Can parameter settings on a block be "read" by an external MIDI controller?

[winterneuro]

I'm building a midi controller to use with my HX Stomp.  Ideally, I want to be able to change parameters within blocks using MIDI CC.

Is there a way that my controller can "read" the settings on parameters, so I can set some kind of visual representation on my midi controller?  Can I capture (and thus display) the current setting of a parameter on the midi controller if a valid CC exists?

 

For example, the rotary encoders are surrounded 270 degrees by led.  When I switch a parameter on the Stomp, I want the MIDI controller to capture parameter settings for any parameter that has a valid CC control in the preset, so I can then use that information and "display" the current setting on the Midi controller.  If the "Mix" is set at 50% in the preset's setting, can my controller read that so I can display 50% of the leds as illuminated?

 

Does the Stomp automatically send out this information over Midi Out any time a preset is selected?

If not, where might one find the code to "ask" the HX to send out the current parameter settings.

[rd2rk]

No, not designed for any of that.

[phil_m]

That would require MIDI Sysex, and Line 6 didn’t go down that road with any of the HX/Helix stuff.

[winterneuro]

Thank you for knowing what I meant, and answering my question.

[winterneuro]

Could it be done via USB like HX Edit does? 

Theoretically, is there enough source code available (yeah, right) where someone could theoretically write their own windows, mac, linux software interface?

[SaschaFranck]

4 hours ago, phil_m said:

That would require MIDI Sysex,

 

SysEx isn't exactly required, it would only require two way communication. Could as well be done with plain CCs.

 

Anyhow, these days, usually such things are done via some sort of machine control protocol. Such as with DAW controllers, which operate both ways as well.

And yes, IMO it would be fantastic if the Helix offered something like that. But it doesn't - and never will. People rather prefer to bug Line 6 for yet another amp model.

[DunedinDragon]

5 hours ago, winterneuro said:

Could it be done via USB like HX Edit does? 

Theoretically, is there enough source code available (yeah, right) where someone could theoretically write their own windows, mac, linux software interface?

There is no source code available nor documentation for the protocol used by HX Edit to write your own version of HX Edit on another platform.  I'm not even sure there's any type of reactive monitoring capabilities in the HX Edit protocol as it's more of a simple terminal program and that's why the signal meter could only be implemented in the Helix unit itself and not in HX Edit.

[phil_m]

5 hours ago, SaschaFranck said:

 

SysEx isn't exactly required, it would only require two way communication. Could as well be done with plain CCs.

 

Anyhow, these days, usually such things are done via some sort of machine control protocol. Such as with DAW controllers, which operate both ways as well.

And yes, IMO it would be fantastic if the Helix offered something like that. But it doesn't - and never will. People rather prefer to bug Line 6 for yet another amp model.

Well, I don’t think MIDI CCs would be a viable solution, as there are way more potential parameters than there are available CC messages. CCs would work for a simple MIDI controller feedback where you’re only controlling certain things, but it wouldn’t be a way to reverse engineer an editor.

[winterneuro]

5 hours ago, DunedinDragon said:

There is no source code available nor documentation for the protocol used by HX Edit to write your own version of HX Edit on another platform.  I'm not even sure there's any type of reactive monitoring capabilities in the HX Edit protocol as it's more of a simple terminal program and that's why the signal meter could only be implemented in the Helix unit itself and not in HX Edit.

 

There is some kind of "reactive monitoring" because if you change a setting on the Stomp itself using a knob, while HX Edit is active, you'll see the parameter change in HX Edit.

[Anderton]

FWIW - this doesn't help you now, but in the future, this kind of thing should be commonplace. MIDI 2.0 changes MIDI from a monolog into a dialog through a protocol called "MIDI Capability Inquiry." For example, a DAW could query an outboard device a) whether it speaks MIDI 2.0, and b) if it does, ask for a list of parameters and put them onscreen. This basically eliminates the need for editor/librarians. I've seen some of this in development, where a DAW received synth parameters and put them on-screen, then tied them to a hardware controller (which if MIDI 2.0, can let the DAW know what it is, and configure itself accordingly).

 

This won't be common for a while, but the kind of functionality the OP is asking for has been ratified in the MIDI 2.0 spec. Of course, it's up to manufacturers whether they implement that aspect of the spec, but the sense I get is that manufacturers see this as something worth implementing.

[DunedinDragon]

2 hours ago, winterneuro said:

 

There is some kind of "reactive monitoring" because if you change a setting on the Stomp itself using a knob, while HX Edit is active, you'll see the parameter change in HX Edit.

By reactive monitoring I'm talking about an ongoing data feed or instrument feed.  The protocol is clearly two-way, but  I haven't seen anything that would send ongoing data without some direct interaction either on the unit or on HX Edit.  Thus the implementation of the signal meter...

[SaschaFranck]

4 hours ago, phil_m said:

Well, I don’t think MIDI CCs would be a viable solution,

 

If you could get away with not *that* many parameters, things could be fine, though. I've actually built something like that *way* back in Logic, using a Behringer BCR2000 and had to stick to plain CCs. Was quite some hassle but doable.

 

However, unless the Helix would get a huge oberhaul, things will be pretty much spoiled anyway as long as CCs are involved and you're using snapshots as well, simply because internally, the Helix is using the same protocol for both. In other words: Once you control a parameter via MIDI, it'll automatically be snapshot-controlled, too. Which, sorry to say so, is incredibly stupid as both things could very well serve fundamentally different purposes.

[SaschaFranck]

13 hours ago, winterneuro said:

Theoretically, is there enough source code available (yeah, right) where someone could theoretically write their own windows, mac, linux software interface

 

That'd be fantastic as we might finally as well see a mobile OS editor, but unfortunately there doesn't seem to be sufficient source code available for such endeavours (otherwise someone surely would've taken the chance already).