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Do You Have The Same Problem With 6th String?


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#1 canerakcil

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Posted 04 April 2014 - 02:06 AM

I have a jtv-89F and a while ago i started a topic and the problem still existing...

 

When i play the guitar with it's magnetic pickups, everything is fine but when i activate the modeling, the 6th string starts to sound really weird.. This problem is very easy to notice on distortion tones and especially on palm mutings, it is hard to hear this problem on clean tones but i noticed that it is there for the clean tones too..

 

There are some guys have the same problem and some of them started a topic before, but noone can find anything about to fix this problem...

 

--Lowering string volume on the workbench didn't work

--Reinstalling the software didn't work

--Changing strings(i use .46-.009 gauge) didn't work

--There are no visible loose elements on the guitar

 

 

This is the previous topic: There is a guy wrote that he has the same problem too..

 

http://line6.com/sup...el-sound-issue/

 

 

This is the sound example:

 

https://dl-web.dropb...XCCwSb4PIvZOvSA

 

 

 

I started to think that some of the variax users have the same problem but they try to find a way not to hear the noise...Please don't do that, let's try to find the cause of the problem..

 

Please write if you know how to fix this or even if you have the same problem too.

Attached Files


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#2 clay-man

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Posted 04 April 2014 - 05:52 AM

Variax has a subtle different sound on the palm muting. You'll want to mute up higher on the strings to get a desirable palm mute sound. What firmware are you using?


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For a minute there, I lost myself.

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#3 canerakcil

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Posted 04 April 2014 - 09:16 AM

Software is 2.0..And no it's not about being able to get palm mute..If i play on 6th string there is a silly noise like i attached up on the page..But if i try on the 5th or 4th string there is no problem..

 

And i tried a same another guitar in the store, but there is no problem on that one..

 

I think about maybe the problem occurs after playing a while...


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#4 ice9mike

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Posted 04 April 2014 - 09:41 AM

canerakcil,

 

I also have this problem and have tried various ways to fix it without success. It is most noticeable on the bridge pickup settings for most of the models when using a fair amount of distortion. Especially the Spank and Custom models. The distortion is a must if you want to really hear what is going on. I think there are some people who don't notice it, but for me, it's really noticeable and annoying. I asked my band members if they could hear it. They could not.

 

I tried the following experiment. For the 89F, each individual piezo cable attaches to the PCA. This is only present for Graphtech Ghost systems and allows the cables to be swapped easily. I swapped the cable for the 6th and 5th string to see if the noise moves or stays on the 6th string. It moved to the 5th string which eliminates all hardware/piezo pickup on the bridge. I am convinced it has something to do with the PCA or software. That's as far as I have troubleshot the problem.

 

We really need Line 6's help with this. I love this guitar except for this problem.


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#5 canerakcil

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Posted 04 April 2014 - 10:05 AM

I aggree all of your writings..

 

And i know a user ''badmelonfarmer'' has the same sound issue like us.. I don't know how many users have this problem...


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#6 silverhead

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Posted 04 April 2014 - 10:08 AM

Have any of you opened a support ticket to deal directly with Line 6 on this?


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Life is what happens to you while you're busy making other plans.
.... John Lennon

 

 


#7 badmelonfarmer

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Posted 04 April 2014 - 10:29 AM

Hi all,

 

yeah, here is my thread about the issue

 

http://line6.com/sup...ing/#entry37530

 

kinda a modulated ring modish sound .

 

I have not opened a case yet .... but think I will.

 

as I said in my thread, I owned a Variax 700 and am sure this was not an issue


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#8 badmelonfarmer

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Posted 04 April 2014 - 10:38 AM

support ticket opened


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#9 ice9mike

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Posted 04 April 2014 - 10:48 AM

I had an open support ticket several months ago. They recommended I send the guitar back to Sweetwater as it was brand new. I did that. Sweetwater could not find an issue with the guitar so it was sent on to Line 6 headquarters for more troubleshooting. Line 6 could not find an issue with the guitar either so they eventually sent it back to me.

 

I think the main challenge is getting Line 6 to recognize and hear the issue that we are experiencing.


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#10 badmelonfarmer

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Posted 04 April 2014 - 11:23 AM

did you post a sound of the problem online?

 

here is what i posted.

 

it is a metallic sound in the second half of the clip

 

https://soundcloud.c...9p-plinky-plonk


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#11 canerakcil

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Posted 04 April 2014 - 11:32 AM

You can listen to the sound example of mine on the first entry..I pasted a link and attached the file also to the page.

 

If this is a common problem (we will see if there are other users have any similar problem), that makes me think maybe there is a faulty element on the device that makes this weird noise after using the device for a while...

 

I am not sure if it was existing when i just bought from the store...


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#12 badmelonfarmer

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Posted 04 April 2014 - 11:58 AM

yep, that sounds exactly the same as mine !

 

lets see what Line 6 has to say


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#13 ice9mike

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Posted 04 April 2014 - 12:07 PM

Here's a link to my recording of this horrible sound. It sounds very similar to the other recordings on this thread. You can also hear a lot of digital swirling/noise just before the playing starts. This is coming from the 89F modeling. I have no idea where that comes from either.

 

https://dl.dropboxus... Lester-JCM.wav

 

My 89F is currently in the shop to have some frets re-leveled and setup (I don't know how it escaped with those high frets they were producing horrible ringing. That's another story). I will make more recordings of this horrible sound this weekend when I get it back.


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#14 silverhead

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Posted 04 April 2014 - 12:35 PM

support ticket opened

Good. I would encourage anyone else with this problem to also open a ticket, rather than waiting for badmelonfarmer to report his results. The more voices heard, the easier it will be for Line 6 to prioritize, assess, and identify any problem(s).


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Life is what happens to you while you're busy making other plans.
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#15 canerakcil

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Posted 05 April 2014 - 01:32 AM

The more voices heard, the easier it will be for Line 6 to prioritize, assess, and identify any problem(s).

 

I totally agree...


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#16 badmelonfarmer

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Posted 05 April 2014 - 07:56 AM

reply from Line 6 was standard stuff asking me for a clip ... and asking me to re-flash ... even though I had already given the clip and told them I had re-flashed.

 

they have passed the ticket to Line6 UK and also suggested I contact the supplier in the UK.

 

I have done so and linked them both back to this thread.

 

hopefully they will figure out what is causing the issue for us.

 

I would ask other to also raise tickets and point them at this thread. too.

 

if other people have the same problem, please chime in and post clips to help line 6 help us.

 

thanks


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#17 ice9mike

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Posted 05 April 2014 - 12:46 PM

I just got my JTF-89F back from being the shop where it had several frets re-leveled and setup. It plays great through the mag pickups. The modeled sounds on the other hand sound like crap on the 6th string. The Spank bridge through distortion is awful and unusable. Sounds like there is an echo and boost only the pick attack. The sound is as annoying as fingernails on a chalkboard.

 

I created another support ticket to address this and pointed them to my recording and this thread. We need a critical mass to get support to seriously look at this issue. I encourage anyone with this issue to record their guitar, open a ticket, and demand a fix. Be persistent. I will make this my personal mission if I have to.

 

Good luck everyone. 


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#18 canerakcil

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Posted 05 April 2014 - 10:18 PM

There is another user on the forum, he has a jtv-89F too and his problem is on the 4th string. I asked him to write down here so they can follow us easily.The number is rising...


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#19 israz99

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Posted 07 April 2014 - 11:37 AM

I'd like to give you an update.

 

I have not posted the ticket I`m doing some test before and I want to post some audio samples that help identify the problem. What I got so far is this:

 

-in my case the noise is more notable in some models than others, bridge position of Es and Les Paul is where I can hear it more and there are others like the neck position of the Jazz models where I can´t actually hear it.

 

-It is not present when playing any of the positions of the mag pickups.

 

-If I play the guitar acoustically (unplugged of any amp) I believe the sound is present if I play the 4th string palm muted in the first frets, which leads me to believe that the sound is a frequency that is actually there but that the mag pick ups or some models don't  pick up but some other models magnify.

 

-Someone on this forum said he tried to switch the cables of the piezo that are connected to the electronic board. I switched that 4th and the 5th but the 4th string still makes the noise.

 

-I rolled back to 1.9 and so far the noise is not present but I need to make more tests, by the way, it is the first time I use the models of versions 1.9 and I think I don´t like them, they are vey muddy, I only liked the acoustic models which I can actually play now though my Fender mustang amp, as you might remember the acoustic models in V2.0 are "mic guitars" and though they sound greta you need a PA system type of channel to meek them sound great.

 

Anyway I will create some audio samples before I post the ticket but at this point I'm convinced the problem has to do mainly with the algorithms created for some of the HD models, these algorithms magnify the frecuencyes that produce this noise that some of us can hear in the 6th, 5th or 4th strings.

 

I hope all this helps Line 6 to identify the issue.


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#20 Charlie_Watt

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Posted 07 April 2014 - 11:41 AM

One difference between the piezo and mags is what part of the string vibration they pick up.  The mags see the string where it goes over the pickup only.  The piezos sense the very end of the string.  There are differences in the vibrations picked up in these two spots just as there are differences between the mag pickup in the bridge vs neck position.


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#21 ice9mike

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Posted 07 April 2014 - 11:58 AM

israz99,

 

Thanks for testing the cable swap. I think there is a general problem with the software too with regard to the frequencies it manipulates. I wonder how different the Graphtech Ghost pickups are compared to the LR. Baggs system used on the other JTVs. My jtv-59 does not have this issue. I look forward to hearing your sound samples.

 

ice9mike


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#22 canerakcil

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Posted 07 April 2014 - 12:08 PM

-If I play the guitar acoustically (unplugged of any amp) I believe the sound is present if I play the 4th string palm muted in the first frets, which leads me to believe that the sound is a frequency that is actually there but that the mag pick ups or some models don't  pick up but some other models magnify.

 

-Someone on this forum said he tried to switch the cables of the piezo that are connected to the electronic board. I switched that 4th and the 5th but the 4th string still makes the noise.

 

-I rolled back to 1.9 and so far the noise is not present 

 

I think your problem is a little different from ours if the noise disappeared by the change of software...

 

My guitar doesn't make the ugly sound when it is unplugged.Maybe(don't get me wrong) it is not the same sound that you hear from the guitar when it is unplugged...When you change your strings and play the guitar without plugging to an amp, new strings have very specific metallic noises and this could be sounds similar to you, but this sound is actually different...


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#23 badmelonfarmer

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Posted 07 April 2014 - 01:39 PM

I tried to roll back to 1.9 and it made no difference unfortunately.

It was also muddy as hell.... Back to 2.0 and it's plinkyness
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#24 nikoniablue

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Posted 08 April 2014 - 09:23 AM

Is the sound associated with the action?  I found with my JTV-59 that it made a similar jangly noise when I lowered the action.  Raised the action a little on the bass side, problem went away.  I guessed it was just that the Variax processor was thrown by the odd harmonics from the very slight string rattle and put out its best attempt - which wasn't very good.  


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#25 badmelonfarmer

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Posted 08 April 2014 - 11:26 AM

Hmmm, interesting. Although I have raised the action on the bass side to where I thought the buzz stopped.... It's now pretty high.

Wonder if I took it back to the tech if could do a better job of it than me?

One problem is that I noticed the nut is cut pretty low on the low E... Came that way from line 6.

Hmmm
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#26 ice9mike

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Posted 08 April 2014 - 11:45 AM

I don't think this my problem is caused by low action or ringing on frets. I have adjusted the action both high and low with no change in sound. In addition I can hear this noise just by running my fingers down the string. I have even produced a stunning amount of high frequency feedback by sliding my fingers down the 6th string. Something else is going on.


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#27 badmelonfarmer

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Posted 08 April 2014 - 11:53 AM

Do you get the same noise if you dampen strings with left arm and tap the body with your right hand

Sometimes I do
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#28 ice9mike

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Posted 10 April 2014 - 09:40 AM

I got this response from customer support. Clearly they do not hear the problem. I requested they leave the ticket open.

 

To me the Strat bridge model is the worst. I will send them more audio files to illustrate this issue more clearly. 

 

Hi,
I listened to your sound sample and played it to a few techs and we don't hear anything wrong. Palm muting is difficult to do using peizo guitars as well. Your hand can get in the way of the them working correctly. Also the bridge models your using are louder models and when going through a high gain amp model, you will hear more string noise and a higher noise floor.

Regards,
Will - Line 6 Support


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#29 canerakcil

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Posted 10 April 2014 - 12:13 PM

I will send them more audio files to illustrate this issue more clearly. 

 

 

 

I will send sound samples to Line 6 too.. How do you send the records? I think i am not successful at pasting dropbox link.. 


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#30 ice9mike

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Posted 10 April 2014 - 03:06 PM

You can attach the files to your ticket at anytime.

 

You can also attach them to this thread if you click on "More Reply Options." They will need to be less than 2 mb.


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#31 badmelonfarmer

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Posted 11 April 2014 - 02:38 AM

an update:-

 

Line 6 Support came back and have requested I return the guitar via the store for Line 6 Service to check.. but suggested it was "Playing style" I pointed out that it was only the one string and asked how it can be playing style if it did not happen on the variax 700 I owned, and happens if picked with plectrum, finger style etc.

 

they believe this info changes the picture and it might be a bad piezo and to ensure this info is relayed to them via the store.

 

I have asked the store to arrange a pick up a per line 6's request.

 

Will keep you guys informed.


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#32 canerakcil

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Posted 12 April 2014 - 12:57 PM

 

they believe this info changes the picture and it might be a bad piezo and to ensure this info is relayed to them via the store.

 

Will keep you guys informed.

Very good news..Please let us know about the situation, especially how to fix this problem...


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#33 badmelonfarmer

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Posted 12 April 2014 - 01:59 PM

Will do, it is due to be picked up on Monday.... No idea how long it will take, but will keep you informed.
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#34 badmelonfarmer

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Posted 14 April 2014 - 08:08 AM

And it has been picked up and is winding its way back to Line 6.

I really hope they fix it.
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#35 canerakcil

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Posted 19 April 2014 - 09:49 AM

Has anyone been able to fix this problem? It still exists and it's really annoying... 

 

Do you know any JTV-89F owner that has no problem on their piezo??


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#36 badmelonfarmer

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Posted 23 April 2014 - 12:51 PM

Anyone tried firmware 2.1 to see if there is any improvement?

I have not heard anything from supplier or Line 6 yet after sending it back on the 14th.
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#37 ice9mike

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Posted 23 April 2014 - 08:47 PM

I just upgraded to firmware 2.1. It made everything easier to use, but the 6th string still sucks. I posted this recording to illustrate how bad the 6th string is on the Spank Bridge model. This was recorded through a HD500 using the AC30 model with very light distortion. It's awful.

 

https://soundcloud.c...-spank-bridge-1

 

Enjoy.


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#38 badmelonfarmer

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Posted 23 April 2014 - 10:16 PM

Grrrr!

Thanks for confirming though
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#39 badmelonfarmer

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Posted 24 April 2014 - 04:11 AM

I just upgraded to firmware 2.1. It made everything easier to use, but the 6th string still sucks. I posted this recording to illustrate how bad the 6th string is on the Spank Bridge model. This was recorded through a HD500 using the AC30 model with very light distortion. It's awful.

https://soundcloud.c...-spank-bridge-1

Enjoy.


Yes, that's the same horrible sound I get.

Hopefully line6 will find the issue with mine... I chased the supplier this morning to see if there is an update, or when I can expect any news.

Will keep the thread updated with any progress.
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#40 cruisinon2

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Posted 25 April 2014 - 03:58 AM

I just upgraded to firmware 2.1. It made everything easier to use, but the 6th string still sucks. I posted this recording to illustrate how bad the 6th string is on the Spank Bridge model. This was recorded through a HD500 using the AC30 model with very light distortion. It's awful.

 

https://soundcloud.c...-spank-bridge-1

 

Enjoy.

 

Just as an FYI...I picked up my "regular" Strat last night for a while and noticed that she's developed some nasty fret buzz, particularly on the low E string. With the bridge pickup and moderate distortion, I was getting a similar sound to what you posted above...admittedly not quite as pronounced and "tinny" as what you're dealing with, but it got me to thinking...Is your 6th string buzzing at all? With the piezos as sensitive as they are, they might do some strange things with a nasty fret buzz. Just an idea...


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