Help on Gain staging (new Helix stadium user)

[joerch71]

I need adive on how to gain stage between the blocks. One example of a problem I run into: I have a simple setup: Whowatt 103 with the cab. I adjusted the amp and cab parameters for my clean sound. Now, I was looking for a boost stomp and went for the Kinky Boost that sounded nice. Now, when I turn the stomp on, the entire volume gets considerably louder. Something that can be expected with a boost, but when I turn it off, my clean amp sound is too quiet. With the kinky boost (unlike with other options), there is no way to adjust the level (probably because the pedal it is based upon doesn't have a volume control). I am coming from the Kemper Profiler so this is an entirely new issue for me. I am testing the Helix stadium to find out if that might be my go to for the future - yet I need to understand how to cope with problems like these.

I know that I could  create two snapshots (one with the boost and volume of the amp adjusted, another one with the amp without the boost), but this seems to be too much of a hassle for such a simple setup. 

Any hints?

Tutorials?

Cheers!

[jpdennis]

On 1/14/2026 at 12:20 PM, joerch71 said:

I need adive on how to gain stage between the blocks. One example of a problem I run into: I have a simple setup: Whowatt 103 with the cab. I adjusted the amp and cab parameters for my clean sound. Now, I was looking for a boost stomp and went for the Kinky Boost that sounded nice. Now, when I turn the stomp on, the entire volume gets considerably louder. Something that can be expected with a boost, but when I turn it off, my clean amp sound is too quiet. With the kinky boost (unlike with other options), there is no way to adjust the level (probably because the pedal it is based upon doesn't have a volume control). I am coming from the Kemper Profiler so this is an entirely new issue for me. I am testing the Helix stadium to find out if that might be my go to for the future - yet I need to understand how to cope with problems like these.

I know that I could  create two snapshots (one with the boost and volume of the amp adjusted, another one with the amp without the boost), but this seems to be too much of a hassle for such a simple setup. 

Any hints?

Tutorials?

Cheers!

 

joerch71,

 

I use the gain at the lowest setting with the boost on for one type of "boost" and the opposite (gain adjusted up slightly with the boost off) for another setting.  Once I deactivate the kinky boost I can still keep my volume normalized for the amp I use and its settings.  Any additional volume adjustment is via my guitar pots.

 

While I haven't viewed all the YouTube tutorial videos on Gain Staging , there are some out there when I just did a search prior to replying to your post.

 

Hope this helps.

 

jpd

[joerch71]

Thanks for the response, JPD. I will try that. Maybe the Whowatt103 was "too" clean as well.

Another thing I have noticed while testing the Helix Stadium is that some of the factory presets show internal clipping (e.g. 4A Quiet Time the path arrow at the end of path 1A lights up red). I am using a definitely not high output Tele and still it's clipping. The same is true with 2D Reigning Champ. And others ... I wonder what's wrong? Maybe I should open a new topic for that problem - I haven't read anything about that so far in the Stadium forum - I wonder whether I am the only one to notice this.

[TimAndSmith]

It's not just you. I see the clip light go red on the top path with a number of factory presets. With that said, I don't really hear digital clipping when that happens. I'm almost always using both paths so I suspect that the final output stage is what's most important and I don't see that flash red very often. 

 

Beyond that, I find the factory presets in Stadium to be quite a bit louder than those of the original Helix. After sound engineer feedback, I tended to run my presets on the more quiet side with my old Helix which often had amp "level" (the final level control in HX systems) around 5'ish depending on the amp. In the new Stadium Agora amps, with their new level control that looks more like an audio fader starting a 0 and then boosting or cutting, I often have to make significant cuts to achieve the same output levels. For example, for a Matchless with a level of 5 in old Helix, I have to cut the new Agora AC30 to -21 db. It seems weird but still works fine. 

 

I recommend using some kind of outside metering to determine levels. I use the Youlean Loudness Meter most of the time as it's a simple stand alone app. Other times I have used an analyzer tool in my DAW (Logic). I tend to run my presets between minus 18 and minus 10 LUFS (loudness units). That seems to always leave headroom and the engineers seem to appreciate it. I also run the outputs at Mic level, not Line.

 

In terms of gain staging, it's a good general principle to shoot for unity gain across all your amps and effects. Turn everything off and see what your direct guitar is like gain wise. Then I shoot for keeping most of my amps and effects around that same level. The exception is the gain pedals. In my view, gain pedals are meant give you more color to the sound AND boost the output a bit. I know others might not want that but that's how I do it. I set each gain stage to go up by around 2 LUFS. Another exception is that sometimes I will raise the "Mix" on a reverb or delay on a snapshot. That definitely raises gain at the same time but that's usually for a more dynamic section of a song so it helps compensate for pulling back. 

 

For a while, I used to put the LA2A compressor model at the end of my whole change (LA Studio Comp). I would set it for 2-3db of compression at my loudest sound and unity gain for clean. That can help smooth out gain changes and help "glue" things together as the engineers say. Over time I stopped as it took too much adjustment for every sound and song because it reacts differently with how much gain you feed it. Also, most engineers are compressing it at front of house as well as things can get too squished if you're not careful. 

 

So my recommendation is use some kind of outside metering, decide on a target level, and then adjust everything to fit that standard. If you use one preset for a whole show then you're done. If you use one song per preset, then you have to level all your presets to around the same levels for a cohesive set. 

 

Hope that helps!

[cacibi]

I had a similar question just related to metering. Was going nuts looking for meters and finally found the block meters in the Focus view. But there is no metering on the output block unless you switch to the Matrix mixer. Any other metering or meter views I am missing?

[joerch71]

Now that you mention the Matrix mixer ... I find it quite unexpectable that in a preset in which path 1A is routed to 2A and then to the output, the matrix meter shows that there's a level for 1A and 2A - when I solo 1A nothing can be heard (as expected) - only for 2A. But why is there a level displayed on 1A?

[silverhead]

On 1/15/2026 at 5:42 PM, joerch71 said:

Now that you mention the Matrix mixer ... I find it quite unexpectable that in a preset in which path 1A is routed to 2A and then to the output, the matrix meter shows that there's a level for 1A and 2A - when I solo 1A nothing can be heard (as expected) - only for 2A. But why is there a level displayed on 1A?

Perhaps the Level control on Path 1A Output can be used to cut/boost the (silent) signal entering Input of Path 2A?

[Nos402]

On 1/15/2026 at 2:27 PM, TimAndSmith said:

It's not just you. I see the clip light go red on the top path with a number of factory presets. With that said, I don't really hear digital clipping when that happens. I'm almost always using both paths so I suspect that the final output stage is what's most important and I don't see that flash red very often. 

 

Beyond that, I find the factory presets in Stadium to be quite a bit louder than those of the original Helix. After sound engineer feedback, I tended to run my presets on the more quiet side with my old Helix which often had amp "level" (the final level control in HX systems) around 5'ish depending on the amp. In the new Stadium Agora amps, with their new level control that looks more like an audio fader starting a 0 and then boosting or cutting, I often have to make significant cuts to achieve the same output levels. For example, for a Matchless with a level of 5 in old Helix, I have to cut the new Agora AC30 to -21 db. It seems weird but still works fine. 

 

I recommend using some kind of outside metering to determine levels. I use the Youlean Loudness Meter most of the time as it's a simple stand alone app. Other times I have used an analyzer tool in my DAW (Logic). I tend to run my presets between minus 18 and minus 10 LUFS (loudness units). That seems to always leave headroom and the engineers seem to appreciate it. I also run the outputs at Mic level, not Line.

 

In terms of gain staging, it's a good general principle to shoot for unity gain across all your amps and effects. Turn everything off and see what your direct guitar is like gain wise. Then I shoot for keeping most of my amps and effects around that same level. The exception is the gain pedals. In my view, gain pedals are meant give you more color to the sound AND boost the output a bit. I know others might not want that but that's how I do it. I set each gain stage to go up by around 2 LUFS. Another exception is that sometimes I will raise the "Mix" on a reverb or delay on a snapshot. That definitely raises gain at the same time but that's usually for a more dynamic section of a song so it helps compensate for pulling back. 

 

For a while, I used to put the LA2A compressor model at the end of my whole change (LA Studio Comp). I would set it for 2-3db of compression at my loudest sound and unity gain for clean. That can help smooth out gain changes and help "glue" things together as the engineers say. Over time I stopped as it took too much adjustment for every sound and song because it reacts differently with how much gain you feed it. Also, most engineers are compressing it at front of house as well as things can get too squished if you're not careful. 

 

So my recommendation is use some kind of outside metering, decide on a target level, and then adjust everything to fit that standard. If you use one preset for a whole show then you're done. If you use one song per preset, then you have to level all your presets to around the same levels for a cohesive set. 

 

Hope that helps!

 

I too use Youlean and have my Stadium hooked up via USB-C. I make sure all my presets are hitting around -23, maybe a little more for a solo boost, and that always gets everything at least in the same ballpark, even if there's always some tweaking that still has to be done once you scale it up to a full PA (I run direct).

[PaulTBaker]

just a question? why -23?  I have always heard that -18 average is the sweet spot.  I run mine around -18 to -12 max.  That is use the Youlean loudness meter as a stand alone app connected by USB-C cable.

 

Just as an aside, In some patches, the bottom red output will flash red, even though the LUFS meter is around -15.  Other patches, will have the LUFS meter much higher at -10 or so and the bottom output will not flash red.

 

Would like to know more info on how the bottom output block works (as far as the green/red flashing) goes.

[bbehrens]

I, too have noticed the red flash in the output blocks at the end of each path. I have noticed that the effects can bunch up rather quickly where you start a clean path with -23 dBA and just a few blocks later with an amp are getting the red light up at the end of the path with the default settings. You have to pay much more attention to the gain staging than you did with the older unit. However, this is all new hardware and underlying architecture so my guess is that the block have not been fine tuned to the Stadium yet by Line 6 - though I can't imagine why not... Anyways, it would be good for someone who has the know how to do some null tests or other digital goodness to see what the actual input/output of each of the block actually is.

 

Jason Sadites has preached a Gospel of do what you want and don't worry about gain staging for the non-transparent blocks (e.g. EQ, Compression, Distortion, Fuzz, POG, etc.) but watch how you use the Delays, Reverbs, etc. (You know, those effects that last over new notes that cumulatively up the gain). But the Stadium does indeed to appear to be a might more sensitive.

 

Anybody got any hard data to share?