Guitar thru buffered?

[ruperthawkes]

Is the guitar thru buffered a simple mono 1/4 socket?    Is it balanced?   What cable should I use to connect to Scarlett?   Is it a line out or should I connect to an instrument in on my Scarlett?   Thanks!

[rd2rk]

Be helpful to know which Helix you're using.

If the 1/4" Output is set to LINE (Global Settings>Ins/Outs), use a LINE input on the Scarlett.

Conversely, if set to INST, use an INSTRUMENT level input on the Scarlett.

Unless the Scarlett is 20ft or more away, Balanced/Unbalanced is irrelevent. That's all about signal to noise added over longer cable runs.

If the Scarlett is over 20ft away, use XLR. Output level in Global Settings applies as mentioned above, but on XLR would be MIC or LINE.

Unless you're using a Stomp (no XLR, why the specific device matters), in which case the 1/4" outs are balanced. Use a short 1/4 to XLR adapter.

 

[Schmalle]

8 minutes ago, rd2rk said:

Be helpful to know which Helix you're using.

If the 1/4" Output is set to LINE (Global Settings>Ins/Outs), use a LINE input on the Scarlett.

Conversely, if set to INST, use an INSTRUMENT level input on the Scarlett.

Unless the Scarlett is 20ft or more away, Balanced/Unbalanced is irrelevent. That's all about signal to noise added over longer cable runs.

If the Scarlett is over 20ft away, use XLR. Output level in Global Settings applies as mentioned above, but on XLR would be MIC or LINE.

Unless you're using a Stomp (no XLR, why the specific device matters), in which case the 1/4" outs are balanced. Use a short 1/4 to XLR adapter.

 

Why are you still promoting that 20ft advice?

[rd2rk]

10 minutes ago, Schmalle said:

Why are you still promoting that 20ft advice?

 

Because AFAIK it's true. It may not be a big deal, but still worth mentioning.

Also, if Balanced/Unbalanced matters, XLR cables are a lot cheaper than long TRS cables.

Why is it a problem for you?

[rd2rk]

And I'm not the only one who thinks so.

 

https://www.boxcast.com/blog/balanced-vs.-unbalanced-audio-whats-the-difference

[Schmalle]

4 minutes ago, rd2rk said:

Because AFAIK it's true. It may not be a big deal, but still worth mentioning.

Also, if Balanced/Unbalanced matters, XLR cables are a lot cheaper than long TRS cables.

Why is it a problem for you?

The advice should be: if possible use balanced connections.

Why?

• It offers the possibility of ground lift. Ground hum is the main cause of noise in audio applications.
• it greatly reduces susceptibility for noise induced by electromagnetic fields. Cable length isn't important, but proximity to noise source and relative orientation is.

Quote

Balanced/Unbalanced is irrelevent. That's all about signal to noise added over longer cable runs.

That's simply wrong. It's relevant, applies to short distances as well and enables ground lift.

[Schmalle]

9 minutes ago, rd2rk said:

And I'm not the only one who thinks so.

 

https://www.boxcast.com/blog/balanced-vs.-unbalanced-audio-whats-the-difference

 

Their conclusion is correct. They strongly and unconditionally advocate for balanced cables. Where do they state that it becomes relevant at 20ft or more?

Quote

In conclusion, we’re strong advocates of balanced audio cables. They’re less susceptible to noise and provide a more reliable signal that is stronger over long distances. If you find yourself in a situation that requires unbalanced audio cabling, make sure to cross them perpendicularly to any power cable they may encounter.

[ruperthawkes]

1 hour ago, rd2rk said:

Be helpful to know which Helix you're using.

If the 1/4" Output is set to LINE (Global Settings>Ins/Outs), use a LINE input on the Scarlett.

Conversely, if set to INST, use an INSTRUMENT level input on the Scarlett.

Unless the Scarlett is 20ft or more away, Balanced/Unbalanced is irrelevent. That's all about signal to noise added over longer cable runs.

If the Scarlett is over 20ft away, use XLR. Output level in Global Settings applies as mentioned above, but on XLR would be MIC or LINE.

Unless you're using a Stomp (no XLR, why the specific device matters), in which case the 1/4" outs are balanced. Use a short 1/4 to XLR adapter.

 

 

Thanks, it’s the Helix Rack and it’s about 1 metre away from Scarlett.  So cool you can change the output from line to instrument .   Think a balanced 1/4 “ to XLR sounds like the best option.  

[zappazapper]

19 minutes ago, Schmalle said:

If you find yourself in a situation that requires unbalanced audio cabling, make sure to cross them perpendicularly to any power cable they may encounter.

I helical wrap and tape all my unbalanced cables to any power cable I can find, because 60 cycle hum is my jam, bro...

[rd2rk]

RCA Cables
RCA Audio Cables are an unbalanced analog audio connection that sends stereo audio over a right channel (red tip) and left channel (white or black tip). Because they’re unbalanced, they typically don’t run over 25 feet.

 

--------------------------------------------------------

 

The distance I saw (long ago) was 20ft, but whatever.

I think we're talking about horses for courses.

Some devices have ground lift switches, some don't.

There are adapters to eliminate ground hum if it's an issue.

If you're sending a balanced signal to an unbalanced input, then what?

 

I'm not arguing against using balanced cables whenever possible, and wiring a professional studio is not the same as setting up a simple home recording rig.

If you have a problem, look for a solution.

 

OP did not specify if using Floor/Rack or Stomp.

 

In my "office" rig, my Stomp is connected to a cheap mixer's Line Inputs by simple 1/4" guitar cables. The mixer doesn't have balanced inputs, and the cable run is 6ft. All sorts of power cables and power supplies on the floor in close proximity to one another. Audio Out from computer for streaming apps also connected to the mixer. Nearby microwave and fluorescents. 3-way bookshelf amp/speakers. No ground hum issues. No problem looking for a solution.

 

In my "studio" setup, my Floor goes to the Scarlett via USB. It connects to my PC112+ via AES/EBU (L6 Link).

The Scarlett also takes a pair of inputs from the computer out for streaming apps. This introduced ground hum. A $20 Pyle PHE300 "Hum Destroyer" fixed that.

Solutions for problems. Horses for courses.

 

BUT, if it helps prevent a repeat of this discussion, I'll preface my advice in future by saying "Use balanced cables whenever possible".

THEN I'll give the simple explanation for WHY.

 

OK?

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Schmalle]

3 minutes ago, rd2rk said:

RCA Cables
RCA Audio Cables are an unbalanced analog audio connection that sends stereo audio over a right channel (red tip) and left channel (white or black tip). Because they’re unbalanced, they typically don’t run over 25 feet.

 

--------------------------------------------------------

 

The distance I saw (long ago) was 20ft, but whatever.

I think we're talking about horses for courses.

Some devices have ground lift switches, some don't.

There are adapters to eliminate ground hum if it's an issue.

If you're sending a balanced signal to an unbalanced input, then what?

 

I'm not arguing against using balanced cables whenever possible, and wiring a professional studio is not the same as setting up a simple home recording rig.

If you have a problem, look for a solution.

 

OP did not specify if using Floor/Rack or Stomp.

 

In my "office" rig, my Stomp is connected to a cheap mixer's Line Inputs by simple 1/4" guitar cables. The mixer doesn't have balanced inputs, and the cable run is 6ft. All sorts of power cables and power supplies on the floor in close proximity to one another. Audio Out from computer for streaming apps also connected to the mixer. Nearby microwave and fluorescents. 3-way bookshelf amp/speakers. No ground hum issues. No problem looking for a solution.

 

In my "studio" setup, my Floor goes to the Scarlett via USB. It connects to my PC112+ via AES/EBU (L6 Link).

The Scarlett also takes a pair of inputs from the computer out for streaming apps. This introduced ground hum. A $20 Pyle PHE300 "Hum Destroyer" fixed that.

Solutions for problems. Horses for courses.

 

BUT, if it helps prevent a repeat of this discussion, I'll preface my advice in future by saying "Use balanced cables whenever possible".

THEN I'll give the simple explanation for WHY.

 

OK?

Do whatever you think is correct. As for me, I greatly appreciate your contributions in this forum!

[rd2rk]

42 minutes ago, ruperthawkes said:

 

Thanks, it’s the Helix Rack and it’s about 1 metre away from Scarlett.  So cool you can change the output from line to instrument .   Think a balanced 1/4 “ to XLR sounds like the best option.  

 

From the Helix Rack manual: 

 

26.
1/4” OUT Use unbalanced 1/4" TS cables to connect to your guitar amp, FRFR speaker(s), studio monitors, or other playback system. When using a single amp or speaker, connect only the LEFT/MONO 1/4” jack.

 

You should be perfectly fine with short guitar cables.

[rd2rk]

3 minutes ago, Schmalle said:

Do whatever you think is correct. As for me, I greatly appreciate your contributions in this forum!

 

As do I yours. Informed discourse is always welcomed!