses

[dreaminglad]

another question I would like to post to the line 6 experts is did at any time during the production of the HD 500 you change power supplies that was used used a different revision of a power supply?

[dreaminglad]

I did a flash revision revert to the first flash update. when I did that I no longer had the issue it workedI'm going to file the service ticket today and we will see what comes of it

[davidb7170]

I never have had an issue with the power supply on my 500 or my 500X. I use the VDI with my 2 JTV's. The 500's power supply has a round, red power LED light, the 500X's has a rectangular green LED. Both units have the same ratings: Input 100 - 240V AC ~1Amp, 50 - 60 Hz, Output 9V DC 3Amps.

 

The 500 PS has "DC-3G" and model number M8H-27NUS08R. The 500X PS has model number NSA27EU-090300. Both made in China. Both came with snap on plug adapters for use in other countries than the US. If I was to speculate (I'm an engineer and deal with specs a lot), I'd say the 500 PS model number with "US" in it was initially meant for the Americas, and the 500X PS with "EU" in the model number for Europe.

 

The US has 60 Hz (cycle) power, usual house voltage is 120V. The European countries, part of Japan, and other nations commonly have 50 Hz systems with 240V house voltages, so this one supply works for both target users.

 

If the power supply is defective, it would not be dependent on the Firmware version. It may be coincidental that the PS went out of spec after a certain amount of time, when you were upgrading the FW.... Don't know if you have cause & effect, there.

 

There have been discussions on replacement PS's -- you can search for those in the forums. Be aware that the things you need to match are the input voltage, the 9 VDC 3 Amp output, plug polarity and plug size to fit the 500(X). I have used the 2 power supplies with both units with no ill effects.

 

One side note. When I first got my JTV-69S, I'd had the 59 for about 2 years. When I would plug in the 69S (via VDI), after a short time (seconds) the 500 would reboot, then be fine. The 59 never did that. I don't know what would cause that, but it was only with the 69S. I was very concerned at first, but it just became a "normal" situation for the pairing. At some point in the progression of FW updates (I don't recall which one) the problem stopped happening... SO, there was some difference between powering up with the 59 and the 69S that the 500 rebooted for,. Don't know the specifics of what caused it or what fixed it -- FW update in the HD500 or the FW in the guitars....

 

Dave

[mdmayfield]

the places that I have read other people having this problem or on threads throughout the Internet threads on this site. I am NOT trying to incite a problem but through my research I have quickly realized that for the first time I have bought a line 6 product that is undependable also through my research I realize there really will be no quick remedy without it costing me more money. I reflashed the unit multiple times at one point the unit stopped recognizing the USB port. I was able to remedy those things finally flashing it with the most recent update. only to continue to have the same problem. the person who posted the thread about possible bad power supply. thank you very much it confirms my thinking that it is a lack voltage that is causing the issue I'm experiencing.I do have one question of all the line 6 experts that have been keeping up with this thread does the hd500x have the same power supply that the HD 500 uses

 

I think this is a conceptual leap with insufficient data. Personally, I would recommend doing what maxnew40 mentions above to narrow down the issue conclusively.

 

That approach is more likely to get you to the resolution you need, as opposed to picking a *possible* cause and acting as if it is THE cause, when it's actually not yet proven.

[dreaminglad]

thank you Dave the information you have posted has been very helpful. I'm beginning to believe that it's definitely the power issue of some type. I also had the same issue with my line 6 rebooting after my second or third firmware update. there is no way that I am aware of to actually test the amps being drawn from the power supply that I'm aware of. I guess ultimately I will have to shell out $50 to find out

[dreaminglad]

the thing is MD Mayfield I have tried all of what he has suggested. and I want it to be noted that not one line 6 expert has yet to concede the possibility that they sold a faulty device. that is not beyond the realm of possibility there would be no need for things like recalls the if that were the case. HD 500 has set in a smoke free studio air condition moisture-proof it has not moved has not been dropped or abused suddenly it is nothing more than a hindrance I can not count on this machine to get me through recording session. line 6 has been my go-to device for guitars 4 years now I have to offer musicians a lower quality device which is my pod x3 live until I can make my HD 500 as dependable as every other line 6 device I have bought to date. I spent $500 on a device just a year ago to only now have to spend $50 to 100$ to have it repairedso forgive my frustrations. before I ran estudio I also Emma trained computer technician. I am NOT ignorant about how these devices work I have over 20 years experience using these devices. when I say there's an issue I can't resolve you can be sure that I have tried absolutely every avenue available to me before I invest more money.

[phil_m]

Just a quick note, the people who have Line 6 Expert tags aren't Line 6 employees, and we don't officially speak for Line 6 or anything like that. We're just users who try to help when possible.  So, really, the only way to get an official response from Line 6 is to use the support ticket system.

 

Personally, I would have a hard time seeing it being the power supply, but if it is, that would actually probably be good news because it's a simple fix. And to answer your question, they've always used the same power supply for the HD500 and 500X.

 

What VDI cable are you using? If you have the ability to try another one, that would be worth trying, imo.

[dreaminglad]

I purchased VDI cable from line 6 it is worked perfectly on my pod x3 live did work perfectly on my pod hd500 until recent firmware updatesupdates I could possibly use a network cable that I have lying around that I know works

[davidb7170]

Now that you have the functionality back of your footswitches with the reversion to an earlier FW, you might consider a re-flash to the latest -- I have read many posts here where going back to an old one, then back up to the new cleared the issue. I'm not completely sure why that would work, but there have been multiple reports of it working. I don't know if a re-flash with the same doesn't completely over-write the bios data, or doesn't completely re-initialize the process, but a different FW version may, which might explain why you got your switch functions back by putting a completely different FW in. If it is unsuccessful, you can go back to where you're at now, and continue back down the path of support ticket, PS replacement, or service center. Just a thought...

 

Dave

[dreaminglad]

I took the firmware back to 2.31 and tried to power it with the VDI cable attached the hd500 started after a few seconds it did a restart then the buttons all worked. so I decided to update it to the latest version of the firmware and the exact same problem occurred. I started the h_d 500 with the v d I cable attached and the buttons no longer work and there was no restart.

[maxnew40]

Deaminglad, can you check to see if you are powering up your HD500 in the new Variax set list? The reason I ask is that I overwrote that set list with my own set list and I can't test powering up with that new set list selected and a variax connected via VDI.

 

-Max

[dreaminglad]

yes it does not matter which set list I am in at the time the same thing occurs

[silverhead]

Have you opened a support ticket yet? I think you need to work directly with Line 6 tech support on this.

[dreaminglad]

no I haven't opened a ticket yet I'm going to momentarily like I said I like to try to exhaust all options before I resort do that because I know ultimately it's going to cost me money. I have a new development that is stumping me. Update the usb firmware turn off the h_d 500 when it restarts the l_c_d screen shows that is still using the original version of the usb firmware.when I reinstall USB firmware it does the same thing it says installing I will power it down one time restart it it will show the correct USB firmware. the next time I power down and restart it it goes back to USB firmware version 0.00

[maxnew40]

It sure sounds like a hardware issue. If it were the firmware I would expect that your problem should reproduce for everyone that has updated the same model of POD and  has the Variax connect via VDI at power up. I can confirm that this not the case as this is what I did.

 

One other possible power related thing occurred to me. I leave the battery installed in both the JTV59 and JTV69 even though I connect via the VDI from the POD. I know that you don't have to have the battery installed when powering from the POD. If your Variax battery is not installed and charged give that a shot.

 

Just trying to think of things for you try before you have to send the unit in for service.

 

-Max

[maxnew40]

I think I may have experienced something similar at band rehearsal this weekend.

 

I always have my Variax connected when the HD500 gets powered up. I switched to tuner mode and the tuner was not working correctly, it displayed a note value but was not what the guitar was outputting. Power cycle of the HD500 did not help at all. I then powered up the HD500 with the Variax disconnected and then connected the Variax after power up was complete. This fixed the tuner problem.

 

I am going to try and test this again and see if I can consistently reproduce the issue, I will then submit a support ticket. It does appear there may be some issues with the firmware in this scenario.

 

-Max

[dreaminglad]

my story goes from bad to even worse after numerous attempts to update firmware for the USB and roll back firmware for the HD 500 and reinstall firmware. the USB port has broken the center piece is broken and come out of my HD 500 rendering it nearly useless to me I am so completely disgusted at this point that I have all but decided to sell my Variax guitar HD 500 for better more reliable gear

[maxnew40]

Line 6 didn't design the USB connector and that same connector is used a ton of computer gear, I don't think a broken USB connector has anything to do with the product reliability. I deal with computer and printer hardware every day at my job and I don't think I have seen on of those get broken before. I have seen them get loose depending on how they were mounted but not broken. How did that thing break, did the unit get dropped?

 

I really do think you should sell your gear as in my mind you seem to have an unrealistic expectation for this stuff. Real amps and stomp boxes don't have computers and USB interfaces which can add more points of possible failure. If you are looking for drop dead reliability I would also avoid tube amps, maybe a Roland JC120 would fit the bill.

 

For anyone else following the thread I will try and do some testing to see if I discovered a repeatable firmware issue or if it was just an anomaly.

 

-Max