struggling to understand send/return blocks

[Pittster1970]

I realise to some of you this will seem crazy, basic stuff but I really am struggling to understand when I'm setting up a new  patch where to place correctly the send and return blocks within a signal path.

 

This is assuming I'm trying to get the best out of my set up using my Blackstar combo in 4cm wiring.

 

any help at all would be really great, and please keep it as basic as possible!

 

[fiftyshadesofjay]

This video gives you the best idea of set up for 4cm.

 

 

Be warned when I tried it the send was set to "dry through" which plays havoc with the routing if you're not using Helix modelling so you might want to turn that off (you'll see the parameter when you click on the block)

[Pittster1970]

thanks for the link. I have already seen that one and a few others on YouTube which is why I guess i'm still feeling a bit stupid for not getting it!

 

with that video its hard to see the Helix screen and what the blocks are doing.

 

what I'm trying (failing!) to understand better is where about within the signal chain to send a signal to the amps loop and where to return. things like that. 

 

I've also seen some patches where the send/return block on the Helix screen has both arrows activated (both arrows highlighted white) whereas others have only one arrow highlighted (i assume either sending or returning the signal).

 

what would be the reason for having both arrows activated in the block?

 

many thanks for any help

[fiftyshadesofjay]

Think of the Send and Return as assigning the outputs and inputs of the helix.

For example -

Guitar > Helix Input > Send Block (Routed to Send 1 on the back of the Helix) > Amp Input

Now we need separate routing for the effects loop -

Amp Send > Helix Return 1 (Assigned to the Return Block in the Helix) > Helix Main Output > Amp Return

[Bkehoe]

Isn't there a template in the helix for 4CM? that may help - but what id do is, guitar into helix, effects you want before the amp - effectsloop block (cable from helix send 1 to guitar input - cable from guitar amp effects send to return 1) then cable from 1/4" output on helix to guitar amp effects loop return. 

 

In the options for loops you can use seperate effects send's or return blocks, or there is one block you can use for effects send and return - if using the two block approach (think from memory...) the default return mix or volume is not 100% so you may want to change that.

[Pittster1970]

guys I really appreciate you replying to this. I'm just not doing a good job of explaining my confusion!

 

I understand the routing/cabling. it's where to put fx blocks in the signal path that I'm struggling with, and what type of send/return block to use (the ones with both arrows lit up or the send/return with just individual arrows lit up).

 

I guess i need to find somebody local who might have one or at least understands better than me (which is probably most people!!)

[fiftyshadesofjay]

As far as the blocks go, the separate send / return is the same thing as the single block, the single block just has them both in one block.

As far as the signal path goes, you wan't all your pre effects before the send, such as wah, overdrive etc and the effects for the loop after the return, such as delay, reverb etc.

No hard or fast rules though, feel free to experiment.

[Digital_Igloo]

Isn't there a template in the helix for 4CM?

 

Yep. 8 TEMPLATES > 02A 4-Cable Method. Pressing FS2 (HELIX PREAMP) toggles between your real amp's preamp and one of Helix's. So if 90% of your songs use, say, your real MESA/Boogie Mk IV but one song sounds better with a Roland JC-120 model, you can swap them with a single footswitch.

[Pittster1970]

As far as the blocks go, the separate send / return is the same thing as the single block, the single block just has them both in one block.

 

 

am assuming there must be a difference between them though, otherwise why have the option to have separate send/return or both in one block if both do the same thing?

[ricksteruk]

am assuming there must be a difference between them though, otherwise why have the option to have separate send/return or both in one block if both do the same thing?

 

They do the same thing - you need to use a send and a return to connect your amp -- it saves space on your Helix screen to do it on the combined block

 

The reason for having them separate is - for example if you just put a send it can be used to send the signal elsewhere (maybe to a monitor or something).  Or if you just used a return block it could connect another instrument perhaps.. like a synth or whatever.

[Pittster1970]

Thanks Rickster, the penny is slowly but surely starting to drop!!

[ricstudioc]

They do the same thing - you need to use a send and a return to connect your amp -- it saves space on your Helix screen to do it on the combined block

 

The reason for having them separate is - for example if you just put a send it can be used to send the signal elsewhere (maybe to a monitor or something).  Or if you just used a return block it could connect another instrument perhaps.. like a synth or whatever.

I run a POG as an effect loop (two arrows) - it's serial, and all signal goes to/comes from it.

 

I run several of the EHX "9" pedals on my board (C9, Key9, Mel9)- each has it's own send (one arrow), and I return them (again one arrow) to their own returns in a separate path for independent processing.

 

Helix's routing flexibility is remarkable.....