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POD HD300 - Output level issue
by bobbytsioles on 2011-05-14 22:45:07

Hello,

I just purchased the POD HD300.  I think something might be wrong with the output level of the HD300, but I want to see what you think.  I tried out the floor pod plus and the HD300 side by side at guitar center going through a vintage fender twin-ish amp.  I don't remember what the amp was, but it basically sounded like my 75 fender twin reverb, nice and clean.  I was plugged in to the front of the amp, and had the units set properly to amp, etc.  I compared the two units side by side.  The Floor POD plus seemed to have a much hotter output signal compared to the HD300.  I tested the floor pod plus first for almost an hour.  I then decided to try the HD300.  The difference in level was pretty dramatic.  So, I turned up the amp a few notches with the HD300 and it seemed fine, although did seem weird that it was that different than the floor pod plus.

I bought the HD300, and figured that perhaps a firmware update would fix it.  So, I got it home, and updated it to 1.31.  I played it through my twin for a few hours, and it seemed relatively ok, but the level was still much lower than just plugging straight in to the amp, similar to what I experienced at the store.  I wasn't playing it super loud.

Today, I take the HD300 and my Twin to practice with my band (80's rock cover band).  That is when the level issue really made itself stand out.  I wasn't able to get my fender loud enough through the HD300 without having it sound like it was going to explode.  Even the clean patch I made sounded very distorted.  The twin is a 100 watts RMS!  When using this amp simply through a distortion pedal, I barely have to turn up the level and master past about 3 - 4 to get it loud enough.  With the HD300, I was up around 6, and it sounded horrible.  The speakers were distorting...sounded horrible.

So anyways, it really seems like something is wrong with this particular unit.  Have you had any reports of this type of behavior?  I'm going to return the unit tomorrow, and try it out next to another HD300 to see if it's the same, but I wanted to contact you to see if you've seen this before.

Thanks,

Bobby



Re: POD HD300
by glideman on 2011-05-15 00:27:49

Hmmmm... I have an HD500 and have NO problems with output levels driving my custom made 60 watt tube amp into a 4x12.

I compare it to my Vox Tonelab SE and they are both comparable in signal strength to the amp's power section.  I bypass the

preamp completely and run it through the tube driven effects loop return.  I would definitely want to do a side by side with another

HD300 if I were in your shoes because that Twin, much like my blackface modded 73 Twin, should be knocking someone's teeth out

at the volume settings you've described.  You can draw ear blood with that thing if everything is operating normally.

Sorry for the lack of specific help... If your levels in all of the sections of your presets are raised high enough, it has to be a problem

with the unit.

GLiDE



Re: POD HD300
by silverhead on 2011-05-15 07:53:32

Please provide a little additional info:

- how are you connecting your HD300 to your amp? Are you using the amp's front input or the amp's FX Loop?

- what outputs are you using form the HD300 - the balanced or unbalanced? If unbalanced, how is the Line/Amp switch set?

- how is your Output Mode switch set on the HD300: Live, Studio, or Dual?

All of these settings work in combination and can greatly affect the tone.

EDIT: If you haven't done so already, I suggest you read the manual sections that describe the various Output options and recommended settings for use with an amp.

EDIT#2: Also, are you using the Amp Modeling  in the HD300 or are you running it in FX Only mode?



Re: POD HD300
by bobbytsioles on 2011-05-15 08:49:43

Right, I noticed it immediatly after switching from the pod plus to the HD300 when I was at the store, but wasn't playing loud enough to really notice how much lower the outut actually was.  We play super loud when we practice, and we're mic'ed going through a huge PA (I don't know why we continue to do that ).  But anyways, it was very surprising because that is one of the loudest amps around...

I really like the unit, though.  The screamer effect is awesome.  I've tried tube screamers, and if they sounded like the HD300's screamer I would have kept them.  I could basically get unlimited sustain, followed by very desireable feedback afterwards.  Rediculously awesome.  I'll try a side by side comparison tonight when I take it back, if they have another HD300 laying around.

Thanks,

Bobby



Re: POD HD300
by bobbytsioles on 2011-05-15 09:18:33

Silverhead,

Thank you for the reply. Here are my responses:


Please provide a little additional info:

- how are you connecting your HD300 to your amp? Are you using the amp's front input or the amp's FX Loop?

I have a 1/4" cable going from my guitar to the guitar input into the HD300, and then another 1/4" guitar cable going from the left channel unablanced output to the front of the amp.  The fender has no effects loop.

- what outputs are you using form the HD300 - the balanced or unbalanced? If unbalanced, how is the Line/Amp switch set?

I have the line/amp switch sent to "amp".  That was how I had the floor pod plus as well. I matched all the settings that I had used on the floor pod plus.

- how is your Output Mode switch set on the HD300: Live, Studio, or Dual?

I have it set to Live - comboFRT.

All of these settings work in combination and can greatly affect the tone.

EDIT:  If you haven't done so already, I suggest you read the manual sections  that describe the various Output options and recommended settings for  use with an amp.

I read basically the entire manual.  It says that it is recommended to use the Live mode when hooking up to a guitar amp, which is what I'm doing.  I also had the little output knob ont the back of the unit all the way up.

EDIT#2: Also, are you using the Amp Modeling  in the HD300 or are you running it in FX Only mode?

Yes, I was using the amp modeling.  The fender twin reverb doesn't have a dirty channel.  It just has pretty much the best clean sound you can get.    So, because of no dirty channel, I'm using the modeling to get the distortion sound.   I edited 31ABCD to give me 4 different sounds.  a "modern rhythm" preset.  A channel for lead which has a higher output for boost with the screamer, and a bit of delay and reverb. A "clean" preset which I believe was just a bit of chorus and reverb (I think I bypassed the amps on this preset, or it was set to the clean amp).  I wanted to only use the effects for the 3rd preset.  I'm not sure if I accomplished that though.  Does it allow for shutting of amp modeling for saved presets? I had pressed the manual buttong when i set up that preset.  Lastly, another rhythm preset.

Either way though, straight out of the box at the store I immediatly noticed the level difference after hooking it up when compared to the floor pod.  I was running it in manual mode, not presets since I wanted to simply pick the amp models and effects.

Any help would be appreciated.  I think I'd like to give the HD300 a bit more of a chance since I like the idea of not having to mess with a boost, distortion pedal, reverb, etc.  I think the next step is to take it back and try it side by side with another HD300 with the same settings.

Thanks,

Bobby



Re: POD HD300
by silverhead on 2011-05-15 10:51:13

bobbytsioles wrote:

....

- how is your Output Mode switch set on the HD300: Live, Studio, or Dual?

I have it set to Live - comboFRT.....

I just want to double check this setting. There are actually two settings for this - one is the software setting where you select Live - ComboFrt in the HD300 Setup Options. The other is actually a hardware switch that appears on the rear panel of the HD300, between the Unbalanced and Balanced outputs. Make sure this switch is also set to Live.

Otherwise I think your setup is correct for what you are doing. If the amp model Volume is also set high in your HD300 patches I don't see anything wrong. A side by side test of two HD300's might be a good idea.



Re: POD HD300
by bobbytsioles on 2011-05-15 11:16:40

Silverhead,

I have that hardware switch on the back set to Live.  The switch for output mode is set to "amp".  The amp model volumes on my rhythm channels were at around 75% with the volume on my boosted preset at around 90 I think.  I need some headroom to be able to use a preset as a boosted/solo channel.

Thanks for all of the help. I will take it back to the store and hopefully they'll have another one in stock to try along side the unit I have to see if that one is any better.  I hope so, because if that unit doesn't work "right", I'll have to return it completely, which will be sad because it really is much nicer than having to lug a bunch of pedals and garbage to play.

For anybody reading this, aside from the volume issue, I really think it's a nice unit.  You can tweak the heck out of your sound.  I can't say enough about the screamer effect.  It toally rocks.  I probably would have bought the floor pod plus, but it's made of plastic.  That thing had great level, and sounded pretty cool too.  Keep your fingers crossed.  I'll report back after I go to the store.

Thanks again,

Bobby



Re: POD HD300
by bobbytsioles on 2011-05-16 08:25:38

A bit of an update...  I didn't make it to G.C. last night to try to do a comparison with the unit I have against another one in the store.  So, I decided to read the manual again to see what I might have missed, and then just test everything again.

I fired up the fender twin last night, the first time since practice on saturday.  It was humming very loud, without much volume.   Uh oh, trashed amp?  After some panic and turning on and off many times, I looked in the back at the tubes.  One of the tubes seemed to be a bit looser than the others. I reseated the tube, and turned it back on, and the sound was nice and clean.  What a relief...

Ok, so then I tested the level of the amp going straight in to the front from the guitar without anything else.  I played that for a bit, then hooked up the HD300 with my clean preset which bypasses amp modeling and just uses chorus and reverb.  The level was now a hair higher than the fender alone!!  This is looking good.

I read in the manual:

Page 5-3 of the advanced guide reads:

Amp Model Type
As the default setting for all Amp Models, this option is set to “Full” to provide the complete sonic characteristics of the classic amp’s preamp + power amp stages. However, you can alternatively select “Preamp” to obtain just the preamp stage of the amp.
It is recommended to select the Preamp option when feeding your output to an external tube amp, such as if connecting from the UNBALANCED OUTPUTS into a guitar amp, ..........That said, there is no wrong choice. PODs have always been about flexibility... Check out all the possibilities and decide which Models work best for your tone!

Well, I had it set to Full on my presets.  My first preset is using the treadplate (dual rectifier I believe).  I changed the Amp Model Type to "preamp", and the volume coming out of the amp increased.  This was looking promising as well.  I moved on to my uberschall preset.  I changed it to preamp, and the level went down.  That seemed weird.  Why did the level go up with the dual rectifier, and down with the uberschall when changing to preamp?

I decided to switch the hardware switch on the back between the unbalanced jacks from amp to line.  When I did that, there was a considerable jump in output volume.  To make a long story short, I don't think the unit is defective.  Perhaps my original comparison with the floor pod plus wasn't an equal comparison.  Maybe the floor pod just has a hot output?  The HD300 is actually boosting my output when compared to simply plugging straight into the amp directly from the guitar.  To me, that means that the HD300 is fine.  I'm guessing my distortion and horrible sound issues at practice were due to a loose tube.

Let's say for some reason it's still not getting loud enough when I try it next time at high volume.  If I switch the output switch on the back to "line" mode instead of "amp" mode will that hurt the HD300?  I'm not sure if it will distort at loud volumes if I do that, but there was a nice boost of volume in line mode. I think I'm in good shape though.  Isn't troubleshooting equipment fun

Thanks all,

Bobby



Re: POD HD300 - Output level issue
by soultradedave on 2011-05-17 02:44:35

Hi all. I've just got my HD300, updated to the latest version. My unit has exactly the same output level issues. I use mine straight into a mixer and powered monitors in my home studio, so I have the hardware switches set to Line and Studio. I'm using the unbalanced jack outputs  Even with the HD300's master up full and the gain maxed on my mixer I can barely get any level with the clean models unless I max the Drive and Channel volumes. Presets !a and 1b are perfect examples of this, but by no means the only ones. By comparison my POD XT had much greater output levels on clean sounds.

Any thoughts out there?



Re: POD HD300 - Output level issue
by follababy on 2011-07-06 07:26:39

I have the same problem. No one cares:) I re set to factory settings. Great piece of gear, horrible service. The trick is never buy anything from Line 6 again:)



Re: POD HD300 - Output level issue
by silverhead on 2011-07-06 07:33:22

One thing that's sometimes overlooked is the Master Volume knob/control on the back of the Pod HD devices. Make sure that this level is set as high as possible without causing distortion in the downstream equipment.



Re: POD HD300 - Output level issue
by follababy on 2011-07-08 06:06:11

It is



Re: POD HD300 - Output level issue
by rahan95 on 2011-10-13 07:09:10

You're, unfortunately, not the only one experiencing these issues : http://line6.com/support/thread/59584




The information above may not be current, and you should direct questions to the current forum or review the manual.