helix native in cubase 12

[MauroDave]

Good morning, I recently activated Helix Native on my Windows 10 PC paired with Cubase 12 Artist.
I followed all the correct steps but once in the DAW, I add audio track, I hear my guitar directly into the sound card without any effect.

I insert helix native into Cubase, in fact the editor opens and there don't seem to be any problems, but by inserting complex rigs or effects, or amplifiers, speakers, anything, the guitar continues to be devoid of any effects
solutions? what am I doing wrong?

thanks for the help
 

[silverhead]

Try turning ON the DAW's Input Monitoring feature.

[MauroDave]

On 10/14/2023 at 6:15 PM, silverhead said:

Try turning ON the DAW's Input Monitoring feature.

Where is this botton ? Can you give me a screenshot?

 

I downloaded helix native with the vst3 plugins, is that correct or did you have to do the 2?
I have an ik multimedia ax i/o sound card, is it a sound card problem?

[silverhead]

I don’t use your Cubase DAW also I can’t give you exact details. This feature is usually in the Track view when you arm a track for recording. Look closely there. You may also have to actually arm the track for recording, but you don’t have to record.

 

You should be able to use VST3. It is not likely a sound card problem.

[MauroDave]

On 10/14/2023 at 8:06 PM, silverhead said:

I don’t use your Cubase DAW also I can’t give you exact details. This feature is usually in the Track view when you arm a track for recording. Look closely there. You may also have to actually arm the track for recording, but you don’t have to record.

 

You should be able to use VST3. It is not likely a sound card problem.

another user advised me to remove direct monitoring from the sound card control panel, isn't that the opposite of what you say? my goddd

[silverhead]

Depends on what you’re doing. Generally speaking the other user’s suggestion is correct. When recording the sound of your guitar you want Input monitoring off. 
 

But my understanding of what you are doing is that you are not recording the sound of your guitar as it enters Cubase. You want to hear the sound of your guitar, while you are playing, AFTER it is processed by Helix Native within Cubase. I don’t know if you are recording at all - seems to me you are just listening but want to hear the affected, not dry, tone. Input monitoring may provide that.

 

But as I mentioned before you may need to arm the track for recording even though you won’t actually record. In that case you can probably leave input monitoring off.

 

In any case you may notice some latency - a time lag between when you pluck your guitar string and when you hear the processed sound. This is because Helix Native needs a few milliseconds to process the incoming signal in real time.

[MauroDave]

On 10/14/2023 at 10:06 PM, silverhead said:

Depends on what you’re doing. Generally speaking the other user’s suggestion is correct. When recording the sound of your guitar you want Input monitoring off. 
 

But my understanding of what you are doing is that you are not recording the sound of your guitar as it enters Cubase. You want to hear the sound of your guitar, while you are playing, AFTER it is processed by Helix Native within Cubase. I don’t know if you are recording at all - seems to me you are just listening but want to hear the affected, not dry, tone. Input monitoring may provide that.

 

But as I mentioned before you may need to arm the track for recording even though you won’t actually record. In that case you can probably leave input monitoring off.

 

In any case you may notice some latency - a time lag between when you pluck your guitar string and when you hear the processed sound. This is because Helix Native needs a few milliseconds to process the incoming signal in real time.

correct, I want to hear my guitar in real time with the sound processed by the helix effects...I just don't know where the input monitoring is in Cubase...I shouldn't have latency, but I had it with amplitube and I have a high-performance sound card and PC

[MauroDave]

I think it's just a settings problem, I think all the programs are installed and inserted correctly

[jpspoons]

I think you're saying you can hear the guitar, but just to check, I would go through the following steps:

 

First up I would hit F4 (Audio Connections) and check that

1. your audio interface guitar input is mapped to an input channel in Cubase - it should look something like this, post yours if you're not sure:

 

2. Your outputs need to be mapped as well or you'll get no sound output:

 

 

Next, when you set up the guitar track, make sure it's mapped to that Mono input - I would personally create a stereo track though, it sounds counterintuitive but go with me on this one!

 

 

See the input and output mappings under the grey "no track preset" box above. 

 

Then - you need that speaker icon to be coloured in not greyed out - that's the button to arm the track as mentioned by @silverhead. 

 

If you're hearing the dry guitar but Native is doing nothing, that's another matter :D

[MauroDave]

On 10/15/2023 at 12:50 AM, jpspoons said:

I think you're saying you can hear the guitar, but just to check, I would go through the following steps:

 

First up I would hit F4 (Audio Connections) and check that

1. your audio interface guitar input is mapped to an input channel in Cubase - it should look something like this, post yours if you're not sure:

 

2. Your outputs need to be mapped as well or you'll get no sound output:

 

 

Next, when you set up the guitar track, make sure it's mapped to that Mono input - I would personally create a stereo track though, it sounds counterintuitive but go with me on this one!

 

 

See the input and output mappings under the grey "no track preset" box above. 

 

Then - you need that speaker icon to be coloured in not greyed out - that's the button to arm the track as mentioned by @silverhead. 

 

If you're hearing the dry guitar but Native is doing nothing, that's another matter :D

thanks for the help, the initial input and output settings seem to be correct, while I never noticed the icon to arm the track, maybe just activate that?
I repeat that the problem is that, I insert native but even by putting effects in the rig the guitar remains clean and straight

[jpspoons]

With Helix in the inserts it should look something like this - the track is armed (it's called Monitor when you hover over it), and you should be seeing the signal coming through on the meters (circled) when you play the guitar. Any other buttons lit or different colours *might* mean you're bypassing Native which would mean you're getting the dry signal.

 

One thing worth trying *just in case* is to use one of the Native presets, as the effects are already loaded. I can't remember exactly what it is but I'm sure there's some inconsistency between the ways that the Helix unit, HX Edit and HX Native differentiate between blocks that are on and off, so there's a tiny possibility that if you build the patch yourself, all of the blocks are off / bypassed.

 

One final check is the Mixer (hit F3) - you should be seeing something like this, with the blue circle on Insert meaning Native is live, and the three meters meaning that you're getting signal through the input, guitar track and output channel respectively.

 

 

If none of this works post some screenshots. I'm about to sleep but I'll look out for messages tomorrow. Cubase is fiddly but it's worth persevering with - I've had it for a long time, and I still have nights (especially when alcohol is involved) when I screw something up and get no audio at all for the first 15 minutes of any session.

 

Good luck!

[jpspoons]

On 10/15/2023 at 12:01 AM, MauroDave said:

while I never noticed the icon to arm the track, maybe just activate that?

If the track isn't armed then you wouldn't hear even the dry track through Cubase - but you possibly would in the audio interace if you're direct monitoring? Depends on the hardware. Seeing the meters is a good visual check that Cubase is getting signal to the input, guitar track and output.

 

I'm wondering now whether you're just hearing the guitar directly through the interface without Cubase / Native joining in, but I don't know the hardware to be able to comment. A good test might be to turn the track Monitor button OFF (greyed out) if it's on... the dry guitar should cut out (and the meters will disappear accordingly) so if you can still hear it, you're getting it through the audio interface direct without Cubase processing it.

 

 

[MauroDave]

On 10/15/2023 at 1:14 AM, jpspoons said:

If the track isn't armed then you wouldn't hear even the dry track through Cubase - but you possibly would in the audio interace if you're direct monitoring? Depends on the hardware. Seeing the meters is a good visual check that Cubase is getting signal to the input, guitar track and output.

 

I'm wondering now whether you're just hearing the guitar directly through the interface without Cubase / Native joining in, but I don't know the hardware to be able to comment. A good test might be to turn the track Monitor button OFF (greyed out) if it's on... the dry guitar should cut out (and the meters will disappear accordingly) so if you can still hear it, you're getting it through the audio interface direct without Cubase processing it.

 

 

ok friend thanks for the help now it works, it was enough to simply activate the monitoring on the track, the speaker image and everything works...
the only problem now is that the audio sucks, it's noisy, it crackles, as if it were a problem with the sound card or the power and capacity of the PC....
on amplitube everything is perfect, much cleaner and quieter, perhaps because it's all from the same amplitube family and sound card....maybe I should use another sound card?

[MauroDave]

Maybe 2.80 ghz is it too little?for pc windows ....i have 16 gb of ram....

[silverhead]

I think your equipment is fine. I suspect the settings on the Helix Native preset are causing the noise. Try using the Factory 1 setlist with preset 1A as shown in the screenshot above. Try lowering the input level. If the noise is still occurring try turning off all the processing blocks and then turn them back on one at a time until you find the culprit and lower the levels there. 
 

If it’s not the preset it may be the audio settings in Cubase. Hopefully @jpspoons will return and help with specifics since he uses the same DAW. His help so far has been excellent.

[jpspoons]

On 10/15/2023 at 12:48 PM, silverhead said:

Try lowering the input level.

Definitely try this - it took me a long time to realise there even *was* an input level in Native. You can see the slider for it on the Native screenshot above, try lowering it, especially if the meter next to it is maxing out. 

 

If you keep native on the track but bypass it, does it still sound bad?

 

The only other suggestion I would make is to increase your buffer size if you've brought it right down to reduce latency. 

[MauroDave]

On 10/15/2023 at 1:48 PM, silverhead said:

I think your equipment is fine. I suspect the settings on the Helix Native preset are causing the noise. Try using the Factory 1 setlist with preset 1A as shown in the screenshot above. Try lowering the input level. If the noise is still occurring try turning off all the processing blocks and then turn them back on one at a time until you find the culprit and lower the levels there. 
 

If it’s not the preset it may be the audio settings in Cubase. Hopefully @jpspoons will return and help with specifics since he uses the same DAW. His help so far has been excellent.

Tonight I'll send you some screenshots of the settings...
It's not the fault of the preset, I defined it as noise or a bad sound but it's as if the PC was struggling to process the sound...it really sucks, while when I use amplitube I have professional quality and definition..
I'm always afraid that since it's the same PC, maybe the amplitube and everything else will conflict XD

[MauroDave]

any error in settings or screen you need to see jpspoons?

[MauroDave]

[jpspoons]

@MauroDave Picture #4 could you click on the Panello di Controllo to see the buffer settings?

[jpspoons]

After that it would be good to see your equivalent of my picture #5 with signal going through

[MauroDave]

On 10/15/2023 at 6:38 PM, jpspoons said:

@MauroDave Picture #4 could you click on the Panello di Controllo to see the buffer settings?

with a low buffer size I heard a horrifying sound, with the buffer at 512 I hear the correct sound and to my great surprise I have no latency problems, I don't know how this is possible. now the sound is decent and I have to manage the various volumes between input, track recorded with monitoring and output.....at least I can do something...I even recorded but inexplicably then it won't let me listen to the recorded track if I press play ! How crazy is Cubase????

[MauroDave]

now after a couple of hours of use I lose the connection with the sound card, apart from Cubase, I can't even hear YouTube for example.... maybe the PC or sound card is too tired after 2 hours of use?

yet another problem...

[MauroDave]

I have two tracks, a backing track and my recording... I press play and I only hear the backing track although there is the recorded track with also the drawing of the sound wave so there is something... I have no words

[jpspoons]

On 10/15/2023 at 6:41 PM, MauroDave said:

with the buffer at 512 I hear the correct sound and to my great surprise I have no latency problems

That's great news @MauroDave! In your picture #4 the latency is 13ms - is that before or after you increased the buffer size? No latency and no buffering is real progress though, your hardware is obviously more than good enough.

 

On 10/15/2023 at 6:41 PM, MauroDave said:

I even recorded but inexplicably then it won't let me listen to the recorded track if I press play

 Can you post an updated version of your picture #3, after you made the recording? Actually I've just read your later post, ignore this for now.

 

On 10/15/2023 at 6:46 PM, MauroDave said:

I lose the connection with the sound card, apart from Cubase, I can't even hear YouTube for example.

This is actually an option. You can choose to let Cubase retain control of the soundcard (which means no other applications can access it), or you can choose for Cubase to release the soundcard when other applications need it. On your picture #4, go to the Sistema Audio option and you'll see an option like this:

 

[jpspoons]

On 10/15/2023 at 6:50 PM, MauroDave said:

I have two tracks, a backing track and my recording... I press play and I only hear the backing track although there is the recorded track with also the drawing of the sound wave so there is something... I have no words

OK @MauroDave, I think we're nearly there, fingers crossed!

 

I suspect / hope that you still have the track armed for monitoring - Cubase will either allow you to hear back your recorded sound on that track, or the "live" guitar sound. If you turn off the monitor (speaker symbol), hopefully you can hear the recorded sound?

 

If that works then there's an almost secret option called (in English obviously) Tape Machine Style which I think should be the default option. From the online manual, it "Activates input monitoring in stop mode and during recording, but not during playback." (see Auto Monitoring section on this page) VST (steinberg.help)

 

In other words you don't have to remember to switch monitor on and off for each track, it will do it automatically for you. Set it once and forget.

 

If that sounds useful, go to Edit / Preferences and then the VST section near the bottom of the page, and choose Tapemachine style from the Auto Monitoring options:

[MauroDave]

On 10/15/2023 at 8:23 PM, jpspoons said:

That's great news @MauroDave! In your picture #4 the latency is 13ms - is that before or after you increased the buffer size? No latency and no buffering is real progress though, your hardware is obviously more than good enough.

-ok yes I confirm: 13 ms of latency with 512 of buffering
if I lower the buffering (256,128,64) I start to hear problems in the sound as if the PC was struggling, like a "ruined" sound
usually everyone tells me that with high buffering there is latency, fortunately there are no problems or I was ruined haha
- on the issue of not hearing the audio track now I'm devastated, tomorrow I'll follow your advice and tell you, but this is not a worrying problem, it's Cubase which is made for aerospace engineers
- the issue that worries me the most is losing the sound card, it's as if it were disconnected and I no longer hear anything either in Cubase or outside of Cubase (youtube for example, or music in general) and I have no way of fixing it, I have to turn off the card audio, turn it back on and everything is fine again.
So is it a problem of open windows? Cubase, Internet etc?
I had opened them before and it did so after a couple of hours of work...are you sure it's not a problem with the tired PC or sound card? It happened to me a few times even with amplitube, rare, and always after prolonged use....

[MauroDave]

I'm just a guitarist who wants to have his own backing track and record over his parts (pink floyd 95% of cases XD)
I'm not an aerospace engineer for Cubase!
I took it only because I brought amplitube to the maximum possible level and now I wanted to see where I got with helix native, which however needs the DAW to work (in amplitube it's all in one, how convenient it was for us lazy and simple people XD)
so I took the Cubase + native offer, I didn't think it was such hell haha

however at the moment at least I can hear my guitar with all the complex native rig.... it's a valid sound but still not perfect like in amplitube, it's certainly a question of adjusting the input, instrument track and output volumes because moving those parameters change a lot....

[jpspoons]

I'm pleased the buffer / latency trade-off is working ok.

 

Aerospace engineers, ha! Yes it can feel like that, it's a good idea to take notes of anything you have to change so that you have a reference e.g. for installation onto a new PC.

I'm hopeful though that your track is still armed for monitoring (or recording) - make sure the monitoring is off, and record-enable is off as well, if that works then you can switch the VST settings and not have to worry about it again.

 

The sound card issue... I try to keep my main recording PC just for recording as far as possible, so I always have the "Release Driver..." option off. It's annoying sometimes but I prefer to exit Cubase if I want to use another application that uses sound. I can't answer with any confidence as it sounds like it might be to do with the Axe IO, but it might be worth switching that option off if it's on. I'm wondering whether switching back and forward between different sound sources is working the driver hard and making it less stable... that's total speculation though. It might be worth checking for any known issues on the IK / Axe specific sites for that one.

 

I think you're nearly there on the HX Native and Cubase side though, keep going :-)

[datacommando]

On 10/15/2023 at 9:29 PM, jpspoons said:

I think you're nearly there on the HX Native and Cubase side though, keep going :-)

Above and beyond the call of duty, Sir!

 

Excellent.

[jpspoons]

Thanks @datacommando, appreciated. I've had so much help from forums, this one included, so it's nice to be able to help someone else and pay it forward.

 

And Cubase is great once your setup is optimised and you know your way around it, but the learning curve can be steep. I remember well the days of feeling like a passenger being talked through an emergency landing by someone in the control tower ;-)

[MauroDave]

On 10/16/2023 at 11:47 AM, jpspoons said:

Thanks @datacommando, appreciated. I've had so much help from forums, this one included, so it's nice to be able to help someone else and pay it forward.

 

And Cubase is great once your setup is optimised and you know your way around it, but the learning curve can be steep. I remember well the days of feeling like a passenger being talked through an emergency landing by someone in the control tower ;-)

I confirm, the help on the forums including yours is much more reliable and timely than the official support tickets....

and to think that before every purchase I watch dozens of tutorials on YouTube and read the manuals....yet without this topic I was still in the shi*

Anyway I wanted to go step by step...
I started from amplitube...then I saw that many professionals use helix and I wanted to try my hand at that....
I wonder if I should stop or go to fractal haha
however the final news is that for better or worse everything I need now works... but like years ago with my first helix lt, with the line 6 systems I hear a sound that doesn't convince me... it's not as clear and defined as It happens to me in amplitube... I also don't understand why there are so many professionals who use it with notable audio samples....
Maybe I'll understand what I'm doing wrong in a week when a super expert colleague on Helix comes and sets up the tent in my studio until we get to the bottom of it

 

thanksss

[jpspoons]

@MauroDave I'm glad you've got Cubase and Native working from a tech point of view at least.

 

I'm not a super expert colleague on Helix (and I don't have a tent) but I do have a couple of suggestions around tone.

1. If you haven't already, check out Line 6 CustomTone and download a few tones for the genre(s) of music you like... getting other users' presets e.g. for specific songs might help as a jumping off point for your own tone creation.
2. Since Native uses the same engine as Helix, I would post any "how do I" questions in the Helix forum rather than this one; a lot more people hang out there.
3. Similarly, even more people hang out in this Facebook group. For better or for worse, if you post there saying "Why are my Helix tones not as good as my Amplitube tones" you will probably get more opinions than you need! (3) Line 6 Helix Family User Group OFFICIAL and ORIGINAL | Facebook

Good luck with the rest of your journey :-)