bentele Posted January 8, 2017 Share Posted January 8, 2017 Hello .... The alt tunings in my new Variax Standard sound very artificial and really not usable. It sounds the same either VDI or 1/4 connection .... via speakers or headphones. The mag pups are not blended in WB/HD. I have attached audio files in standard/1/2 down and 1 down. All were reordered on TModel position 5 into a vetta II. Thanks Ben HalfDown.mp3 OneDown.mp3 standard.mp3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
amsdenj Posted January 10, 2017 Share Posted January 10, 2017 Well there's something very wrong. I would try re-flashing the variax to restore to factory settings first. Then try directly into another amp, no VDI. It does sound like there's leakage from either the magnetic pickups, or some sort of cross-talk or feedback loop between the DSPs used to model the guitars and do the pitch shifting. This could be a cable that needs to be reseated in the guitar, a short somewhere, a cold solder joint or caused by some contanimation on the circuit board. You may have to send to Line6 for repair if re-flashing doesn't fix it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bentele Posted January 10, 2017 Author Share Posted January 10, 2017 Hi ... I did re-flash it, nothing changed. I have opened a ticket with line6 but have not gotten a response yet. Have not tried it through a different amp so guess that is next. Thanks Ben Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bentele Posted January 11, 2017 Author Share Posted January 11, 2017 I spoke with Line 6 yesterday ... they are sending a shipping label so I can send it back for warranty repairs. Ben Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bentele Posted January 12, 2017 Author Share Posted January 12, 2017 Well it is on it's way back to Line 6....... hope it's not gone too long ...... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
psarkissian Posted January 12, 2017 Share Posted January 12, 2017 I await with open arms. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bentele Posted January 13, 2017 Author Share Posted January 13, 2017 Cool ....... :D Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bentele Posted January 18, 2017 Author Share Posted January 18, 2017 Well UPS shows my Standard has been delivered to Line6 ........ Hope it gets repaired and sent back quickly :) Ben Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
psarkissian Posted January 18, 2017 Share Posted January 18, 2017 Yes. It's here. I'll be at a trade show here. But there is no one ahead of you, so it will be first in line when I return on Monday. Remind me on Monday. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bentele Posted January 19, 2017 Author Share Posted January 19, 2017 Works for me ..... :) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bentele Posted January 23, 2017 Author Share Posted January 23, 2017 Ok so it's Monday ..... and I am reminding you ..... LOL One thing I did notice is the tone control when using the magnetic pickups doesn't seem to work correctly. The first 1/2 to 2/3 of the range don't have really have much effect on tone (only with mag pup not models) . This may be normal but please check it. Thanks Ben Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
psarkissian Posted January 23, 2017 Share Posted January 23, 2017 I'll check that too thanks. Just in time, got it on the bench right now, just getting started on it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bentele Posted January 23, 2017 Author Share Posted January 23, 2017 Thanks much ..... :) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
psarkissian Posted January 23, 2017 Share Posted January 23, 2017 Dual tone: a result of,... 1) hearing the notes coming from the strings in standard tuning, and also hearing the Alt Tune strings through an amp, at the same time. 2) a set-up adjustment issue. Warbling: results from set-up, in particular, the magnetic pick-ups not being adjusted correctly. When Modeling is engaged, this can be amplified and made more obvious. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bentele Posted January 23, 2017 Author Share Posted January 23, 2017 So this is easily fixable? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bentele Posted January 23, 2017 Author Share Posted January 23, 2017 I don't think I am hearing the natural tune + the alt simply because I hear the same thing even through headphones. Aren't the mag pups turned off when modeling is engaged? Thanks Ben Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
psarkissian Posted January 23, 2017 Share Posted January 23, 2017 The mags are off, but the mag field from the magnets are still there, and pull on the strings if the pick-ups aren't adjusted correctly. They may be off, but the field is still there. It's in the mp3's and CD. Yeah, it's fixable. Intonation was off on three strings, so I adjusted that. And that can add to things as well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bentele Posted January 23, 2017 Author Share Posted January 23, 2017 OOOHHH didn't think about that. Thanks .... Ben Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
psarkissian Posted January 24, 2017 Share Posted January 24, 2017 Rain Song and Run Like Hell (et al) sounds nice now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bentele Posted January 24, 2017 Author Share Posted January 24, 2017 Thank you :D Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bentele Posted January 27, 2017 Author Share Posted January 27, 2017 So sad .... UPS in their infinite wisdom decided to push back the delivery of my repaired Standard by a day. Was originally scheduled for Monday ... but now Tuesday .... :( Oh well ... just have to wait ... Ben Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cruisinon2 Posted January 27, 2017 Share Posted January 27, 2017 I don't think I am hearing the natural tune + the alt simply because I hear the same thing even through headphones. Aren't the mag pups turned off when modeling is engaged? 99.97% of the time, it's not about the mag pickups creeping into the signal (though this is an option that can be turned on in Workbench, so make sure it's off). It's a WHOLE LOT easier than you think to hear the guitar acoustically, even with headphones on (especially if your cans are open-back). When using an alt tuning, this will sound atrocious. You'll think both tones are coming through the headphones, but most likely not. Thought my JTV was busted initially too...almost 4 years hence, I still get fooled occasionally if I'm not turned up loud enough to drown out the guitar itself. Most of my playing at home is through headphones. Easily solved by turning up a bit...crank it! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bentele Posted January 27, 2017 Author Share Posted January 27, 2017 Hi ..... yeah one of the first things I did was make sure the mags were not blended in. The Line6 guy worked on it says the mag pup were adjusted wrong (I assume too close to the strings) which makes sense. When I recorded those sound clips I had the mic about 6 inches from the vetta speaker and I was about 15 feet away so I doubt it picked up the fundamental frequency of the string. But anything is possible .... People get mad at me when I crank it up (live in a small apt) .... LOL But hey if that's what it takes I'm in .... :) I'll post back when I get it back (should be Tuesday) Thanks for the reply Ben Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bentele Posted January 31, 2017 Author Share Posted January 31, 2017 Well UPS has pushed back delivery again ..... Now tomorrow .... my guess is they never put it on the truck today. The destination scan was at 8:31am but never showed out foe delivery. Later it destination scan time changed to 1:31pm..... bummer Oh Well Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ADBrown Posted February 2, 2017 Share Posted February 2, 2017 I just gotta say I've been watching this thread and have been enjoying the interaction between Line 6 and customer, awesome! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
psarkissian Posted February 2, 2017 Share Posted February 2, 2017 :) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bentele Posted February 3, 2017 Author Share Posted February 3, 2017 Yes very happy with Line6 support and psarkissian in particular. Ben Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bentele Posted February 6, 2017 Author Share Posted February 6, 2017 Ok …. So I got the guitar back and although it was a little better it really still sounded the same. So first thing I did was pull out the Variax 500 and create a model tuned 1 step down. Low and behold it sounded exactly the same as my new standard. So next I pulled the old Guitar Port. Connected the 500 to it and recorded directly into the PC. Wouldn’t you know the play back was perfect … sounds just like you think it should. Next was the Standards turn. Recorded it with the tuning knob set 1 step down directly into the PC. It also sounded just like it should. Bottom line …. I guess you are hearing the standard tuned strings along with what comes out of the speakers. Hard to believe … but it is ….. My apologies to everyone I doubted ….. Thanks All Ben :D Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
psarkissian Posted February 6, 2017 Share Posted February 6, 2017 No problem, it did need an adjustment or two just the same. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bentele Posted February 6, 2017 Author Share Posted February 6, 2017 I am absolutely sure it did need some adjustments. It plays better then it did before you worked on it. Many thanks. I live in an apartment so I always play at low volume levels (louder you don't hear it as much). Thanks much Ben Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
philbell5 Posted January 14, 2018 Share Posted January 14, 2018 A bit late, but https://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/B006NY2IUW/ref=oh_aui_detailpage_o08_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1 fixed it for me; see attached image. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PolMol Posted April 23, 2018 Share Posted April 23, 2018 On 6/2/2017 at 6:13 PM, psarkissian said: No problem, it did need an adjustment or two just the same. Hi, i just got my Variax Standard and i have, listening to mp3 attached, the very same problem. May i ask you what kind of adjustment are needed ? Or is something an end user should not do ? Fyi, almost same as OP, i did a factory reset, installed new firmware, doublechecked on WorkBench magnetic blendig was of, running into a spider V with the G10Relay (so no VDI cable). I've tryied to lower as much as possible, to pickguard level, the middle pickup and using models/alt tuning just in that position, but nothing changed Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
psarkissian Posted April 23, 2018 Share Posted April 23, 2018 Set-up adjustments if I recall. Couple of other tweaks. Don't go adjusting things on your own. Adjusting the pick-up height incorrectly can result in warbling when in model mode, and sounds worse when using Alt Tune. The set-up needs to be spot on for your geographic location and climate. Local climate, temperature and humidity can affect the set-up. Also be aware of something called "dual tone effect". It's when you hear the string in standard tuning, and the signal from the amp in Alt Tune,... at the same time. Result is a clash of pitches. When you turn the amp up or use headphones, you hear less of the string and more of the amp signal. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PolMol Posted April 23, 2018 Share Posted April 23, 2018 Thx man, i feel so dumb now, amazing how your ear can trick you. I was sure i was earing a "distorted + effect" second sound but testing recording into a DAW confirmed your "dual tone effect" sydrome. Since you warned about adjusting things on my own, i would like to ask you more . Other than for testing, i lowered at pickguard level my middle pickup, and lowerd the action a little bit. Can this " result in warbling when in model mode, and sounds worse when using Alt Tune." ? I can understand if magnets are too close to strings, but if magnets are more than far and i avoid blending, should't be ok ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
psarkissian Posted April 23, 2018 Share Posted April 23, 2018 Too close or too far,.... it's all on how mag field is and how the string cuts the field. It's all about finding that happy spot. warbling occurs with normal mag guitars as well, but with the modeling engaged, the warbling can be amplified and stand out. The pick-ups are off, but the magnetic field isn't. Guitar set-up is all about balance of tensions and parameters, and subtle adjustments are are the difference between spot-on and almost. And as the old saying goes, "almost only counts with horseshoes, hand grenades and hang gliders". It's like a set-up for a normal guitar, but with a few adding twists to be aware of because of having both piezos and magnetics. Extra stuff to be aware of. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PolMol Posted April 24, 2018 Share Posted April 24, 2018 11 hours ago, psarkissian said: It's like a set-up for a normal guitar, but with a few adding twists to be aware of because of having both piezos and magnetics. Extra stuff to be aware of. Ok, indeed i lowered a bit the action (not at extreme shredder level, just a little bit lower) and lowerer the middle pickup to mach my other guitars. All my guitars have (and i'm used to) lower action, plus the middle pickup "disturb" my picking (i lowerd as well on my strat and the others have HH config). Don't wanna ask to pubblish line6 secret about Variax, but can you tell us factory specs (or point us to where they are available) about minimum and maximum distance magnets and string action a Variax should have to work as intended ? Thanks in advance Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
psarkissian Posted April 24, 2018 Share Posted April 24, 2018 Fret the highest note, lo-E side 3mm, hi-E side 2mm. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PolMol Posted April 24, 2018 Share Posted April 24, 2018 thx, that's , sorry if i ask, min or max magnets distance to cords ? After what you said about magnetic field, not sure if it's ok or not i leave my middle pickup screwed all the way down..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
psarkissian Posted April 24, 2018 Share Posted April 24, 2018 All the way down can be, almost, as bad as too close. It's about finding that sweet spot. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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