hd500 tips on settings?

[mcdookus]

Hi. New hd500x owner after having used stompboxes (eventide) for the past couple of years.

I play through a newish vox ac30 and am using the fx loop and 4cm. Ive read that i should use the settings on the fx loop as send at -7 and return at +8.

Does this sound right to you? Should i use line or amp at the switch by the treadle? Line or stomp on the back? Any other tips you can give me will be much appreciated.

I only ask as i cant turn the volume up at home and have rehearsals on tusday and dont want to spend the 1st hour messing around with settings. Many thanks. Any advice will be much appreciated

[Tboneous]

Chances are even if you could play at volume at home, it would sound different at rehearsal and different again at a gig. I suggest you get to rehearsal early and crank it up and adjust accordingly. I don't mean to be vague but that kind of question can only be answered by your ears.

[mdmayfield]

Hi. New hd500x owner after having used stompboxes (eventide) for the past couple of years.

I play through a newish vox ac30 and am using the fx loop and 4cm. Ive read that i should use the settings on the fx loop as send at -7 and return at +8.

Does this sound right to you? Should i use line or amp at the switch by the treadle? Line or stomp on the back? Any other tips you can give me will be much appreciated.

I only ask as i cant turn the volume up at home and have rehearsals on tusday and dont want to spend the 1st hour messing around with settings. Many thanks. Any advice will be much appreciated

 

I sort of recall seeing those settings. If those are the right numbers, then you'll end up with very close to "unity gain" (same volume) through the FX loop. That'll guarantee that at least one strictly technical aspect of your patch is close to optimized.

 

But that doesn't guarantee anything about the tone actually sounding good in any particular context. As Tboneous says, you still have to test it in the context you need to use it in.

 

In my opinion, things tend to go smoother when you optimize technical stuff like the FX loop levels, but it takes a lot of time and experience to understand the rules (and the times there are exceptions). And even then, if the technical stuff isn't exactly right, if it's close enough things will work fine.

 

As long as the technical stuff is "in the ballpark," in my opinion, the art of setting your EQ/tone knobs and choosing the right amount of distortion for the job is more important than optimizing levels, as far as creating a tone that's appropriate to the song/gig.

[mdmayfield]

...And as far as practical advice to minimizing your time at rehearsal messing around with settings, at home you should try to err on the side of:

 

- More mids than you would expect; and

- Less gain than you would expect.

 

If the tone has just slightly too much midrange and not quite enough gain/distortion at low volumes, it'll probably sound about right at high volumes.

 

If it sounds "fat/full-range/lots of lows&highs/lots of gain" at low volumes, then it'll probably sound weak, and disappear into the mix, at high volumes.

[mcdookus]

Thanks for the replies... will bear it all in mind.

[mcdookus]

Thought id give a quick update...

Very impressed with the hd500x.. its a keeper. Sounded really good through my ac30 (no amp or cab settings). So good that i will be using it full time and will only be adding a strymon el capistan delay and weeping demon wah to it. Very impressed with the delays and the verbs. Found that the tube overdrive algorhythm works best with my amp and a touch of the facial fuzz for when i want that extra brutal fatness... very simple to use once i worked out what settings and levels were needed..... sorted

Kind regards

One happy hd500 owner

Luke

[rockstardvnt]

Ive been exactly the same situation for about a year now… (DT 50 212, hd 500..4cm)  LOUD as a you'd ever want it, but low volume setting sounds totally different, so its hard to fully set things where ya want them with limited face melting showtime levels.. with every possible scenario being  suggested as "the way" to do it, its right back to the beginning with endless possibilities.. Far more than I was fully prepared for…  So, I too could use any advise on a few things like, gain structure to get the fat full distorted sound.. unity gain? how can you know where the gain is registering without any lights or meter display… Im a Sound man by trade, so I feel like this should be a no brainer but doesn't seem to be because it requires so much time getting familiar and comfortable that its small bits at a time and a slow process.. so…. Im new at this form of interacting online, so my bad if my response is more like a ditto to the question already posted… 

[pianoguyy]

As a soundman, than you should already know that volumes and surroundings change tone. 

So, really, there is no way to 'test' concert volume in your bedroom. And at the same time, there is no way to test an open air concert tone when you are rehearsing in an indoor facility.

 

I go direct to pa. That is probably the best way to get a unified sound.

Plus, its then up to the soundman to tweak - lol

[namklak]

I have a cab at practice and almost the same cab in my bedroom.  In my bedroom I use this, and it helps be get close to practice/gig sound because I don't' have to change my HD or amp.

http://www.parts-express.com/speaker-l-pad-attenuator-100w-mono-1-shaft-8-ohm--260-265

My $.02

[rockstardvnt]

As a soundman, than you should already know that volumes and surroundings change tone. 

So, really, there is no way to 'test' concert volume in your bedroom. And at the same time, there is no way to test an open air concert tone when you are rehearsing in an indoor facility.

 

I go direct to pa. That is probably the best way to get a unified sound.

Plus, its then up to the soundman to tweak - lol

absolutely right.. I was more interested on how to get unity gain with all the many volumes and gains.. while maintaining a reasonable noise level. but trial and error seems to be only way..  

[amsdenj]

Regarding gain staging, here's a simple approach. First consider the placement of effects in the signal chain. Of course there are no rules, and you have to use your ears to find what you're looking for. But a typical signal flow might follow this pattern:

 

Static Tone Shaping: Tone shaping comes first, including guitar tone and volume and pickup selection, followed by compression to control pick attack and sustain. 

 

Dynamic Tone Shaping: Next comes variable tone shaping devices like phase shifter, Wah Wah or Univibe, possibly Flanger too. These are modulation devices, but modulate phase or tone more than frequency, and therefore can go in front of distortion.

 

Distortion and Overdrive: Overdrive, possibly gain staged for different boost/distortion  and voicing levels. One should be for controlling metal lead distortion, and another for tailoring the overall amp sound. The second should clean up well when turning down the guitar volume while the metal distortion will often need significant bass and treble cuts and won't sound good with the guitar volume turned down. This section can also be handled completely by the amp if it has sufficient gain staging options like S-Gear. Using overdrive pedals however can give more control over the amount of distortion and overdrive, as well as the tone shaping.

 

Amplifier: The actual guitar amplifier, especially if its a digital amp or a plugin into a DAW would typically come next. This allows all the modulation and ambient effects to be “in the air†and not over impacted by the amp itself.

 

Modulation Effects: Mod effects like flanger and chorus. More classic tones came from pedals before the amp which provided most of the overdrive. In some cases, these effects were produced after the recording, especially flanger for a more pronounced effect that is operating on the distorted signal rather than being distorted by the overdrive.

 

Flanger might go before or after distortion depending on how pronounced the effect should be. Chorus would generally be after distortion in order to simulate doubling or Leslie effects.

 

Speaker cabinet.

 

 

Mic

 

Room Ambience

 

 

Ambient effects: these go last. Usually Delay comes before reverb.

 

Looper: You generally want the looper at the end (post) so that it records everything you hear. Its also not a good idea to put more than one signal at a time through a distorted amplifier. This is because when one signal is loud enough to cause distortion, the amplifier has no headroom left for the other signal and it will be ducked away and not be heard. That can be an interesting effect, but wouldn't be typical. You can use the looper at in the pre position if your tones are clean and you want the recorded and played signal to go through exactly the same signal chain. Another good use of the looper in the pre position is for hands free tone setup.

 

For gain staging, start by turning off every effect except the amplifier. Put the Looper in the pre position, and record a short loop where you play pretty hard, ensuring your guitar is pushing the POD at its maximum. Then start at the head of the signal chain and work towards the tail, setting the levels for each effect, one at a time. To set the gain for an effect, turn the effect on and off, and use the effect's level or output control to get the on and off levels more or less the same. Turn the effect off and move to the next effect in the chain. 

 

This will ensure that you're not getting a lot of gain buildup when you turn on multiple effects that might result in some internal digital clipping. You'll also find that effects have sweet spots where they work best with a certain input level. If they are under or over driven, the effects may work ok, but not deliver their best results. It can take some experimenting to find the sweet spot, and set the effect controls to get the tone you want. Your ears can quickly tire and you may need to take rests or you may get less predictable results. 

 

Its ok to have an effect or two add some gain in the signal chain. I use the vintage pre right before any Fender model to provide extra gain, and a high pass filter to roll off some of the bass. That makes the Blackface amps distort much better and makes a nice switch from clean to driven. But be careful about having a compressor, distortion effect and the vintage pre all adding some additional gain, and all on at the same time. That might push the front of the amp, or even one of the effects too hard.