Delay Before Reverb? (general 'pedal' Sequence Thoughts)

[ColonelForbin]

Very interesting; according to common wisdom I've been putting the delay and 'verb in the wrong order; for a *long* time! lol :)

Yeah, just been reading up many various articles and opinions discussing pedal / effect sequence; I figured it's a good way to approach thinking about the HD500, especially in terms of integrating external pedals into the HD500 fx loop.

 

Anyhow, somethings you read, and certain experiences and/or 'what makes sense click and make you go 'yeah!", others make you go - 'no way..', and others 'what??". I just read several articles discussing why reverb should go last, preceded only by delay. For some strange reason, I've been putting reverb and then delay. Only recently have I started programming patches on the HD500 quite differently with my digging in to figuring out how to use external / analog pedals while still using the VDI connection from my JTV to the HD500, on to the DT25, etc.

 

It got me searching, reading, and thinking about the ideas involved in "why" certain effects - whether they are digital models, or actual pedals - go in a certain sequence.

 

It became an interesting notion; to focus in on such a limiting (in a good way) to the process, which quite frankly, when thinking about the HD500, can be quite mind boggling due to the abundance of options.

 

I also like Keeley pedals, though have never had a ton of luck making them play nice with the Line6 gear. Still can't say I have, of course, I could just plug in a bunch of pedals to the front and fx loop of the dt25, and skip the HD500 all together - but what's the fun in that!

 

SO, here's what I've got -thoughts, comments, revisions, opinions - all most welcome!~ (first draft, offline - need to actually plug it all in this weekend and see what *sounds* good)

 

JTV59 > vdi > HD500 > [wah] > [fx loop] > [keeley pedals]:

:[1.envelope filter, 2.phaser, 3.compressor, 4.overdrive, 5.overdrive]> effects return to HD500:

:[noise gate] > [amp model] > [delay 1] > [delay 2] > [reverb 1] > [reverb 2] > l6link to DT25 > [fx loop] > [keeley pedals]:

:6.chorus, 7.clean boost > effects return to DT25,

 

1. envelope = keeley neutrino

2. phaser = keeley phaser

3. comp = keeley 4-knob comp

4. overdrive = keeley white sand drive

5. overdrive = keeley bootlegger

6. chorus = keeley seafoam chorus

7. clean boost = keeley time machine

[Brazzy]

Good post, I always run the reverb last in the chain and sometimes the volume pedals at the very end. Also i use the the Mod and Delay in front of the amp or after in that order. I try other ways too but it seems like always end up with this order depending on what I hear. I don't have a JTV just the X3 Pro, HD500 and a bunch of guitars.

[innovine]

If you can survive without the wah, I'd be tempted to put 1-5 on front of the pod and so skip its fx loop.

 

If you have money for more gear, adding an eq before and/or after the overdrives would open up a lot of tone territory. You could investigate this by losing the wah and putting some gear before the pod, then a pod eq, then the rest of the gear in the pods fx loop, but the eqs on the pod are imho nowhere near as nice as my boss ge-7.

[innovine]

Is the phaser before the overdrives nice? I thought its a rule of thumb to have such things after the distotions. Haven't used it myself..

[innovine]

Oh, and for what its worth, I frequently skip my pod and use the dt25 like a classic guitar rig. I find it much more fun! Pod is too fiddly and too many options, plus I have a couple of pedals which get me the tones I want, so no real need for pod emulations. Pod opens up lots of options but often kills my creativity and actual playing time. Ymmv of course but if you find yourself constantly moving fx around and not playing guitar, disconnect the damn thing for a while.

[Brazzy]

Oh, and for what its worth, I frequently skip my pod and use the dt25 like a classic guitar rig. I find it much more fun! Pod is too fiddly and too many options, plus I have a couple of pedals which get me the tones I want, so no real need for pod emulations. Pod opens up lots of options but often kills my creativity and actual playing time. Ymmv of course but if you find yourself constantly moving fx around and not playing guitar, disconnect the damn thing for a while.

 

Good suggestion, I often just pllug the guitar right into the amp (DT50 in my case) also, it gets ya going fast and sounds absolutely great. Lately I've been monitoring with small speakers or headphones while playing with the HD500's effects and collect patches I feel are intersting then later try them into the front of the amp, tweak them if need be and save to a setlist or batch file.

[Palico]

Good post, I always run the reverb last in the chain sometimes the volume pedals end at the very end. Also i use the the Mod and Delay in front of the amp or after in that order. I try other ways too but it seems like always end up with this order depending on what I hear. I don't have a JTV just the X3 Pro, HD500 and a bunch of guitars.

 

Love to put the Volume Pedal at the end of the chain. It basicly works like a master volume on the floor. I can roll down the volume on the guitar itself if I want that clean up effect.  I read on post the other day for Surf type of Reverb sound to put the Reverb unit in front of the amp, so I guess it's all about what sound you are after.  I've found Mod effects can work well before or after. I always liked a phaser after the distorsion as it makes the phaser toned down a bit. Before it could give you some wild swirls thought.

[alienux]

I've always put reverb last in my chain. I guess it comes from having used real amps with built in reverb, but putting pedals in front of the amp. My normal signal chain before modelers was always guitar-pedals-amp w/reverb (and hence reverb last), so that's what I've always set my modeling up to follow.

 

Edit: I do, however, now put timing affects after the amp in the signal chain on both my Vypyr VIP 2 and on my POD HD500X, but still end with reverb.

[ColonelForbin]

Oh, and for what its worth, I frequently skip my pod and use the dt25 like a classic guitar rig.

 

I had that thought today when I was driving to work, and actually just wrote a long, rambling 'morning coffee' response to a post radatats wrote. I had this idea about running the JTV dual outputs,1/4" into the stomp boxes > DT25, and then using the VDI > HD500, and program FX loop send to create some crazy layered sound into the DT25 fx return, merging it with the front input analog boxes.

 

Not entirely sure what that would accomplish! I also thought about integrating an L2t in there, esp for when I want to mute the front input going to the DT25.

 

Too many ideas dreamed up during car drives - I need to spend some time with *actual* gear, at *actual* levels - this weekend, God willing!!!!! Until then, lots of brainstorming.

 

I was trying to sort out how to get the pedals between the guitar and the HD500, and it could work to use the 1/4", instead of the FX loop, maybe get an A/B switcher, so I can have my strat on deck without having to jump through too many hoops. Could still run the VDI to the HD500 to power the JTV, doesn't need to part of the signal path to power the guitar..

 

Which was also part of my other tangent idea, split the variax and the mags - though that hasn't come to fruition yet. Still figuring out how the heck to do it! Dual amp path, split the inputs, route the FX loop send, etc. Got to try ideas with things plugged in, see what makes noise and ground loops - sometimes being complicated gets me in trouble!

 

As for pedal sequence, keep the ideas coming. I have read alot of ideas on things like comp before or after drive, phaser before or after distortion, even where the wah / pitch shifting is happiest. Lots of ideas in place, need to do some logical test driving. But thinking it through is quite helpful! Looking forward to assembling a pedal board, getting some of the industrial velcro we sell here at work.. Ordered an isolated power supply (VoodooLabs), and a PedalTrain pedal board, and looks like I am going to snag a used Tarcase hard case from craigslist next week, for the HD500.

 

There is something about deciding the sequence of a pedal that is a little more tangible when you connect cables and power, and have to decide what happens before and after it - that process is an experiment, but there is also a logic to it, that if followed, can be quite a useful guide.

 

That's how I got to the reverb before delay realization - someone wrote "don't want to delay repeat my reverb tails". Someone else said "delays into room, not room delay repeats". It makes sense in that kind of thought process. The subtle distinction of whether a chorus is a post effect, or should be treated as a tremelo - where to put phaser vs envelope, some of it just makes sense. Certain effects *need* to have a guitar or as near to clean guitar signal as possible, both in terms of actual audio, but also impedance and buffering. Other things are more subjective, like "how" you want to make an effect work.

 

You can use a clean boost to make a signal louder,  if it's "post", or make the drive more saturated, if it's "pre". You can use a comp to even out dynamics if it's before a distortion, or control overall volume while preserving dynamic intensity if it's after a drive pedal. What I did find, sometimes just came down to how the gear likes to hear things - where I place the outboard compressor vs. the modeled comps in the HD500 made a big difference. With a regular tube amp, a comp in the FX loop can do some awesome things. Not so much in the HD500 signal path, it was a lot pickier about where it should be placed.

 

I know that some amount of white noise was introduced with the external pedals, and I wanted to minimize the amount of noise gate that I had to use, so to some extent things like that overruled certain momentary "ahh-hah!" moments. Sure you can drive the heck out of a dist pedal, run it into a comp, and control the volume and sustain - however, if that comp gets switched "OFF", you have a problem, houston! BAmm, level spikes galore. Which is why I ended up putting that comp way closer to the front of the signal chain, after the wah and envelope - though not certain where phaser belongs, before or after, will likely come down to how it *sounds* to me, more than what I think about it.

 

Certain ideas are almost common sense - reverb and delay before drive pedals or amp inputs don't sound right to me - there is nothing *wrong* with doing that, I just prefer the delay to repeat what comes before it, rather than be affected by what comes after it. In particular hitting a delay and big reverb with a drive pedal after causes some intense spikes in level and that's just how it sounds to me. That's what I thought was so funny, that for years I've had the dang reverb in front of the delay, and never bothered to see what other people thought it should be - or even take the time to realize the simple fact, that if it's a regular amp with an effects loop, the reverb is *last* not matter what you do! Lol. Fun stuff, feels like going back to school or something, in a good way.

 

Little things add up to big things too, especially white noise, buzz, hum and the impact a compressor has on that noise. My buddy uses one of those daisy chain power supplies, the Spot or something. Never occured to me that it could be causing him all this extra noise - he has a Decimator noise gate, it goes last in the chain, in the FX Loop - and it works great, though it does tend to chop his decay as noise creeps in. Switch it off though, and his signal chain is a buzzing angry bees nest of noise. He has a couple pedals in there that are not 'true bypass', which could also be causing him problems. Little things like true bypass and isolated power supply go a *long* way to making your tone pure. In many ways, the HD500 takes most of that hassle out of the equation, but also causes us to no longer think in that 'real world' mode of thought about such technical details. Which is good, but also something worth keeping in the back of your mind.

 

An aside to that; the newer Decimator pedal actually does some cool stuff - check it out:

 

"ISP's Decimator II guitar pedal ups the ante over the original Decimator design to give you even better noise reduction. An 1/8 phone cord lets two pedals directly track your axe, delivering amazing tracking performance. You can use one block of Decimator between your guitar and amp and a second in your effects loop."

 

One thing is for sure; being a guitarist obsessed with tone is something that none of us will *ever* get bored with! There a virtually infinite tone control options available; check out these 20 boutique pedals, I've never heard of most of this stuff, and the prices are steep - in many cases, way more than Keeley (which is already pretty spendy stuff)T

 

This article is cool too, gives some background info on five boutique pedal makers:

[Palico]

I've always put reverb last in my chain. I guess it comes from having used real amps with built in reverb, but putting pedals in front of the amp. My normal signal chain before modelers was always guitar-pedals-amp w/reverb (and hence reverb last), so that's what I've always set my modeling up to follow.

 

Yep, I used to be the same. Then even before I moved over to the digtial world, I discovered effects looper were made for reason.

[nikoniablue]

Always do the same in HD500 as in real life.  Order is: Gate -> Compressor -> Distortion -> Wah or other filter FX -> Amp -> Chorus -> Delay -> Reverb.  Location of volume pedal depends on whether I want to control the volume of the whole patch - in which case I put it last, or for controlling level of drive of the front end of the amp  model - in which case it goes after the compression.  Reverb always last because it creates the imitation acoustic environment in which the rest happens (as it were...).  Having said that, there's no right answer.  I find myself too reverting to just a couple of real pedals (a drive and a delay) in front of the DT25.

[Triryche]

Reverb is typically last for me too.

 

Sometimes I will put delay after reverb for some wacky effects, like an over the top reverb that I want to hear the delay of.

[alienux]

Yep, I used to be the same. Then even before I moved over to the digtial world, I discovered effects looper were made for reason.

Unfortunately for a young me (14 at the time), I had no idea how to use the effects loop on my Crate G120C. I used that amp for over 15 years before getting another one and learning what the loop was really for.

[billlorentzen]

I would go with compressor for clean comping first, wah/envelope, dist, amp, compressor for sustain on lead lines, modulations, delay than verb. If you want a vol pedal after, put it before the delay and verb, so they can die naturally. If vol pedal before amp, usually put them after compressor, before dist pedal.

[ColonelForbin]

Always do the same in HD500 as in real life.  Order is: Gate -> Compressor -> Distortion -> Wah or other filter FX -> Amp -> Chorus -> Delay -> Reverb. 

 

Interesting, will have to try that! I was always going with the notion that the wah and envelope stuff wanted to be as close to the guitar signal as possible - and in terms of where I was placing the noise gate, it was primarily for filtering any 'external pedal' noise post-fx loop, before it hit the rest of the HD processing and amp model.

 

What is the school of thought, for example - with wah - for why it would prefer to be before or after a comp, or in particular, as being "first" in the signal chain? (in this case, as close as it can be, IE: JTV > vdi > HD500 > wah > effects send..)

 

I was thinking I like the idea of wah going through the compressor - originally had been moving the comp way back in the signal chain, into the post position, but didn't have very good luck doing this with the onboard comps in the HD500.

 

I've done that in the 'real world' in a tube amps fx loop to allow the drive and master / channel volume to be increased much more than would normally be 'safe' volume (think Fender Hot Rod at like 5 or 6, instead of 1 or 2) and just brought the master speaker volume down that way. In the POD HD world, that idea seems to not work so well.

 

My buddy that I jam with is borrowing my Keeley 4-knob, we tried using it in his Fender tweed fx loop, but in terms of how it interacted with his other pedals, wasn't playing 'nice'. I think he ended up bumping it way up front, possibly even in that same first position, either right before or after the wah.

 

I guess comp before wah means less dynamics to the wah; comp after wah means less dynamic sweep in the wah range. I also was always thinking of placing the comp after the drive pedals, but more and more have been leaning towards moving my other Keeley 4-knob comp up to closer to the front end.

 

Interesting, thanks for the ideas!

[ColonelForbin]

Is the phaser before the overdrives nice? I thought its a rule of thumb to have such things after the distotions. Haven't used it myself..

 

You know, I have no clue! I read some interesting things that talked about where Eddie Van Halen used his phaser in relation to the drives. I suppose if it's "pre" amp model and the amp model is overdriven, then it's that sound, vs being in the "post" slot, in the amps effects loop.

 

I guess it comes down to whether it's being used like a chorus / modulation, or something different.

 

I actually just got the phaser from Sweetwater, it arrived today with the little pedalboard / pedaltrain box and a Voodoo Lab power supply (8 x 9v isolated power).

 

What I am really psyched about is that it has two modes - "tap tempo" to get that sound - and it also has a "ramp" function, where you preset the slow and fast settings, and it allows you to "ramp" between them and lets you set the rate of the ramping. Basically, like a leslie speaker slowing down or speeding up!

 

Here's the blurb from the little mini manual Keeley sent with the phaser:

 

-has mid range emphasis, similar to the Maestro PS-1A vintage phaser

-uses transconductance amplifiers (OTA) like the original Mu-tron phaser. (instead of JFET)

 

Keeley Phaser Placement: Before or After Distortion:

 

-Before distortion (aka 'pre gain'): The Keeley phaser provides both a tonal phase shifting effect as well as qualities similar to those provided in univibe / chorus units. Because of this, adding the Phaser before a distortion unit produces a more "vintage" style effect, with milder sweeps coupled with phase harmonic overtones and timbres that get compressed by the distortion unit. If going for a milder quality phase with an emphasis on overtones and harmonics, use your phaser in this position

 

-After distortion (aka 'post gain'): For the most dramatic and contemporary phasing effect, use the Keeley Phaser after your distortion unit. Most guitar amp effects loops are post-gain by design (the phaser can be used in an effects loop) and are therefore equal to placement of the Keeley Phaser after distortion. In this position, the phaser delivers it's full phase sweep and regenerative qualities without the compression quality of a distortion pedal.

 

http://www.legendarytones.com/keeleyphaser.html

[ColonelForbin]

I would go with compressor for clean comping first, wah/envelope, dist, amp, compressor for sustain on lead lines, modulations, delay than verb. If you want a vol pedal after, put it before the delay and verb, so they can die naturally. If vol pedal before amp, usually put them after compressor, before dist pedal.

 

Interesting idea; I can see the merits in using two comps, for different purposes! I suppose I could run one of the HD500 comps up front, hit the wah, then send the FX loop out to the envelope, distortion pedals, then the Keeley comp, then back to the HD500 - and then I'd be putting the phaser, chorus and clean booster in the FX Loop of the DT25.

 

Might have to fuss around with that idea, see what sounds best!

[billlorentzen]

Interesting idea; I can see the merits in using two comps, for different purposes! I suppose I could run one of the HD500 comps up front, hit the wah, then send the FX loop out to the envelope, distortion pedals, then the Keeley comp, then back to the HD500 - and then I'd be putting the phaser, chorus and clean booster in the FX Loop of the DT25.

 

Might have to fuss around with that idea, see what sounds best!

Definitely fuss with it - and it is fussy without a meter or LEDs showing amount of gain reduction (Line6 ought to get that together on their next line of products). There are a lots of different compression sounds, though subtle. FYI, in the studio there's a trick of using 2 or 3 compressors in line with very gentle curves to tame peaks without it being obvious. Some compressors themselves actually have two compression circuits in line.

 

As an engineer, I look at amp f/x usage from my studio experience, which both informs me as to how things will sound, and equally importantly, how,they actually work, for best results.

 

Before I got into modeling preamps, I hadn't used any pedals other than volume and wah for probably 20 years. I used all studio rack gear and Mesa boogie heads or preamps in the rack. Frankly, the only distortion pedal I ever owned was the MXR Distortion+, which I hated (but I got good money for it as a vintage pedal on eBay!) and I was a real snob about amp dist vs pedal. With the HD I use the screamer quite a bit, in fact almost always when I want a ballsy sound, BUT, you can get the same kind of tight distortion using compressors and cranked amps.

 

So try everything, but a little logical thought and some studio tricks can save some time in what you try.

[DeanDinosaur]

Common wisdom is the reverb is usually last for guitar sound, but for a certain polished studio sound that's also  common try a chorus after the reverb.

[ColonelForbin]

Common wisdom is the reverb is usually last for guitar sound, but for a certain polished studio sound that's also  common try a chorus after the reverb.

 

I was wondering about that concept - I had been messing with placing my chorus pedal into the DT25 effects loop, and I wasn't really sure *where* in the signal chain that actually placed it. I would guess that would likely place it in one of two places: either right after the amp model; or at the end of the HD500 path, which would be less ideal - the chorus I would think from all the responses I've seen wants to be before the reverb and delay.. Kind of hard to tell where it actually ends up, I am thinking it's possible that idea (fx loop of DT25 while using L6Link) maybe isn't going to do what I was thinking it would do.

 

I was actually looking at going so far as to place the chorus, phaser and a clean boost into the DT25 effects loop - but I might be rethinking that concept.

[ColonelForbin]

Yeah, I have a tendency to overthink it while I am in the 'planning' stages; it's a terrible pun, but it helps to be grounded with actually plugging in the gear! ;)

 

I just stumbled across yet another fantastic piece of gear, the Sonuus Wahoo; oh man, this thing is steep in $$! $350... But it looks amazing. It's a pure analog wah / envelope filter pedal with digital control.

 

http://www.sonuus.com/products_wahoo.html

 

http://www.sweetwater.com/store/detail/Wahoo/

 

Check out the video in the Sweetwater link - this device has a setting that pitch tracks your input signal, and only applies the wah sound when you *bend* notes. IT also has some killer sounding autowah and envelope effects. It's looking pretty darn tasty right now..

 

I tend to get these ideas on my drive to and from work; I recently moved to the burbs, my wife and I finally bought a house (two years of searching!) and I still work in downtown Chicago, so the drive is crazy. But I will be listening to tunes on Spotify and start daydreaming about plugging things in a certain way, or what-if patch ideas for the HD500, and whatnot. "What happens if" tends to be a common theme that launches me into new ideas..

 

I've been struggling with focusing on a certain path for thinking about the gear, it's like there are too many options, yet none are without limitations.

 

Just last night I started thinking about yet another way to set up the HD500 patch + external pedals. It started while I was thinking about incorporating an A/B switcher, so I can have both my strat and JTV plugged in via 1/4" and toggle between them.

 

That got me to thinking, well what if I plug the 1/4" from the JTV into a sequence of these pedals, but still run the VDI to the HD500 - and that got me thinking, well I could split those signals up in a dual amp path, and run various HD500 FX blocks on the VDI signal, then re-merge them at the post amp chain into a mono signal - and then run them into the FX loop to go to more external pedals, and conclude going through HD500 delays and reverbs, and then L6Link to the DT25.

 

I was stuck with the idea of pedal placement; not wanting to put a wah at the post of an series of drive pedals, or not wanting to run the phaser in the DT25 FX loop, assuming it will probably end up post of any delays I put into the HD500 post section - still not sure about that, will have to get some delay repeats going, and put the phaser in the DT25 FX Loop, and see if it phases the clean repeats, or not.

 

Anyway, I was thinking what would it be like to have two parallel signal paths - use the FS / HD500 effects on the VDI and have those be a unique signal path from the outboard effects.

 

That's what led me to check out that Wahoo gadget; would end up with that at the front of the 1/4" chain, with a 'clean' bypass of the VDI going into whatever effects I feel like programming on the second channel. If I even wanted to run stereo through my L2t's, it would be as easy as keeping the two signals divided up and switching from combo/poweramp to studio/direct, L6Linking the two L2t's, and just feeding the DT fx return with a mono 1/4" from the HD500.

 

I might end up trying that rig out tonight! Will let you all know what kind of mess I make of things.

 

Cheers, and Happy Friday!

[ColonelForbin]

Had an awesome all-acoustic rehearsal / trio at my place after work last night; fired up my replacement M20d, and it did just fine this time. We used two Audix drum mics to record the two guitars (condensor mics, overheads), and ran a Beta 57A on the cajon sound hole, and plopped a condensor mic on the floor in front of the cajon, just for some extra "woomph".

 

After the guys went home I stayed up *way too late* planning out and starting to velcro up my new Pedaltrain pedalboard. More parts of the puzzle will be arriving next week, it's a long slow process!

 

Reading up on how the heck I can mount the Voodoo Lab power supply under the pedaltrain board; found some sharp looking photos of other peoples gear where it looks quite tidy and clean! I thought I was going to have to eat space on the top for the power supply, but it looks like I can use the brackets the pedalboard came with and get my power drill out

 

Some photos here and here; of the underside mounted power supply on some other folks pedaltrain pedalboards.

 

Realized when I was building some of the HD500 patches I had dreamed up to interface with external / analog pedals, that my HD500 hits that DSP limit when I try to run the dual-signal path chain. DOH!

 

I think I just need to simplify the use of FX; though can't really get around using dual amp models; using the 'pre' version for use with my DT25, so it ends up summed to mono anyway.

 

Right now, I have been trying to create a dual signal path out of my JTV, where I run the 1/4" cable into the pedalboard and run that through the "pre" set of stomp boxes - then send that into the guitar in on the HD500. And, connect the VDI to the variax input, run that on a second channel / amp model, and process both signals in parallel until the very end of the signal path; where I would merge the two into a delay and reverb. I built the patches offline, which doesn't give you the DSP warning! So, back to edit and figure out what needs to be there, and what doesn't.

 

I did realize certain amp models burn more DSP than others, and when I get crazy and put a particle verb near the end of the chain it usually puts it over the top, if I have all the other FS settings with an effect each (using the 8 FS setting)

[ColonelForbin]

Found this cool video, Glenn DeLaune using some analog pedals in front of an HD bean POD into the front input of a Marshall amp. way cool!

 

[johnnyayyy]

In my experience the reverb always works best at the end of the chain UNLESS I am shooting for a surf tone - you can get a very convincing 60s surf sound by putting the 63 Reverb first in the chain, before the Twin amp, and then cranking everything way up. Single coil guitar is almost mandatory to nail this tone, Strat is best IMO.

[ColonelForbin]

Anyone using pedals by JHS? Just what I needed, more gear to obsess over and spend copious amounts of $$ on! Lol, G.A.S., it's an epidemic of musical proportions. :)

 

Anyhow, just saw this blurb on Sweetwater, they now carry JHS pedals:

 

JHS Pedals (on Sweetwater)

 

JHS Pedals website

 

"Each JHS pedal is hand built and tested by the JHS team in Kansas City, Missouri."

 

They have an analog (bucker brigade) delay pedal with tap tempo, with expression pedal input! Wayyy cool..

 

JHS "Panther Cub" delay

 

They also have a slew of mini sized cases with some very cool and useful stuff, like A/B, splitter, buffer ,etc.

 

The buffer pedal in particular looks interesting - didn't realize that "true bypass" can actually cause some problems if you connect several pedals.. More research for me to do!

 

Little Black Buffer

"For those of us who are a little “pedal happy†there can be some downfall to our tone. When running a pedal board with more than one or two effects, something called “capacitance†happens. This is where the “Little Black Buffer†steps in providing the perfect input impedance to your rig and giving you the final result of clear, natural tone that sounds like you're plugged straight into your amp no matter how many pedals you use."

 

Buffered Splitter

"Need to split your signal? Don’t want to settled for a passive device that will kill your tone and cause signal loss? This is what you need! This little box of magic takes your input signal and splits it into two always-on outputs that are buffered so you don’t loose clarity or tone in any way."

 

Little Black Amp Box

"If your amp has a “send/return†effects loop simply connect the input to your SEND and the output to your RETURN. You can use the LBAB to saturate your preamp section and get some cranked tube tone at bedroom levels!"

 

Mute Switch

"Simple, solid and very useful. Have you ever needed a simple mute switch with no frills? Just hit the footswitch and anything plugged into the input is made 100% silent. Has a dual color LED that shines green when signal is hot and red when the mute is on."

 

Mini A/B

"A good solid A/B box can be a guitarist's best friend. We make ours from a Hammond 1.5"x3.6†metal enclosure with high quality jacks and switch. We also include a dual color (red/green) LED to let you know by sight if your using A or B. This is very practical in a live situation. Here are the best uses for our handmade Mini A/B."

 

Mini Tap Tempo

"A small 1.5"x3.6†foot print make this a go to tap tempo controller for all you needs.  This comes standard with three outputs and one has a polarity toggle to allow for use of normally open and normally closed tap driven pedals."

 

Stutter Switch

"This super small little 2†box allows you to momentarily mute your signal. For years guitarist have done this by using their pickup selector on their Les Paul or even installing momentary “Kill Switch†buttons into their guitars, but now all you need to do is slap this guy on your board. No power needed as it is a totally passive device. Just tap away, and as your foot touches the switch, your signal is muted. Think of this as your own manual tremolo!"

[ColonelForbin]

http://youtu.be/sexnpn-3Dp0

 

[FlyingsCool]

It's one thing to place pedals in "accepted best positions", i.e. comp, wah, distortion, modulation, delay, reverb....

But sometimes you just gotta go with what sounds good for you!  Quit thinkin', try it, see if you like it.....

[joel_brown]

Here's an interesting effect.  Put a compressor after the reverb. 

[ColonelForbin]

It's one thing to place pedals in "accepted best positions", i.e. comp, wah, distortion, modulation, delay, reverb....

But sometimes you just gotta go with what sounds good for you!  Quit thinkin', try it, see if you like it.....

 

Yeah, I did a bunch of playing time this weekend! Funny how things that make sense shift around with cables, power and amps involved.

 

I did discover some interesting things, regarding splitting the variax and variax mags. I am going to mess about with putting a rack unit into the effects loop, put that post amp model. I liked hearing the split between the modeled guitars and the humbuckers, but I was doing it backwards - VDI to HD500, then split, and send the mags out the effects loop into the analog gear.

 

Am thinking run the 1/4" out of the JTV into the analog pedals along input 1=guitar/amp A, run the vdi into hd500, define input 2 as variax mags, into amp model B.

 

Then in the post section, run the HD500 effects loop out into the Eleven Rack, into the first  batch of "post" FX, then send the ElevenRack fx loop into analog pedals, end with the noise gate, fx return back to the ElevenRack, and hit the final post FX (delay, reverb). I was mucking about with running pedals in the DT25 effects loop, but will try it this way, see what happens! Should have time after work tomorrow..

[mdmayfield]

The order of effects is a really interesting thing to experiment with. The difference that Reverb -> Delay vs. Delay -> Reverb makes depends on the circumstances:

 

If the delay and reverb in question are perfectly linear time-invariant (LTI) effects - that is,:

 

- they don't add any kind of overdrive or distortion (i.e. they're linear), and

- they don't change in any way over time (i.e. they're time-invariant)

 

Then there can be no difference in sound between R->D vs. D->R, at least for that particular reverb and that particular delay, when they're placed right next to each other. (Someone better at wave physics and signal processing theory than me could even prove that mathematically.)

 

If there are other effects in between the reverb and delay, then of course swapping the delay and reverb could potentially make a big difference. Also, the further away from perfectly linear time-invariant the specific effects are, the more difference their order could potentially make, even if they're adjacent in the signal chain.

 

Analog delays and reverbs are never perfectly LTI (some are far from it) though some are close approximations. Some digitally modeled delays and reverbs, though (which operate only in the digital domain), are perfectly LTI.