jroseberry Posted October 21, 2016 Share Posted October 21, 2016 Hi Folks, Inspired by the work of Glenn DeLaune, I decided to create some "tone shaping" IRs using a hardware Neve EQ. Note that these are not cab IRs, they're strictly for shaping the tone of your existing amp/cab. The IRs were designed to soften the high-end... and fatten up the bottom and low mids. I was using my Friedman 2x12 cab IRs (free) when creating them... but they should be applicable to many different circumstances. The name scheme is like this (Bass, Middle, Treble): Neve EQ +1 00 +1 Bass = +1 Middle = 0 Treble = 1 I hope many of you find them useful. http://www.studiocat.com/temp/Neve_tone_IRs.zip 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
psarkissian Posted October 21, 2016 Share Posted October 21, 2016 Some Neve EQ's use passive filtering switching from one RC network to another using a rotary switch. Then adjusting the gain of that band by running the filtered signal thru a Voltage Controlled Amp (VCA). Gives good gain, and since the filters are passive and not active, the roll-off rate (dB/oct) is smoother, not a lot of ring points (ripple) or emphasis bump prior to roll-off. Yeah, Neve EQ's are nice. The VCA's are sealed, and they are pricey to replace. IR or emulation is less pricey, and gets very close to the real thing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jmp22684 Posted October 21, 2016 Share Posted October 21, 2016 Off topic a little and sorry for that. I would like to learn more about tone shaping IRs and how to create them. I have searched around for various phrases along the lines of "tone shape IR" "IR tone match" "eq match IR" ect... Do you know of a good source of information on this you could point me to? Or tell me all about it! ;) I have been looking into tone matching and if there where any open source free utilities to do this. I know some think tone matching software is over rated, but personally I think it could serve as an invaluable learning tool. Would love to see Line 6 implement something like this into the Helix, as we see many units on the market today advertising such a feature. Again... Sorry for hijacking the thread. I just read this and it has been something I have been lightly researching on the side. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hideout Posted October 22, 2016 Share Posted October 22, 2016 This makes me think that it might be possible to have tape saturation IRs. That would be cool! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HonestOpinion Posted October 22, 2016 Share Posted October 22, 2016 Hi Folks, Inspired by the work of Glenn DeLaune, I decided to create some "tone shaping" IRs using a hardware Neve EQ. Note that these are not cab IRs, they're strictly for shaping the tone of your existing amp/cab. The IRs were designed to soften the high-end... and fatten up the bottom and low mids. I was using my Friedman 2x12 cab IRs (free) when creating them... but they should be applicable to many different circumstances. The name scheme is like this (Bass, Middle, Treble): Neve EQ +1 00 +1 Bass = +1 Middle = 0 Treble = 1 I hope many of you find them useful. http://www.studiocat.com/temp/Neve_tone_IRs.zip Thanks for contributing these! If you ever feel so inspired some Neve EQ IRs for tweaking vocals on the Helix would be great as well. Can this be done? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spikey Posted October 22, 2016 Share Posted October 22, 2016 TYVM Jim! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FullMotion Posted October 22, 2016 Share Posted October 22, 2016 Very cool! Thanks for this. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
malhavok Posted October 24, 2016 Share Posted October 24, 2016 Awesome stuff. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mdmayfield Posted October 24, 2016 Share Posted October 24, 2016 This makes me think that it might be possible to have tape saturation IRs. That would be cool!Unfortunately that's not possible with IRs alone. Impulse responses only measure linear, time-invariant aspects of something. That includes EQ curves, phase shifts per frequency that don't change over time, and reverberation / ringing. Distortion and saturation are examples of changes that are non-linear... therefore not captured in an IR. Also, chorus, phaser, flanger, and other modulation effects are time-*variant* and not captured in an IR either. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hideout Posted October 24, 2016 Share Posted October 24, 2016 Unfortunately that's not possible with IRs alone. Impulse responses only measure linear, time-invariant aspects of something. That includes EQ curves, phase shifts per frequency that don't change over time, and reverberation / ringing. Distortion and saturation are examples of changes that are non-linear... therefore not captured in an IR. Also, chorus, phaser, flanger, and other modulation effects are time-*variant* and not captured in an IR either. Thanks for the clarification... dang it! Lol This makes me think though, about the fact that the actions of a speaker are not static. They are not time invariant. All kinds of changes are happening as a speaker goes through its excursions. Its cone changes shape as it moves and so does its sound. "Cone Cry" and its effects doesn't even begin to enter the picture. Yet, we use impulse responses, a technique that does not take time variations into account. We're only getting part of the picture. As long as this is the case, getting truly realistic sounding cab sims will continue to elude us. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scotty_burford Posted October 24, 2016 Share Posted October 24, 2016 Thank you. So would these be placed in the IR block after the amp, after the speaker...or load them into a DAW when recording? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jroseberry Posted October 24, 2016 Author Share Posted October 24, 2016 Thanks for the clarification... dang it! Lol This makes me think though, about the fact that the actions of a speaker are not static. They are not time invariant. All kinds of changes are happening as a speaker goes through its excursions. Its cone changes shape as it moves and so does its sound. "Cone Cry" and its effects doesn't even begin to enter the picture. Yet, we use impulse responses, a technique that does not take time variations into account. We're only getting part of the picture. As long as this is the case, getting truly realistic sounding cab sims will continue to elude us. This is absolutely true. Impulse-Responses capture the "filter" part of the speaker... but not the "ballistics". Dynamic convolution would capture at least some of the ballistics... but it's under patent by Focusrite. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jroseberry Posted October 24, 2016 Author Share Posted October 24, 2016 Thank you. So would these be placed in the IR block after the amp, after the speaker...or load them into a DAW when recording? I was placing them post amp/cab in Helix (think they're most effective in this position)... but you can certainly place them pre cab. You can also load the IRs into a convolution plugin in your DAW. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jroseberry Posted October 24, 2016 Author Share Posted October 24, 2016 Thanks for contributing these! If you ever feel so inspired some Neve EQ IRs for tweaking vocals on the Helix would be great as well. Can this be done? It can certainly be done. I don't use Helix in this capacity... but I could certainly make some vocal-centric Neve EQ IRs for vocals. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scotty_burford Posted October 25, 2016 Share Posted October 25, 2016 I was placing them post amp/cab in Helix (think they're most effective in this position)... but you can certainly place them pre cab. You can also load the IRs into a convolution plugin in your DAW. Thank you very much for your help and your effort in creating these Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HonestOpinion Posted October 25, 2016 Share Posted October 25, 2016 It can certainly be done. I don't use Helix in this capacity... but I could certainly make some vocal-centric Neve EQ IRs for vocals. Excellent! :) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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