in ear Monitor directly from HX stomp XL, not via front of house?

[gianchiar]

often I do gigs where I use the HX stomp xl and I monitor andh in ears. the front of house gives me a WIRED monitoring pack where I can make a mix myself by usingan app (there are many behringer, yamaha etc...). obvs this way the sound ingeneer often tweaks my sound (not ideal) to fit in the mix...removes alot of bass etc. I would like to monitor myself directly from the unit but I have so far not found a way to do this.

 

I tried: 

guitar into input

output to front of house via DI box

wired pack into return set as aux in, mix without guitar

in ears into stomp headphones

 

this gives me the issue that there is a loop as the aux input comes out of the main stomp out. 

 

i have tried to split the path so that the guitar is only on path B to send and aux in is only on path A to output, but headphones can only monitor one of the two so the signal is seaprated....

 

has anybody ever found a way to do this without briging more gear other than the hx stomp xl? I know it might be possible with extra mixer, but that defeats the point. 

 

thanks!!

[codamedia]

Buy yourself a little mixer (they are cheap these days). Get the monitor mix from the house on one channel and ask the tech to remove the guitar from your mix. Then run either a send, or one of the outputs of your stomp to the other channel. Blend & EQ each as required. 

 

FWIW... proper monitor mixes are not supposed to be affected by EQ settings at the FOH... the only exception is often the HPF (high pass filter) which would remove bass, but only the area you shouldn't be in the first place. 

[DunedinDragon]

Agree with @codamedia.  Tell your soundman you have MUCH more ability to adjust your signal than he does at this board.  Tell him it's 2023 and not 1993 and he just needs to let you know what he needs from your sound.  You can adjust it for all your presets in globals.  He'll be chasing it on every song.

[ricstudioc]

On 11/29/2023 at 5:44 AM, codamedia said:

Buy yourself a little mixer (they are cheap these days). Get the monitor mix from the house on one channel and ask the tech to remove the guitar from your mix.

This - after returning to the band after a hiatus, they had gone to in-ears.  Picked up a small mixer and told FOH to send me a band mix without me in it.  I set my own guitar level for myself. Works a treat.

 

edit - BTW I note your "without a mixer" comment.  But no good way to achieve your goal otherwise.  'Tis what it 'tis.

[gianchiar]

On 11/29/2023 at 12:44 PM, codamedia said:

Buy yourself a little mixer (they are cheap these days). Get the monitor mix from the house on one channel and ask the tech to remove the guitar from your mix. Then run either a send, or one of the outputs of your stomp to the other channel. Blend & EQ each as required. 

 

FWIW... proper monitor mixes are not supposed to be affected by EQ settings at the FOH... the only exception is often the HPF (high pass filter) which would remove bass, but only the area you shouldn't be in the first place. 

 

as much as I appreciate the input this does not answer my question. the mixer thing is something I was already aware of and trying to do without as I mentioned in my original post. Is it a thing that is not possible with the Stomp XL at all? is it possible with the larger unit or other modellers WITHOUT an external mixer? 

 

I am after consistency. I play in many band with different systems, engineers, soundcheck time (if any sometimes) so I am looking for a set-and-forget-no-talking-needed setup. maybe something Line 6 needs to add to units?

[DunedinDragon]

On 12/5/2023 at 12:42 PM, gianchiar said:

 

as much as I appreciate the input this does not answer my question. the mixer thing is something I was already aware of and trying to do without as I mentioned in my original post. Is it a thing that is not possible with the Stomp XL at all? is it possible with the larger unit or other modellers WITHOUT an external mixer? 

 

I am after consistency. I play in many band with different systems, engineers, soundcheck time (if any sometimes) so I am looking for a set-and-forget-no-talking-needed setup. maybe something Line 6 needs to add to units?

It's the same on all Helix units.  That's because the Helix is a guitar modeler, not a mixer.  The reason is due to the old saying you've heard all your life, "Jack of all trades and master of none".  I play in different bands and different venues as well and have for 50 years and I have no problem allowing the mixing board to be a mixing board and do what it does best, and my guitar rig being my guitar rig and doing what it does best...and that gets me the best and most predictable/manageable results from both.

 

Your best bet is to concentrate on producing the best guitar performance you can with the Helix and have some minimal level of understanding about what you can expect from the FOH mixer and communicate your needs effectively to whoever is running it.  The mixing board has MUCH greater abilities to take your finished guitar sound and send it (along with an appropriate customized mix of all other channels) to the various people that need it (audience, band members, monitors, in ears, etc), in the manner in which they need it.  THAT is it's specialty.  There's no reason in the world to try and re-invent that.

[brue58ski]

If you were to use the floor Helix, it has sends and returns. Many people use the returns for playing along to tracks from your phone for example. Since you don't have one I won't go into details but it can be done that way. May I also say it's kind of a pain because you would have to have a return in every patch you were using. And adjusting levels would be kind of a pain too. Really the best solution is a tiny mixer. There's plenty on Amazon.

[codamedia]

On 12/5/2023 at 11:42 AM, gianchiar said:

as much as I appreciate the input this does not answer my question. the mixer thing is something I was already aware of and trying to do without as I mentioned in my original post.

 

I was just re-affirming what you already know. It is the BEST option for your situation. You can get a little 2 channel mixer the same size as a STOMP... it's not that much of an inconvenience. You really should re-think this self imposed limitation you are putting on yourself. 

 

On 12/5/2023 at 11:42 AM, gianchiar said:

Is it a thing that is not possible with the Stomp XL at all?

 

Sure, with it's own set of limitations. The same would apply on the larger Helix units. 

 

Here is how you do it...

1. Insert an FX Loop (send/return) block at the end of every preset you have.
2. Use the SEND to send your guitar signal to the FOH. You will no longer use the main output.
3. Use the RETURN to bring in the feed from the FOH monitor. 
   1. Ask the tech to remove your guitar from this mix
4. Plug your headphones into the headphone jack on the stomp
5. The FX Loop block is where you will set your mix.... 
   1. Set the MIX to 50% so the guitar and return will both go to the main (headphone) output
   2. Adjust the RETURN level to adjust the monitor signal. 
   3. Do not touch the SEND level... unless the tech asks you for less signal. It will turn down your guitar in both places and you'll need to compensate (ie: chase your tail) with the return level.

 

I said it had limitations.... here are the few that come to mind...

1. This works in mono... I don't think stereo will work, but you can look deeper to see if it will
2. You need to do this on EVERY preset you use
3. A BLOCK is consumed on every preset you use
4. You need to tweak "step 5-2" on every preset you use.

[gianchiar]

On 12/6/2023 at 12:46 PM, codamedia said:

 

I was just re-affirming what you already know. It is the BEST option for your situation. You can get a little 2 channel mixer the same size as a STOMP... it's not that much of an inconvenience. You really should re-think this self imposed limitation you are putting on yourself. 

 

 

Sure, with it's own set of limitations. The same would apply on the larger Helix units. 

 

Here is how you do it...

1. Insert an FX Loop (send/return) block at the end of every preset you have.
2. Use the SEND to send your guitar signal to the FOH. You will no longer use the main output.
3. Use the RETURN to bring in the feed from the FOH monitor. 
   1. Ask the tech to remove your guitar from this mix
4. Plug your headphones into the headphone jack on the stomp
5. The FX Loop block is where you will set your mix.... 
   1. Set the MIX to 50% so the guitar and return will both go to the main (headphone) output
   2. Adjust the RETURN level to adjust the monitor signal. 
   3. Do not touch the SEND level... unless the tech asks you for less signal. It will turn down your guitar in both places and you'll need to compensate (ie: chase your tail) with the return level.

 

I said it had limitations.... here are the few that come to mind...

1. This works in mono... I don't think stereo will work, but you can look deeper to see if it will
2. You need to do this on EVERY preset you use
3. A BLOCK is consumed on every preset you use
4. You need to tweak "step 5-2" on every preset you use.

Great work!! this looks very promising, tried at home and it seems to be doing what i need it to do. I might try it at a few gigs and see if it's the one. 

 

thank you again for the time and thinking put into this!

[gianchiar]

On 12/5/2023 at 10:12 PM, DunedinDragon said:

It's the same on all Helix units.  That's because the Helix is a guitar modeler, not a mixer.  The reason is due to the old saying you've heard all your life, "Jack of all trades and master of none".  I play in different bands and different venues as well and have for 50 years and I have no problem allowing the mixing board to be a mixing board and do what it does best, and my guitar rig being my guitar rig and doing what it does best...and that gets me the best and most predictable/manageable results from both.

 

Your best bet is to concentrate on producing the best guitar performance you can with the Helix and have some minimal level of understanding about what you can expect from the FOH mixer and communicate your needs effectively to whoever is running it.  The mixing board has MUCH greater abilities to take your finished guitar sound and send it (along with an appropriate customized mix of all other channels) to the various people that need it (audience, band members, monitors, in ears, etc), in the manner in which they need it.  THAT is it's specialty.  There's no reason in the world to try and re-invent that.

 

The wheel MUST be reinvented! haha...otherwise where's the fun?

 

your approach works well in some situation, but it's not a one-size-fits-all thing I'm afraid. as Codamedia has suggested there might be a way to do this and I'm all in!