Helix Setup and Harsh Tones

[ddmilne]

Helix run through the effects return of a Fender or Hughes and Kettner , most amp models sound discontinuos and harsh. Cab Sims are off using amp models only. Many of the FUZZ and Distortion pedal attacks and sounds also too harsh. Set uo for instrument in and line out. Added EQ's for and aft of the amp in every configuration, lowere hugh cuts globally and yet nothing excpet the cleanest of modles sounds usable. Does anyone have a clear and concise set of intructions to get the best possible setup for live rig using the Combo amp as a power amp. 

[phil_m]

Are you using the Pre models or the full amp models? I would start with the Pre models if you're going into an effects return.

[ddmilne]

full amp modelsw

[phil_m]

48 minutes ago, ddmilne said:

full amp modelsw

 

You'll most likely have more luck with the Pre models. Sometime the full amp models will work depending on the amp models, but the sort of application you're talking about is really what the Pre models are there for.

[codamedia]

As phil_m suggests... try using a PRE model. Before adding any additional effects just dial in a tone with the amp model.... get a good feel for it just as you would a normal amp. 

 

I don't know if this relates to you or not... but if you have a problem with "harsh models" are you sure it's the Helix... and not inherent of the amp style itself? With Line 6, if you know how the original amp/effect operates, it makes it much easier to understand. Line 6 has done a remarkable job over the years keeping the amp settings "realistic" to the original amps - but many users don't know that. With the original POD (1999) Line 6 explained this in great detail, but I haven't seen it mentioned in later documentation which is a real shame.

 

One example of this is the Hiwatt: If you choose a Hiwatt model and set the controls at noon you will send dogs screaming in pain and likely cause your eardrums to close tight - LOL. People that have owned Hiwatts already know this... but many Line 6 buyers likely just think the Hiwatt model is terrible while in reality it's very good... if you know how to dial it in! 

 

The same applies to many of the overdrive effects as well. 

 

[jbuhajla]

19 hours ago, ddmilne said:

Helix run through the effects return of a Fender or Hughes and Kettner , most amp models sound discontinuos and harsh. Cab Sims are off using amp models only. Many of the FUZZ and Distortion pedal attacks and sounds also too harsh. Set uo for instrument in and line out. Added EQ's for and aft of the amp in every configuration, lowere hugh cuts globally and yet nothing excpet the cleanest of modles sounds usable. Does anyone have a clear and concise set of intructions to get the best possible setup for live rig using the Combo amp as a power amp. 

Are you connecting Helix in front of your amp or 4 cable method? Are you bypassing the "real" preamp when using the Helix amp/preamp models?

[smashmashup]

15 hours ago, codamedia said:

As phil_m suggests... try using a PRE model. Before adding any additional effects just dial in a tone with the amp model.... get a good feel for it just as you would a normal amp. 

 

I don't know if this relates to you or not... but if you have a problem with "harsh models" are you sure it's the Helix... and not inherent of the amp style itself? With Line 6, if you know how the original amp/effect operates, it makes it much easier to understand. Line 6 has done a remarkable job over the years keeping the amp settings "realistic" to the original amps - but many users don't know that. With the original POD (1999) Line 6 explained this in great detail, but I haven't seen it mentioned in later documentation which is a real shame.

 

One example of this is the Hiwatt: If you choose a Hiwatt model and set the controls at noon you will send dogs screaming in pain and likely cause your eardrums to close tight - LOL. People that have owned Hiwatts already know this... but many Line 6 buyers likely just think the Hiwatt model is terrible while in reality it's very good... if you know how to dial it in! 

 

The same applies to many of the overdrive effects as well. 

 

 I am discovering rapidly this^^^^^

 

I was underwhelmed by the presets but last night started digging and dialing - bizarrely I plugged a fender Esquire in I'd picked up for my uncle and got one helluva tone after top and tailing the cabs with low/high cut, dialing down presence and actually - I really like the Who Watt amp btw. Problem is I've never played half the amps available and so the whole, modelled exactly thing starts to become troublesome if the real life amp needs a specific coaxing to get the tone, so the Helix needs the same treatment. I was hoping to get away from the rabbit hole thing having come from a VG99 - I've not touched a real amp for, well, for 20 years? (I know!).

 

Anyway, having been a bit luke warm with the Helix I'm rapidly coming round to it - and once I get to know it better it'll be a full blown affair for sure :-)

[jws1982]

I know tone is subjective, but there’s typically guitar tones that we all generally identify as good.   For situations like the one in this thread, I think it would be cool for L6 to have some really good presets pre-loaded from respected players.  Then, include a small booklet with a paragraph or two from each artist concerning the tone and how they built it. This way, newcomers could “reverse engineer” good patches to see why they sound good.