markwesse

I know exactly what you are saying. When the beer is spilling and min spl >92db, it doesnt matter but where there is dark and light shades, suddenly its a real issue. I use an old alesis sustain foot pedal for anything timing critical anyway...especially looping as it has a very short throw and being so close to the ground, just feels right as opposed to any switch that is mounted up. What I am doing is a hack, just drilling a mono 6.5mm socket and jumpering the wires from the tap switch. That way you can use either and its very easy to do (get a tech to do it if you feel its too much). The simplest way WOULD have been to allow selection of the type of input for exp2 (like most other foot controllers I have used). ie select switch/continuous, type active/sleeve active. Then you could assign it to anything. Even if you simply wired a resistor into the FS for exp 2 and then assigned that but I dont think HD allows exp as a tap tempo controller. These are really good action, small and light and great ergonomics for timing critical applications; once you use one (or something in that format), it really shows the difference...even if the onboard FS wasnt noisy, this is light years better.

Its frustrating when it could all be in 1 box (easily dsp wise)...I would love all the modules to be like amp packs where you just buy a plain vanilla HD floor board and purchase the bits you really want; ie upgraded looper in lieu of other stuff...no problem. The footswitches all generic with scribble strips like the helix. Anyway...

Not meaning to cross post but no sign of life over at POD/HD forum...this is more of a general question...if anyone knows? eg Gearbox, Pod/HD etc Cheers

HD500 is discontinued...I was just comparing apples for apples when both were current.

The line 6 i/o is one of the (much) better ones out there...we have AB'd plenty in the studio and its right up there...good input impedance, great noise floor...nice flavour and playable latency even on slow machines (line 6 tone direct). Might be worth (with much respect) learning to work with what you have got...I dont have a working usb out on my HD500 but if its anything like eg the DI Gold, then there should be an unprocessed send which is sweet and very clean to the DAW. Use that to route into your DAW via the plugins to get your other fx chain components tested and happening. If you are worried about tweaking your mouse to control volume; use a keyboard shortcuts on the media pad or arrow up/down for vol + - via midi translator (couple of bucks), or just use the master out on the HD or have a 'controller' patch on the HD that lets you use the foot pedal to control the master output (assuming it is allowable) when you are in 'mix' or 'master' mode. We have it so easy now, to be honest...if we cant make great recordings with the HD...stock...then gear has become an excuse. Not trying to flame...just being honest. We have it so easy...ie NS10s suck; I have a set and they are unused, they are awful...BUT a lot of great tracks have been mixed on them because people learnt to use them ie know what stuff was meant to sound like. Make do with what you have...concentrate on real music...expressing and playing with people...thats the magic...and then you have learnt a golden rule. Peace Edit: If you want a groovy controller for your DAW, you can get a KORE controller. Heaps of switches and knobs for less than $50 second hand and the v1 also has a high quality IO built in. The editor for it lets you do really cool things like eg have a switch cycle through controller values or program changes with upper and lower limits blah blah...very well designed.

Grig 4 Pro is now discontinued but it was a controller and software. The floorboard has a great quality interface integrated into it and runs directly with grig ie dedicated. I bought the tablet separately from Target. Interesting thing is that the Krauts got it right...the only floorboard I have seen with tie offs/strain relief :-) Even integrated them as a stand off when standing the unit on its back edge to protect the knobs...great industrial design and its a tough very light unit out of aluminium extrusion. The HD500 I have had the usb ripped clean out of it (by the previous owner): not even a design thought about road proofing those connections. Looper is excellent...super simple but flexible and super adequate. Im actually trying to setup up the hd usb to go into the tablet and just use the looper but of course, the HD doesnt transmit any midi down USB it seems; tab only has 1 usb in :-(

Hi Joel...It is exactly the same in application...but comes with a controller board with a brilliant io + standalone executable. Plugin is an option but I dont use it. You Just add a windows tablet, that is all, and over here (Australia) works out about the same price as the release price of the hd. ie Cost me AU$750 to setup vs 799 for HD500. Guitar Rig Pro 4 with controller was 349 + 300 for windows tablet. Latency is about 8ms but more than playable (would be interesting to check the latency of the HD hardware) As mentioned, I migrated it to a small mini/industrial pc so I could run softsynths as well via triple play. When they have milked the hardware solution and release the HD as software, as was the case with gearbox, Ill be very happy to go back to the same setup. I only have the HD for the HD models if you know what I mean. Cheers

Hi All When using some well written usb io, they allow multi client use eg Grig Kontrol allows multiple softsynths etc to connect and go out via its stereo out. Does the line 6 usb driver operate the same? Im wanting to run a copy of the HD500 out into looping software + softsynths etc and back out...this would require 2 progs to client the io without using a host...which I dont want to do if possible. Cheers Mark

Would be great if there was (possibly) some way that a product milestone was reached and then they would allow a 'features' access. What I mean is, there is a certain point where the unit is no longer for sale, so to speak, and, like the FCB1010, aftermarket hardware guys take all the extra features that were never implemented and actually implement them. ie Ossandust, I think he is in Belgium, makes a 'stomp box' eprom for the FCB (downloadable for free). On top of that, I paid a couple of bucks and he added a number of extra midi controllers etc and I just plugged it in and away it went. I know there is a whole minefield of IP but repurposing/3rd party features would be cool. I would pay $100 extra for a decent looper eprom no problem at all. I beg to differ about tone quality...in a PA live setting...I have had PODs since the orig as well as IK, NI Grig, blah blah. I put a blind test up for the eg the twang/fender model and majority people chose GRig over POD but there was a much closer gap between Grig and HD; Grig still won. Try it yourself with a reamp and field it to normal people (ie listeners) who dont have a cultural pre disposition. What Im saying is...with great pups, cables, electronics, the tonal response is not blindingly better (speaking clean models only here). Still love the Line 6 stuff...pity there is NO midi support over USB (HD Floorboards)...thats a whole other issue ;-)

The Soldano model (used in the 'hot solo' rig) is better in Grig5 IMHO but is should translate ok...Its smoother and seems to be more responsive...although I have to say that the mesa model by Line 6 smokes GRig. Like I said...they each have their own strengths. The tube screamer in both applications is very similar...you should have no prob for a like for like port to HD...except for input gain fiddling. What pups are you using?

Thanks rd2rk...the midi is very straightforward but the looper block needed a hack..didnt think about turning the volume of the looper off...cool!

Hmmm...thats not taking into account the definition of design...ie best compromise; you never get your cake and eat it too. With respect...they both do things the other one cant. Ive only been using the HD for a little while, killer tone, flexibility not...absolutely basic things missing. ie Looper...grig is a totally useable looping tool...hd..missing the most basic addressable parameters IMHO. Have you really used grig in depth and AB the 2? At this stage, its looking like going back to my old rig with gearbox and grig but everyones application is different. There isnt even a machine state address in HD...ie its either on or off for modules (basically) which is ok if you are stuck in the old school stomp paradigm. Pretty frustrating when you have been allowed switch inversion, parameter states. Ill keep trying for a little while yet though. All the best with it riccardob80

Im wanting to make use of the looper switches...is there anyway to disable or remove the looper block but keep the switches? Some wierd back door rom option? Anything? The reason why is I want to replace the fcb1010 and integrate the HD500 into my current rig (check here and it might make more sense) http://line6.com/support/topic/21183-pod-hd-support-still-going-or-done/?p=160952 Cheers Mark

hurghanico you are on the money! Some time to set up is an understatement though ;-) Would be so cool if things were modular. This is my current rig...seeking to somehow lever a hd500 into it because the tone is so good...thats why the wiring is messy but the idea is to be modular. Originally there was a foam lined pocket that I slid my laptop into before the ind. pc but was a hassle having a 15inch touchscreen competing with stage light if you know what I mean. I use a custom programmed eprom (thanks ossandust) for an old FCB1010 which then goes into an industrial PC (but you could plug a standard NUC or mini pc depending on requirements). The midi signals are translated through a behaviour management code (ie double clicks/long clicks etc) which control Ableton live, GRig and softsynths/24 tracks x 8 scenes (instruments grouped into 4 tracks each eg guitar/perc/synth/midiperc/vox/fx etc). I did submit a rave on behaviours to one of the line 6 guys a number of years ago and its interesting to see some of it is on the helix...must have been a lot of us banging on about it. The midi comes from a triple play on my guitar (and a small keyboard depending on which rig I use). The UR44 is also used as IO because its extremely clean and links to a framed percussion rig (only used sometimes depending on where we are playing) and use it for live looping etc This is all housed in a 3mm laser cut stainless shell...what Im trying to get across here, is maybe be able to use a generic mini pc, modular hardware pieces that could link it and be used to create a personal super rig depending on the users requirements. BTW the fcb clips into the top 2 slots and the velcro anchors it down...it doesnt move at all and can lift the whole rig. The old fender pedal (pulled apart in these pics) is used as a rotary encoder and the switch for sustain...just refitting with a really robust industrial optical rather than the flimsy quadrature but the optical is refusing to work with the livid control board. In case you are wondering how I see/use it live, I have a small tablet in heavy duty case with remote software to see the desktop...it just mounts on the mic stand with a tab mount. This is where the VST software like the new VIP control would make it a snap...standardised interface would be brilliant. For the sake of helping to clarify...here are some pics (sorry about quality...my old phone!)...stripped down and complete is the last pic.

hurghanico is spot on (as usual :-)but anything outside of doing basic patching becomes very difficult very quickly...unfortunately...the tone of the HD amps...amazing but dont expect anything like the fx flexibility...eg there are a min of 3 easy to use gain boost modules in GRig to match gain into amps, there are none on the HD...best case is hack use of the tube comp BUT you have to be careful of how you set up your inputs...thanks hurghanico for all yours (and others) excellent advice. On Grig you are simply assigning inputs and each click auto adjusts the gain before you start. You wont get the rich harmonics out of clean HD amps without getting this bit exactly right. HTH

Wow that is a downer...so many good things...and some things just inexcusable...sorry, Im no dsp coder but modulating volume on the looper...waste of time without it, and the low pass would have been really useful...very simple things but massive usability increase. Thanks for the inf.

Does anyone know if the looper was improved? ie Can the looper be used stereo? Can the volume or filters be addressed now with expression pedals? What are the diffs? Many thanks.

Hi Guys Yeah, I wished the looper was left out rather than half baked...at the very least I thought it would be stereo; had I known I would not have bothered buying it...only needed a simple one but having a great rig sound squished to 1 channel; not the chop and and really bad for any chorusing. For the clean stuff unfortunately I think Ill go back to grig except I really dont like the lappy live...I was using gearbox on my w8 tablet which is brilliant (Im sure the DI must be doing some dsp or the algos are not very demanding) EXCEPT one of the most important features missing is that you cant program change presets...hmm...round and round the hill...I just wanted a simple setup and now back to laptop live...I would prefer hardware but anyway; one day. I still prefer the tones from my original floor pod plus..was so easy for a good sound: live only though. Sorry about off topic but I spent nearly 2 hours reading about split input paths, gain structures blah blah, tweak and AB for an hour and still havent got the level of sound that 20mins teaking on the floor pod gives. Dont mean to be negative but it really is disappointing. I've given enough money to Line 6...over and out. #Iknowathingortwo I dont think its unreasonable to have a functioning looper...or just do none at all; otherwise is just a sales gimmick...a reduction of cred being applicable...no reason to have half baked and ususeable. I have guitar rig as well, many years old now and its looper is excellent, has been from day 1 and exactly apt for a guitar multifix. Its models dont have the excellence of the high gain of L6 but everything else smacks the HD down...and Im only talking basics here as of course there is a lot more flexiblity in software. All the best guys Mark EDIT: Actually, after having a real good play, I cannot believe that there is no possibility of control for the looper (volume or filter). I can live with the mono, but NOT being able to control the volume, even for basic looper, totally inexcusable. For the sake of code to link a predefined sub from the pedal to the looper module...I love the tone work L6 does but seriously...really really bad.

Toggle is just a definition of what you do with the controller. Its common eg for multi level toggle ie 3 state toggle to step through 0, 64,127. Some earlier midi only implementations I have seen only use a max value of 64 for sustain (ensoniq, not sure why). GRig Kontrol allows cycling of program changes and CC toggles with min and max ranges. HD Edit allows a toggle to have arbitrary values thats for sure. My usb is damaged and am trying to get that fixed (bought it that way) so it would find it weird if using the edit didnt exactly send out the programmed value but cant check as yet. IF the FS does indeed send arbitrary values you could use a loop cable and Set FSn to output CC 001 with values eg 33, 105 and it would provide a range to the EXP2 The looper doesnt use multi state buttons but it uses the paradigm; 060 0-63 = Overdub, 64-127 = Record Looper Record/Overdub Switch Not sure why Line6 would not have used something as simple as that but Im sure there is a reason. Im also not sure why they have never implemented behaviours on ANY of their pedal boards. I have used this and its the only real way to get efficient easy to remember operation. eg Single click/ Double click. Single click is the positive operation and double is the negative. eg on the looper, a single click is record, double click is undo and so on. 3 state is single cycle eg LED off, Led flashing, led on solid which is handy. There is a lot more but no doubt they arent interested and will not help anyone here...its just that control is more than emulating an ol school pedal board.

Why does HD Edit allow different values for CC toggle min max eg 45 for Off, 127 for on?

I might try a midi loop back cable...that might actually work.

Yeah...that eventuated with a lot of mucking around. I was going to use 1 amp model per bank (only use 3 ie clean, crunch, highgain) but I guess I can reserver patch D for looping. Didnt know about the tuner wiping the looper though...thanks for the heads up. Great forum...plenty of helpful answers

Yeah...was just an abstract...the main point to illustrate here is a footswitch controlling a range parameter. Its really handy and have been using it for so long because it most instances eg rev I dont want to completely switch it off...just vary the state without using a pedal which is cumbersome. HTH Cheers

Hehe...the whole idea was to simplify; a switch is a lot different to another pedal. I lived with a world full of pedals...then ran everything inside an industrial mini pc/fcb1010 with about 1 months worth of behaviour programming eg double clicks/long holds in software...super flexible but spent more time thinking about what I was doing than just expressing eg left brain. I gk cable, 2 boards and 2 output cables is where I wanted to go. The drill/socket is no big deal; picked up the hd in pretty rough condition...small hacks are fine if done with the right tools, step drill or chassis punch ;-) Cheers

Only problem is that whenever you set a wide stereo effect eg reverb in the split, it returns mono from the stereo effect to the looper ie only recording a mono of the reverb'd signal. Not a great outcome. Guess I will have to make a dry loop preset in every bank, play the live mic stuff and then cut over to the guitar preset...maybe. Its really wierd because playing the guitar through the verb is full stereo...its only the loop that goes mono