Impulse Response

[joel_brown]

I download the Poulin Plugin and a handful of IRs and applied them to my recorded PODHD tone.  This was an eye opener.  Wow, screw any other feature, I want to be able to download and install IRs right into the PODHD for live use.  I didn't realize how much of an improvement it was.  Plus there are thousands of IRs to choose from.  First modeler to do this for under a $700 gets my money.

[Lachdanan0121]

Well the Digitech GSP 1101 is able to do it, but its old.  

 

You could run that in conjunction with the Pod HD, which is what some of the users on Sevenstringforum are trying.

 

I personally am holding off upgrading my modelling setup until Digitech, and Peavey announce all their new stuff.

(I have hopes that Digitech will make an actual successor to the GSP 1101.)

[joel_brown]

That's good to know.  Atleast someone has done it for a reasonable price.  I hope Line6 is making this a priority.  After hearing the differance it makes I'll throw the PODHD away in a heartbeat if Digitech or Peavey come out with an updated modeler that includes installable IRs.  I urge anyone who hasn't heard the differance an IR makes to download the Poulin Plugin or any plugin for IRs and check it out.  I was real satisfied with the PODHD until I heard it with an IR.  Of course finding the right IR takes a little time but there's lot of them to choose from.

[GTLazer]

Some interesting IRs here, if you're into that kind of thing > http://www.openairlib.net/

[Lachdanan0121]

That's good to know.  Atleast someone has done it for a reasonable price.  I hope Line6 is making this a priority.  After hearing the differance it makes I'll throw the PODHD away in a heartbeat if Digitech or Peavey come out with an updated modeler that includes installable IRs.  I urge anyone who hasn't heard the differance an IR makes to download the Poulin Plugin or any plugin for IRs and check it out.  I was real satisfied with the PODHD until I heard it with an IR.  Of course finding the right IR takes a little time but there's lot of them to choose from.

 

Digitech is announcing their new lineup at NAMM I think. (a few months from now)

 

I personally don't have an issue waiting (within reason), though I am not a Live musician.

[Lachdanan0121]

Some interesting IRs here, if you're into that kind of thing > http://www.openairlib.net/

BTW thanks for the link, I haven't seen this one yet.

[DeanDinosaur]

I download the Poulin Plugin and a handful of IRs and applied them to my recorded PODHD tone.  This was an eye opener.  Wow, screw any other feature, I want to be able to download and install IRs right into the PODHD for live use.  I didn't realize how much of an improvement it was.  Plus there are thousands of IRs to choose from.  First modeler to do this for under a $700 gets my money.

Based on what you're saying you're using two impulses: that of the POD HD and the additional impulse. I think when you put two impulses in a row you do  get a unique big sound but it's not likely you will get the same sound from one Impulse.  TO get similar sound within the POD and no exterior impulses,  put the "rotary speaker simulation" with minimal speed  after the amp somehwere in you signal chain  just so you get the additional impulse (with 100% for MIX).

[meambobbo]

i have also found the built in cab/mic sims are lackluster.  my workaround was to use what I call "dual cabs" - same amp in a dual amp path, but different cab/mics.  This can run into phasing issues with certain combinations (i have done extensive research on this: http://foobazaar.com/podhd/toneGuide/cabsMics#dualCab ).  I found by far the best combination was the Uber with 57 on axis and the XXL with 121 Ribbon.  Also Uber with 409 and XXL with 57 on axis works well.  See the my favorites section in the link above - you gotta scroll down to the end of the dual cabs section.

 

i wouldn't advise anyone to wait on L6 to give them such instrumental features.  This product line has been out for quite some time and not a peep about this.  I'm on a Kemper now and couldn't be happier.  actually i haven't even turned the HD on (not trying to dog the HD - great step forward for L6 but still plenty of room for improvement).

 

Also, keep in mind that the Digitech GSP never officially added IR loading support - that was done on the side by I believe a former developer.  I suspect companies always fear loading anything onto their hardware that may cause the unit to brick or that could potentially expose their IP.

[bjnette]

I am envious of your KPA purchase meambobbbo.  It is certainly been the buzz for a while and turns out to be a major Studio tool.

 

KPA have put out plenty of updates and huge improvements to their FX arsenal. but at 4 times the price the HD500 is pretty good.

 

In the home studio I find using with my Marshal, Fender or Peavy Valve King gives some acceptable tones.

 

I have had mune for just over a year now and still loving it but I am getting used to the Line6 wash on every patch.

 

You know ,  I have never tried IRs with the HD500 yet.

 

Hopefully that will open up the tones a bit. 

[joel_brown]

It's hard to believe Line6 would ignore something like user installable IRs.  Seems to me this would be a huge selling point for them without a ton of effort.  If Digitech does it then I'm sure others will follow.

[GTLazer]

Does anybody actually officially do this yet?

 

As I understand it, the GSP1101 is an unofficial firmware, the AxeFx needs an unofficial file convertor, what about the KPA? Can it use an IR in WAV format, or would it still need converting?

 

Any other kit that allows WAV IRs?

[phil_m]

Does anybody actually officially do this yet?

 

The Torpedo stuff can load third party IRs, and it officially advertises the ability to do so. But, it's also isn't really a full-blown modeler.

[daedae]

Based on what you're saying you're using two impulses: that of the POD HD and the additional impulse. I think when you put two impulses in a row you do  get a unique big sound but it's not likely you will get the same sound from one Impulse.  TO get similar sound within the POD and no exterior impulses,  put the "rotary speaker simulation" with minimal speed  after the amp somehwere in you signal chain  just so you get the additional impulse (with 100% for MIX).

Alternately, if you're using a VST IR loader anyway, some people on sevenstring are also using Ignite TPA-1 power amp VST, and just using the preamp models with no cab simulation.

[DeanDinosaur]

what about the KPA? Can it use an IR in WAV format, or would it still need converting?

 

Any other kit that allows WAV IRs?

Using traditional IRs with Kemper is not really meaningful. Kemper captures the whole thing AMP and Cab. Even though they did provide option for separating the speaker from the AMp after customers requested, it's not really in the original intended design. It's just added variety but with other devices like AXE, POD, etc the IR can be a night and day difference.

[joel_brown]

I'm going to wait and see if Line6 or someone supports user installable IRs in the near future.  If nobody does then I may drop the $550 bucks for the Torpedo.  Atleast with the Torpedo I'll have the ability to use IRs with any modeler.  So if at some point I buy the Kemper, AXE, Digitech, another Line6, whatever.

[DeanDinosaur]

I'm going to wait and see if Line6 or someone supports user installable IRs in the near future.  If nobody does then I may drop the $550 bucks for the Torpedo.  Atleast with the Torpedo I'll have the ability to use IRs with any modeler.  So if at some point I buy the Kemper, AXE, Digitech, another Line6, whatever.

The great thing about Torpedo in addition to what you just mentioned, is that you can record a real AMP at bedroom level or even silent recording as it's a digital load Box that can replace the speaker cab normally connected to your tube AMP. So if used with a real tube amp, it can be better quality than AXE Kemper or whatever modeler. You're actually recording the real amp instead of a digital simulation.

[phil_m]

The great thing about Torpedo in addition to what you just mentioned, is that you can record a real AMP at bedroom level or even silent recording as it's a digital load Box that can replace the speaker cab normally connected to your tube AMP. So if used with a real tube amp, it can be better quality than AXE Kemper or whatever modeler. You're actually recording the real amp instead of a digital simulation.

 

Well, the more expensive Torpedo Live can do that. The Torpedo C.A.B. can't. It doesn't provide a load, so you'd have to get the signal from the amp to it some other way. The C.A.B. does have power amp modeling, so you can take a signal from an amp's effect send or preamp out and use that. But you can't really use your amp's power amp with C.A.B.

[joel_brown]

In my case I was thinking of PODHD into Torpedo CAB.  That way I get the PODHD with whatever IRs I want to use.  At that point I'd have a $1000 into it.  Still less than AXE Ultra but I've seen AXE FX II for $1000 on eBay.  But I can always use the Torpedo with anything I buy in the future.

[Rewolf48]

Two Notes video of HD500 into Torpedo CAB

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sfXgcVJbtIs

[clay-man]

I believe IRs use a bit of processing power. Using an IR in Guitar Rig 5 jumps the CPU meter to 8-10% already on my computer.

Unless they can optimize that, it might be a bit much, especially with the DSP limit thing.

[Rewolf48]

Ahh, but you are forgetting:

 

• HD500 has sharc dsp optimised for audio transformation rather than a general purpose CPU so is potentially orders of magnitude better at IR processing
• This IR suggestion will replace at least the Cab and Mic simulations which might already be IR based

The thing is we don't know whether the HD500 uses IR + Convolution or something else entirely, and those who do know either won't or can't say. So pretty much from the release of the HD series people have been saying "We want user IRs" and in all that time Line 6 have said nothing at all.

[phil_m]

Two Notes video of HD500 into Torpedo CAB

 

http://www.youtube.c...h?v=sfXgcVJbtIs

 

 

 

I've got to say that from that video, I don't hear a huge improvement going from the HD500's cab simulation to the Torpedo. The biggest difference to me between the tones is that the Torpedo sounds a bit louder in the mix. It's certainly not anything that would make me want to spend an extra $500 or $1000.

 

I'm not saying this as a knock against having the option to use third-party IRs or anything. I agree it would be nice to have. I just haven't heard anything that makes me think there's a vast difference.

[DeanDinosaur]

Certainly not worth the Extra 500 just to be able to use External IRs. Again I keep saying that I don't think that the LINE 6 CAB in the HD series is just an IR. What I mean is if you disable HD speaker simulations, you're disabling other things besides just the IR. That's what my ears tell me. I've tried HD with plugins by disabling HD cabs and always found out that HD cabs were better because they include more than just the impulse.

 

On the other hand when I disable the cabs in My eleven Rack and use external IRs using PC, there are better results sometimes from using IRS. Look at the HD speaker sim. It doesn't say off axis or on axis and it has "air" or "room" which means it's not just an IR. I'm sure line 6 knows what else is there and if they separate whatever else is there so you only disable the Impulse response only, then I would consider using with External IRs.

[phil_m]

Again I keep saying that I don't think that the LINE 6 CAB in the HD series is just an IR.

 

They very likely could be. Somehow Line 6 takes into account the actual loading and interaction of the cab with the power amp in their modeling. So I don't know what happens when you disable the cab, really.

[DeanDinosaur]

They very likely could be. Somehow Line 6 takes into account the actual loading and interaction of the cab with the power amp in their modeling. So I don't know what happens when you disable the cab, really.

"Somehow Line 6 takes into account the actual loading and interaction of the cab with the power amp in their modeling".   That is probably disabled when you disable cab if I was to guess. Room parameter is also disabled for sure and who knows what that's linked to. Line 6 cab has more functions than just loading an IR so replacing it wit just an IR is sacrificing something else...

[joel_brown]

I just listened to this video.  I could hardly tell any differance.  I think that was the point of the video. 

 

All I know is I applied an IR inside my DAW to my PODHD that was already recorded, which had CAB and Mic emulation turned on.  I tried out a few IRs inside of the Poulin plugin.  When I finally found the IR I liked it made a big improvement.  Was this the right way or intended way to do this ?.  I don't care and it doesn't matter.  Whatever makes it sound better is right. 

 

Back to what I was orginally trying to get accross with this thread.  PODHD customers should try the Poulin CAB plugin or any plugin that allows user installable IRs and see what a differance it makes.

 

First new (good sounding) modeler that has user installable IRs for under $700 bucks gets my next purchase.  I just hope Line6 is hearing this.

[BMoe]

First new (good sounding) modeler that has user installable IRs for under $700 bucks gets my next purchase.  I just hope Line6 is hearing this.

 

 

 

Scuffham Amps S-Gear $100 or

 

Lepou Plugins Free and  mixIR with Big Box $49.00

[joel_brown]

Thanks but I need hardware solutions.  I mostly play live.

[bjnette]

Revalver is another that supports loading in VSTs, plus it has an IR module as well..

 

In all fairness the cabs and mic choices and simple EQ FX in the HD's are adequate for live use and if you want IRs when recording just turn off the cabs.

Sure it would be nice to have, no denying it.

[joel_brown]

I agree with you 100%.  I'm not unhappy with the PODHD, it sounds very good.  I just know my next purchase will be for a modeler under $700 bucks that supports user loadable IRs.  And if it came out next week I would buy it.  Now that I've heard what IRs can do for tone and the huge number of IRs to choose from, it really opened my eyes.

[bboulay769]

Thanks but I need hardware solutions.  I mostly play live.

 

Logidy EPSi Version C.00: $200 with free shipping. I just ordered it myself. They also have a Convolution Reverb stompbox which sounds fantastic.

 

http://www.logidy.com/?pid=1

 

 

The EPSi is a DSP powered effects processor using convolution to simulate various sounds. The impulse responses used to generate the effects are stored on an included SD Card and custom impulse responses in the standard Wave format can be added to the factory collection. Two versions of firmware are available for it: 

 

Version 1.00 is optimized for long time windows turning the EPSi into a high quality reverb pedal. The SD Card lists 114 sounds from acoustic spaces to spring and plate reverbs to various special FX sounds. 

 

Version C.00 is optimized for low latency dry path convolution which allows the processing of Speaker Cabinet + Room type impulse responses. Together with an onboard guitar amp style EQ, the EPSi alone can simulate stunning clean channel sounds from a mic’ed guitar amp. 

The EPSi has a high impedance input where a guitar can be plugged in directly and it also has an analog zero latency dry path. The EPSi is firmware upgradable via the SD Card.

[joel_brown]

Hmmm, very nice.  Thanks for the info.  I'm going to take a good look at this.

[joel_brown]

Nice article about the Logidy EPSi Version C

http://www.Frugalguitarist.com/post/2014/04/08/Logidy-EPSi.aspx

 

This unit is a stereo stomp box that does high quality Impulse Responses (IRs), including user installable IRs, for $200 bucks.  I'm going to order one.  This sounds like a "must-have" for anyone using modelers other than AXE-FX - like all of us using the PODHD.  Atleast from what I can tell.  If anyone has any hands-on experience with this, please let us know.

[Akeron]

http://www.thegearpage.net/board/showthread.php?t=1431563

[joel_brown]

Is there anyone else that's excited about the Logidy EPSi Version C ?  Anyone else used it ? 

[jeremybnz]

Any updates on this from people using the Logidy EPSi?

[BlueViolince]

I'm also using the Poulin IR loader.  I have Mainstage, using a different interface, which goes in the fx loop early in my chain.  It's made all the difference for my DI live tone.  Of course, I have a few EQs, multi-comp, and a buss compressor loaded as well.