Try an EQ Plug-In Before Helix Native

[soundog]

While there are plenty of good EQ blocks within Helix Native, I'm getting some excellent results by placing a third-party EQ plug-in before Helix Native. Its especially nice for rolling off some lows and highs, and gently boosting some low and/or high mids on your raw guitar track before Helix starts chewing on it — getting it sounding as good as you can first without Helix enabled. (I'm especially fond of using Eventide Equivocate for this task, but any decent EQ plug-in will do the trick.) This is especially helpful if you don't have a studio-quality guitar and pickups, or if you've recorded a great track but later thought your guitar settings were not where you wanted them.

 

You can also experiment with placing some light compression using a third-party plug-in before Helix instead of using Helix Native's "LA-2A" studio compressor.

 

[Doug6String]

While there are plenty of good EQ blocks within Helix Native, I'm getting some excellent results by placing a third-party EQ plug-in before Helix Native. Its especially nice for rolling off some lows and highs, and gently boosting some low and/or high mids on your raw guitar track before Helix starts chewing on it — getting it sounding as good as you can first without Helix enabled. (I'm especially fond of using Eventide Equivocate for this task, but any decent EQ plug-in will do the trick.) This is especially helpful if you don't have a studio-quality guitar and pickups, or if you've recorded a great track but later thought your guitar settings were not where you wanted them.

 

You can also experiment with placing some light compression using a third-party plug-in before Helix instead of using Helix Native's "LA-2A" studio compressor.

This is a great idea I hadn't thought of - thanks!  Helix/Native have so many options I sometimes forget to get outside that box even when using them.

[rsvette12]

While there are plenty of good EQ blocks within Helix Native, I'm getting some excellent results by placing a third-party EQ plug-in before Helix Native. Its especially nice for rolling off some lows and highs, and gently boosting some low and/or high mids on your raw guitar track before Helix starts chewing on it — getting it sounding as good as you can first without Helix enabled. (I'm especially fond of using Eventide Equivocate for this task, but any decent EQ plug-in will do the trick.) This is especially helpful if you don't have a studio-quality guitar and pickups, or if you've recorded a great track but later thought your guitar settings were not where you wanted them.

 

You can also experiment with placing some light compression using a third-party plug-in before Helix instead of using Helix Native's "LA-2A" studio compressor.

 

This is a great idea I hadn't thought of - thanks!  Helix/Native have so many options I sometimes forget to get outside that box even when using them.

 

I use this way faster and works great  - MXR Silver 6 band EQ - I plug it into my rig kontrol 3 input and plug my XVIVE receiver into the IN of MXR - cool stuff

 

https://www.amazon.com/MXR-M109S-Guitar-Effects-Pedal/dp/B01N0LZSGN/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1518718723&sr=8-1&keywords=mxr+6+band&dpID=418CiUb%252B7BL&preST=_SY300_QL70_&dpSrc=srch

[Tabjaker]

Ooh. Great tip. Thanks for the post.

 

I have yet to place an actual physical pedal before A/D conversion and HN, but it will be interesting to try a boutique pedal or 2 and then play with the various amps. 

[wrongaccount]

Random thoughts. 

 

It seems to me that if you need to EQ the raw guitar signal before the input that maybe consider getting a different type of guitar.  Single coils too bright?  Get something with humbuckers.  Hollowbody too dark?  Get something with single coils.  Endless quest.

 

Or get a Variax and experiment.

[zolko60]

I am trying to avoid more than 20 plugins in digital chain and more than 5 stompboxes. Having 5 guitars (including Variax) instead of 20 sounds like a good minimalistic idea :D

[Petes63Strat]

Hey Soundog: I was hoping you might have a suggestion to improve my Helix Native tone through headphones using your EQ plugin idea.  I have been searching all over for a solution when I came across this thread. I have no shortage of otherwise great quality headphones (and have tested with even more from friends and colleagues). Here is my situation: Pretty much everything (including Helix Native) sounds good through my power amp and Yamaha NS10 monitors. However, when I try to monitor through my headphones Helix sounds terribly thin, trebley and lifeless BUT all of my other tracks still sound perfectly fine. I have not been able to find a work-around and have even tested with multiple Audio Interfaces.

 

But then it occurred to me that I might try an EQ plugin (I use Apple Studio X) where I could adjust the EQ to try and achieve a good sound on the track that I'm running helix through and then simply switch the EQ on or off depending upon whether I'm monitoring through my amp & speakers or my headphones. Has anyone tried this? Do you think there is a way of improving the Helix tone in this way? I am actually at a point where I have otherwise stopped using my headphones with Helix. I have only basic experience  with EQ so I am not sure where to start with any attempt to correct this tinny sound (other than just screw around 'til it sounds better).  I tried Rich's idea of a headphone tube amp and while it warmed everything up a little it still left me short on Helix.

[soundog]

I don't understand why all your other tracks would sound fine through quality phones, but not Helix. It's a mystery, but sounds like an EQ issue based on your descriptors (tinny, thin, etc), maybe a lack of low mids? You could try a good EQ plug-in (like FabFilter ProQ) after Helix and see if anything strange is going on with your frequency curve. I typically have an EQ plugin before and after Native to tweak so the tracks fit the song. Trying to create an EQ curve for your Helix headphone monitoring is certainly a possibility.

 

I personally use Sennheiser HD600's with a Sonarworks calibration file (plug-in), mainly to check low-end but sometimes to mix late at night so I don't disturb others. Helix sounds fine on my system, through monitors or the headphones.

[Petes63Strat]

Thanks soundog. I appreciate your help. It seems that a lot of players have this same issue so I know I'm not alone. I read through this entire thread below but did find much help: 

I will try one of the EQ plugins you mentioned and see if I can improve upon this. Thanks again! 

[Petes63Strat]

Soundog: I think I'm getting closer to the source of my problems with Helix Native and my tinny headphones tone. I was reading though that thread that I linked you too and realized that you had actually commented there toward the end.  I saw where a couple of guys commented on their Sennheiser HD 600 (300 ohm) headphones (Beyer-dynamic DT 880s & 990s at 250 Ohm) and how much they loved them while pointing out that the lower OHM units all seemed to sound terrible.  It was then that I realized that the headphones I use are also lower impedance and wondered if this is what is contributing to the tinny, crappy tone that I get. One is 38 ohms and other is 55 Ohms. Like Rich (rsvete12), I am using the Rig Kontrol 3 as an audio interface (on his recommendation) which has a headphone out but I am not sure what the impedance is so I am apprehensive to spend $300 on a new set of the Sennheisers until I can get to the bottom of this. I also have a Focusrite Scarlett 2i interface if need be. Focusrite says to "look for headphones with a maximum impedance of 200 ohms", which is already above that of the Sennheisers.  At the moment I am running the L&R line outs from the Rig Kontrol 3 unit to my Samson Q5 headphone amp. So, I am not even sure if the headphone amp requires its own consideration where OHMs & headphones are concerned or do I just base the OHMs upon what the Rig Kontrol 3 is sending to it from the line outs? It's all a bit of a question mark for me. I am determined to get good tone in headphones (like you do) so if I can confirm that the Sennheisers will help I will certainly order a set.

 

Sorry this got so long winded. I hope to report back with some great news if I can get this sorted out!

[rsvette12]

2 hours ago, Petes63Strat said:

Soundog: I think I'm getting closer to the source of my problems with Helix Native and my tinny headphones tone. I was reading though that thread that I linked you too and realized that you had actually commented there toward the end.  I saw where a couple of guys commented on their Sennheiser HD 600 (300 ohm) headphones (Beyer-dynamic DT 880s & 990s at 250 Ohm) and how much they loved them while pointing out that the lower OHM units all seemed to sound terrible.  It was then that I realized that the headphones I use are also lower impedance and wondered if this is what is contributing to the tinny, crappy tone that I get. One is 38 ohms and other is 55 Ohms. Like Rich (rsvete12), I am using the Rig Kontrol 3 as an audio interface (on his recommendation) which has a headphone out but I am not sure what the impedance is so I am apprehensive to spend $300 on a new set of the Sennheisers until I can get to the bottom of this. I also have a Focusrite Scarlett 2i interface if need be. Focusrite says to "look for headphones with a maximum impedance of 200 ohms", which is already above that of the Sennheisers.  At the moment I am running the L&R line outs from the Rig Kontrol 3 unit to my Samson Q5 headphone amp. So, I am not even sure if the headphone amp requires its own consideration where OHMs & headphones are concerned or do I just base the OHMs upon what the Rig Kontrol 3 is sending to it from the line outs? It's all a bit of a question mark for me. I am determined to get good tone in headphones (like you do) so if I can confirm that the Sennheisers will help I will certainly order a set.

 

Sorry this got so long winded. I hope to report back with some great news if I can get this sorted out!

 

Hi Buddy:

 

Using Sensi's HD650 - 300ohm here but I use a little dot III as a preamp and a Emotiva A-100 its a bit overkill having both amps but at least one should be used to power those headphones - its amazing difference - also as I have told you a software pre-amp for you OS would make a huge difference even without an amp which is what I do - the rig kontrol is not an amp its a pre-amp - and not that powerfull hence my purchase of decent head phone amps

 

You dont need to buy new Sennheisers - got mine off ebay - lots of deals there :)

 

190$ and theres others - thesew are what I have massdrop HD650

 

https://www.ebay.com/itm/MASSDROP-SENNHEISER-HD-6XX-REFERENCE-CLASS-HEADPHONES-NIB/303092087643?epid=12021955064&hash=item4691b23b5b:g:vrkAAOSwx95bD0vg

 

Amps are not cheap though

 

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Little-Dot-MK-III-HiFi-SEPP-Vacuum-Tube-Headphone-Amplifier-Stereo-Audio-Preamp/271794629635?hash=item3f4838ec03:g:jvEAAOSwlelcGYFS

 

You dont want to know what the Emotiva cost 385$ on ebay - yikes just go with little dot III - I compared them not much different - other then Little Dot is a bit warmer

 

Yikes you mentioned above you bought a tube headphone amp ? which one - should have made a difference if not you need a pre amp software for your mac - in windows I use Equalizer APO with the Peace addon works amazingly well for a mac you need to find something 

 

All that said get some massdrop Sensi's without those your really not going to have the entire package - I have tons of headphones that got tossed until I bought Sensi's - all set now

[soundog]

...bought my Sennheisers used also, they're usually well-cared for by audiophiles and you can often find good deals.