Best possible STEREO setup between HELIX & Roland JC-120???

[felipemartin]

Hello, can anyone help me with the best possible STEREO connection for using my Line 6 Helix and my Roland JC-120 (and / or my JC-40) so I can take advantage from the natural Stereo capability of these amps?   If you can tell me how am I suppose to connect them (How many cables method) and give me or sell me a stereo Patch so I can tweak it and use it as my template patch.

Thanks a lot.

[rd2rk]

You'll need to run the Helix Outs into the JC120 Stereo FX Loop Returns. This will effectively cut out the JC120 preamp unless you run 4cm:

 

Guitar>Helix Input>Effects>FX Loop 1 Block>Helix Send 1>Amp Input>Amp FX Loop Send>Helix Return 1>Effects>Helix Left/Right Out>Amp Left/Right FX Loop Return

 

Make sure your Stereo FX blocks are at the end of your signal chain and that there are no MONO blocks between them and the Output block.

 

Here's a simple demo preset that allows you to use the JC120 Preamp (FX Loop) OR a 2204 (direct to the JC120 Power Amps). 

 

 

4cm with Amp.hlx

[felipemartin]

Thanks a lot!   I'll try it out ASAP.

[brue58ski]

I have an older JC120 so if that's the case, what you want to plug into is called MAIN. It's the same as an FX return (bypasses the preamp and goes straight into the power amp). See the pic. BTW that makes the Line Out the FX send.

jc120 rear panel.jfif

[rd2rk]

32 minutes ago, brue58ski said:

I have an older JC120 so if that's the case, what you want to plug into is called MAIN. It's the same as an FX return (bypasses the preamp and goes straight into the power amp). See the pic. BTW that makes the Line Out the FX send.

jc120 rear panel.jfif 92.21 kB · 1 download

 

When I was looking into this I came across the older version, and wasn't sure if the Returns were actually stereo? The manual for that older model isn't clear on it.

[felipemartin]

Thanks a lot to all of you!!!

[brue58ski]

1 hour ago, rd2rk said:

 

When I was looking into this I came across the older version, and wasn't sure if the Returns were actually stereo? The manual for that older model isn't clear on it.

 

It is my understanding that there are essentially two power amp circuits (I think that might be true for the whole circuit, from input, which get's split, to output) each one assigned to one speaker. So if one speaker's amp were to malfunction, the other one would still work. So each return is for each speaker respectively. I've tested it by plugging just one thing at a time to each input. Only one speaker at a time has audio when you do that. According to my recollection.

[felipemartin]

On 1/30/2020 at 2:19 PM, rd2rk said:

You'll need to run the Helix Outs into the JC120 Stereo FX Loop Returns. This will effectively cut out the JC120 preamp unless you run 4cm:

 

Guitar>Helix Input>Effects>FX Loop 1 Block>Helix Send 1>Amp Input>Amp FX Loop Send>Helix Return 1>Effects>Helix Left/Right Out>Amp Left/Right FX Loop Return

 

Make sure your Stereo FX blocks are at the end of your signal chain and that there are no MONO blocks between them and the Output block.

 

Here's a simple demo preset that allows you to use the JC120 Preamp (FX Loop) OR a 2204 (direct to the JC120 Power Amps). 

 

 

4cm with Amp.hlx 9.68 kB · 3 downloads

 

 

 

 

Hello, I don't know what am I doing wrong.   I set a patch and hooked the amp as supposed with 4CM (Since the return fx loop on the amp is Stereo, I actually used a 5CM), BUT, I get my signal mixed with the amp input.   What I want to do is to use my JC120 as a CLEAN amp (Using the Helix effects BUT NOT the pre amp) and then, as I stomp omg a foot switch, to use a Hi Gain preamp and everything from the Helix and bypass mi JC120 Pre Amp section.   Is this even possible?   I'm getting afraid I'm going to have to sell the Helix...

On 1/30/2020 at 2:19 PM, rd2rk said:

You'll need to run the Helix Outs into the JC120 Stereo FX Loop Returns. This will effectively cut out the JC120 preamp unless you run 4cm:

 

Guitar>Helix Input>Effects>FX Loop 1 Block>Helix Send 1>Amp Input>Amp FX Loop Send>Helix Return 1>Effects>Helix Left/Right Out>Amp Left/Right FX Loop Return

 

Make sure your Stereo FX blocks are at the end of your signal chain and that there are no MONO blocks between them and the Output block.

 

Here's a simple demo preset that allows you to use the JC120 Preamp (FX Loop) OR a 2204 (direct to the JC120 Power Amps). 

 

 

4cm with Amp.hlxUnavailable

Thanks a lot.

Best regards, 

[brue58ski]

So I'm not sure exactly how you have it setup but here's one way. Let's start with the whole signal path.

 

Guitar  -> Helix Guitar In -> Helix mono FX Send (Instrument Level and you'll want this right after the input) -> Amp Guitar Channel 2 In -> Amp Channel 2 FX send -> Helix Stereo FX Return (Line Level I Think) -> Amp Stereo FX Return

 

Is this how yours is setup? If it is, remember, the FX sends and returns in Bold and Italics can be put anywhere in the chain in the Helix so that will have a significant effect on your patch. Be thoughtful in regard to exactly where you put the FX SEND and RETURN blocks in the Helix. Are you using the patch rd2rk attatched? Is your JC120 an older one with the Line Out for the FX send and Main In as the FX return or does it have the CH2 Effect Loop? If you have the CH2 Effect Loop model I noticed there is a SERIES/PARALLEL switch to the right of the SEND output. Make sure that's in SERIES. That's all the advice I have for now.

[hideout]

I don’t know why you’d bother with 4CM on a JC amp. Yeah it’s chorus is great but I’d bet you can get a similar sound from the helix. The preamp itself is nothing to write home about. I’d just plug the Helix into its effects returns and be done with it. 

[felipemartin]

6 minutes ago, hideout said:

I don’t know why you’d bother with 4CM on a JC amp. Yeah it’s chorus is great but I’d bet you can get a similar sound from the helix. The preamp itself is nothing to write home about. I’d just plug the Helix into its effects returns and be done with it. 

I understand what you say, BUT, since the JC-120 doesn't have a Master Volume, it'll sound not loud enough.

[felipemartin]

1 hour ago, brue58ski said:

So I'm not sure exactly how you have it setup but here's one way. Let's start with the whole signal path.

 

Guitar  -> Helix Guitar In -> Helix mono FX Send (Instrument Level and you'll want this right after the input) -> Amp Guitar Channel 2 In -> Amp Channel 2 FX send -> Helix Stereo FX Return (Line Level I Think) -> Amp Stereo FX Return

 

Is this how yours is setup? If it is, remember, the FX sends and returns in Bold and Italics can be put anywhere in the chain in the Helix so that will have a significant effect on your patch. Be thoughtful in regard to exactly where you put the FX SEND and RETURN blocks in the Helix. Are you using the patch rd2rk attatched? Is your JC120 an older one with the Line Out for the FX send and Main In as the FX return or does it have the CH2 Effect Loop? If you have the CH2 Effect Loop model I noticed there is a SERIES/PARALLEL switch to the right of the SEND output. Make sure that's in PARALLEL. That's all the advice I have for now.

 

 

I have the news version of the JC.  I also set the FX Loop on Serial.   Why should it be in Parallel?   Isn't that result in mixing both signals?

Can you please re attache the d2rk Patch?   Something happened and I lost it.

 

Thanks a lot for all the help.   It's a little harder for me since in my country we speak Spanish.

Best regards, 

[brue58ski]

32 minutes ago, felipemartin said:

 

 

I have the news version of the JC.  I also set the FX Loop on Serial.   Why should it be in Parallel?   Isn't that result in mixing both signals?

Can you please re attache the d2rk Patch?   Something happened and I lost it.

 

Thanks a lot for all the help.   It's a little harder for me since in my country we speak Spanish.

Best regards, 

Holy smokes!!! I did mean series. Sorry about that. Having it in parallel would have accounted for the signal bleed. Sorry about that. I'll change my previous post. 

[rd2rk]

1 hour ago, felipemartin said:

Can you please re attache the d2rk Patch?   Something happened and I lost it.

 

Attached.

4cm w_2204.hlx

[felipemartin]

Thanks a lot!

[rd2rk]

2 hours ago, felipemartin said:

I understand what you say, BUT, since the JC-120 doesn't have a Master Volume, it'll sound not loud enough.

 

Actually, with no MV you should have the opposite problem - the power amp will be wide open! You'd need to use the Helix Volume Knob as a MV.

[felipemartin]

34 minutes ago, rd2rk said:

 

Actually, with no MV you should have the opposite problem - the power amp will be wide open! You'd need to use the Helix Volume Knob as a MV.

Wow!  Didn't knew that!   I'll try it out.

 

Thanks again

[felipemartin]

3 minutes ago, rd2rk said:

 

Attached.

4cm w_2204.hlx 9.68 kB · 1 download

Tanks you very much!   I'll try it out later.

 

Best regards, 

[felipemartin]

Hello, NEW DEVELOPMENT.   I now realize that when I activate the AMP module of my Patch, it generates a dual sound with a lag.   1st I hear the "clean" sound generated on the amp channel and second I hear the distorted sound that should be getting to the amp though the FX Loop.  Anyone know what can I be connecting or doing wrongly?

Thanks a lot.

[brue58ski]

I would suggest checking out the parameters of your Return block. Make sure it gets turned down or turned off when you activate the AMP module. That pretty much has to be where the "clean leak" is coming from. Also, are you running a parallel path in your Helix? Just though of something else. Check the Send parameters as well. At the very least make sure it is turned down or off when you activate the AMP module. I suspect you're new to the Helix . May I suggest coing throught Jason Sadites Helix tutorials on YouTube. Excellent place to start.

 

https://www.youtube.com/user/gtr111/videos

 

The ones you want to focus on are all called "How To Create A Great Sounding Tone". There are around 40 of them.

[felipemartin]

10 minutes ago, brue58ski said:

I would suggest checking out the parameters of your Return block. Make sure it gets turned down or turned off when you activate the AMP module. That pretty much has to be where the "clean leak" is coming from. Also, are you running a parallel path in your Helix? Just though of something else. Check the Send parameters as well. At the very least make sure it is turned down or off when you activate the AMP module. I suspect you're new to the Helix . May I suggest coing throught Jason Sadites Helix tutorials on YouTube. Excellent place to start.

 

https://www.youtube.com/user/gtr111/videos

 

The ones you want to focus on are all called "How To Create A Great Sounding Tone". There are around 40 of them.

Yes, I'm new.  Thanks a lot for the help.   I'll try it out.

[rd2rk]

1 hour ago, felipemartin said:

Hello, NEW DEVELOPMENT.   I now realize that when I activate the AMP module of my Patch, it generates a dual sound with a lag.   1st I hear the "clean" sound generated on the amp channel and second I hear the distorted sound that should be getting to the amp though the FX Loop.  Anyone know what can I be connecting or doing wrongly?

Thanks a lot.

 

When you activate the Helix amp, you want to turn OFF the FX Loop Block, else you have signal from both the JC120 Preamp AND the Helix Amp.

With the FX Loop Block ON and the AMP Block OFF, assign BOTH to the SAME footswitch and SAVE the Preset.

The Preset I attached is configured that way, and works off of FS11. Maybe you changed it somehow?

 Attaching it again.

 

 

4cm w_2204.hlx

[felipemartin]

50 minutes ago, rd2rk said:

 

When you activate the Helix amp, you want to turn OFF the FX Loop Block, else you have signal from both the JC120 Preamp AND the Helix Amp.

With the FX Loop Block ON and the AMP Block OFF, assign BOTH to the SAME footswitch and SAVE the Preset.

The Preset I attached is configured that way, and works off of FS11. Maybe you changed it somehow?

 Attaching it again.

 

 

4cm w_2204.hlx 9.68 kB · 0 downloads

 

 

Thanks again m friend!  I'll try that out.  

[hideout]

On 2/5/2020 at 7:32 AM, felipemartin said:

I understand what you say, BUT, since the JC-120 doesn't have a Master Volume, it'll sound not loud enough.

Actually, no. It will be plenty loud. Trust me. A master volume does not make a amp louder it is in fact designed to make it softer.  This could all be avoided if you simply did not use 4CM with this amp. It’s completely unnecessary because its preamp offers nothing that would benefit your tone. At least nothing that the Helix doesn’t already offer.