MarkH42 Posted October 2, 2023 Share Posted October 2, 2023 Some background - my previous rig is a Fender tube amp with 8 or so effects pedals and I bought an HX Stomp in hopes of eliminating all pedals, but I had hoped to use my amp as an onstage monitor, and I also need to use an amp at practice because our practice PA can't handle anything else. THE PLAN So, I plugged the guitar into the mono input on the Stomp and went out of the mono output jack to the return input on the back of my amp. My amp is a Fender Super Sonic 60 and it has a ton of headroom. I hoped it would be a clean platform that would work until I got comfortable at gigs with just running straight to the PA and hearing the guitar through a wedge monitor. We play a wide variety of covers requiring jangly guitar one song and heavy distortion the next and everything in between. I play a Strat and a Gibson SG primarily, depending on the song. My plan was to focus on snapshot mode and program literally every song with it's own preset. "1A" would be the first song, with the first preset being the primary sound, click on second switch for lead boost, and third only if the song required it. 2A would be the next song, etc. Because I was running into the effects return, I am only using my main power amp and bypassing the preamp (I think). In the HX Stomp, I started by using just AMPS with no cab, believing my speaker was providing that "personality". THE PROBLEM(S) I have tried every conceivable combination of amp and distortion effects (and EQ) and I can't get any distortion that sounds even close to the tone of my Fulltone OCD or even Boss Super OD. The sounds are just not full and "meaty" like I expected, and also like I have heard on YouTube from other Helix/Stomp users. So, I tried using only Preamp models instead of Amp models and I didn't notice any improvement in tone (it also got very quiet...). The volume variation as I run through the various presets I have created are a real problem and it will take some time to get everything balanced out, but I can overcome that hurdle. I love the delays, chorus, phaser, sound gates, etc. The clean tones are better than the dirty ones, but overall, I can't make it sound as good as my previous setup, even clean. My temporary solution is to add back my distortion pedals and remove the AMP from the presets, and just plug into the front of the amp. So I'm using my amp's preamp and power amp, my distortion pedals, and the Stomp is only used for the other effects. It is working and the sound is MUCH improved, but it is not the setup I had in mind. I can't help but think I'm missing something important. Is my amp throwing the sound off? Would one of those FRFR speakers make it sound much better? I can tolerate the current sound at practice and onstage if the straight-to-PA sound out front is good. Any suggestions? Thanks in advance for taking the time to read this LONG post. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Schmalle Posted October 3, 2023 Share Posted October 3, 2023 First of all: Hi, welcome and thank you for putting some thought into structuring your post. You could approach your plan differently by tackling another potential obstacle first - plug into the input of the amp and try replacing the OCD (Compulsive Drive) and Super OD (Stupor Drive). Does that work for you? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SaschaFranck Posted October 3, 2023 Share Posted October 3, 2023 I'd also try what Schmalle said. In addition, you could try to tackle the problem by setting up the Stomp in 4 cable method, with your Super Sonic's preamp sitting in the loop (note: when you do this for the first time, you need to check out which loop levels are appropriate, they can be switched between instrument and line level, in addition, the loop blocks have their own leveling options for further finetununing). Within that scenario, you could now comfortably switch between the internal amps/preamps and the Super Sonic's preamp. You could even place a looper block as the first thing in your signal chain, record something and have your hands free for all editing purposes while the looper is playing. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MarkH42 Posted October 3, 2023 Author Share Posted October 3, 2023 Schmalle - I will try this - seems like a reasonable approach. I get some good sounds at low volume but it gets raunchy at higher volumes (at practice). I found a post on this forum last night about that same issue and I will read it thoroughly tonight. I watched a Rhett Schull YouTube video last night with some tips that I also want to try. He suggests tweaking the high limit/low cut in Master Settings (not the right term), adding a compressor at the end of the chain and/or an EQ, plus a few more things. I will explore all of that soon. SaschaFrank - for some reason, the 4 cable method intimidates me. This is about simplifying my rig and if I can get good sounds out of the HX Stomp, then I'll just go with that. If I've got cords all over the place and the option of the Fender preamp or the Stomp preamps, it seems too confusing. For now, I'm going to continue to read the forum and try to get good tones out of the Stomp into the return of my effects loop. I feel confident I will bond with it if I keep digging into fine-tuning it. I appreciate the responses! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PaulTBaker Posted October 3, 2023 Share Posted October 3, 2023 I know this doesn't help, but there are thousands of things to try. Look at Jason Sadites videos, they are good. Also John Nathon Cordy and Steve Serlacci. You could also try adding a cab in your original approach (going into the return). Some people like that better. For me, the only cab that sounds good is the legacy bass 15 ampeg cab. all the rest are too metalic sounding. Good luck and hope you don't give up. It can be worth the time.... especially later on when you start to factor in setup/breakdown and travel.... so much easier! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SaschaFranck Posted October 3, 2023 Share Posted October 3, 2023 On 10/3/2023 at 4:56 PM, MarkH42 said: This is about simplifying my rig and if I can get good sounds out of the HX Stomp, then I'll just go with that. See, I wasn't talking about you to actual use the 4cm method. Just use it as a test setup until you've matched your tones. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MarkH42 Posted October 9, 2023 Author Share Posted October 9, 2023 All great info here! Schmalle's suggestion was eye-opening. The tones I am getting from the Stomp are almost exactly what the actual pedals are producing. I am going to try PaulTBaker's cab idea tonight. I'm learning that there are SO many variables you can control. Once I get dialed in, I know I'm going to love it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brue58ski Posted October 16, 2023 Share Posted October 16, 2023 I read through this fairly quickly so I don't know if these have been mentioned. Also, I have a full size Helix and not the stomp but i think these apply to the stomp as well. First check your output to see if it is line level or instrument level or mic level (not sure what's available on the stomp). Since the audio is low, switch it to line if it's not there already. Line is the hottest level with instrument level next and mic level being the lowest output. Also, try adjusting the input's impedance. I think it is normallly at auto so try different settings on that. Hope this helps Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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