It would be nice if Helix could maintain level settings when toggling between amps and effects

[MojoAxe]

I'm relatively new to the Helix so I'm still in learning mode when it comes to creating presets.  One thing that I've found makes it difficult choose between amp models, ODs, and effects is that when toggling through the various choices, the default settings are radically different on every one of them.  

 

For instance, when choosing an amp model for a patch, it is nice to be able to do an A/B between various amp models in order to hear the differences in tone.   Lets say I chose a Fender Deluxe amp model and adjust the settings (volume, gain, EQ, etc)  to my liking.  I would then like to toggle the amp model to be a Twin, Vibrolux, or Tweed in order to hear the difference in tone.  As soon as I select a different amp model, all the settings jump to whatever the default settings are for that amp.  The only way I've found to do an A-B is to put both amps into a preset or create two different presets.  In both cases I have to manually adjust all of the levels to be the same, and if I want to try out a different amp I have to do it all over again.

 

I understand that different amps have different controls so its impossible to maintain every setting, but it would be nice if there was an option that would allow you to maintain at least the basic controls such as volume and gain to stay at the same level while toggling through the various amp choices.  

 

The same goes for effects such as delay.  When toggling through the various delay effects available, the delay time is radically different between each effect.  To me, it would make sense that if Helix would at least maintain the millisecond setting while sampling the different delay models.  In order to experiment with delays, I guess it would be relatively easy to put a half dozen of them into a patch, set the delay time on each to be the same, then toggle them on and off one by one.  When it comes to amps however, the number of them within a patch is limited by DSP.

 

Maybe I'm finding this a bit difficult because the Helix is all new to me.  With such a myriad of available options within Helix, I'm all ears as to any suggestions on better ways to compare various amps, cabinets, and effects in order to zero in on the one that's best for the desired tone.

[silverhead]

.......

 

I understand that different amps have different controls so its impossible to maintain every setting, but it would be nice if there was an option that would allow you to maintain at least the basic controls such as volume and gain to stay at the same level while toggling through the various amp choices.  

 

.....

It kind of depends on what you mean by 'stay at the same level'. If you mean the same numeric volume and gain settings you're still not going to get the same overall volume levels because of the differences in the physical amps. A Hi-Gain amp and a Clean amp, at the same numeric level settings for vol and gain/drive, will almost certainly deliver very different output volumes.

 

Similarly, if you mean the same level in terms of the overall output volume that can be achieved in different ways since the Gain/Drive and Vol settings interact heavily. You can get the same overall output level with a relatively clean tone using a low drive and high vol setting, or a dirtier tone with a higher drive and lower vol setting. Line 6 can't know your preference in this regard, and certainly can't meet everyone's preference.

 

The reality is that if you had a roomful of the physical amps and tried to compare them, each time you plugged in to a different amp you would have to adjust its individual settings, using your own preferences and perceptions of overall level of clean vs. dirty tones. And once you had done that for a certain overall level setting (say relatively quiet in a small room) you would have to do everything all over again if you wanted to compare them at a much louder level in a bigger space.

[zooey]

The reality is that if you had a roomful of the physical amps and tried to compare them, each time you plugged in to a different amp you would have to adjust its individual settings, using your own preferences and perceptions of overall level of clean vs. dirty tones. And once you had done that for a certain overall level setting (say relatively quiet in a small room) you would have to do everything all over again if you wanted to compare them at a much louder level in a bigger space.

Yeah, but once you'd set up each of the amps you wanted to compare, you can switch between them without them constantly resetting themselves how they were when you took them out of their shipping boxes  ;)

 

In all fairness, you can set up two presets to do that, or two snapshots if there's enough DSP and two free snapshots.

 

But fundamentally I agree that the current behavior is annoying enough that I at least want the choice not to have it, like a global setting.

[spikey]

Save the factory bank. Make a user bank. The save to the user bank. At this point, I just save the preset at the volume I want. If I leave the powered amp/monitor/mixer at the same level the next time all my presets are exactly where I left them tone and volume wise in Helix.

[jclarkguitarist]

 I created presets with each amp model set to the same level using reference monitors and meters in my studio. Then I copy paste from those blocks when I create a new preset. Its a pain but it is better than starting over with setting levels. What would be really be nice is if you could save parameters to effect defaults or if the defaults stayed at the lasted edited setting for that particular model type.  

[bjnette]

There are plugins like Hornets Auto gain that adjust the output so when you tweak you are not fooled by volume changes.

This type of thing could be easily coded for but would you want it. It would be like turning a Helix into a GT100! LOL

Good idea about the delay times for delays except the name of a delay describes its time and there might not be much tonal difference for many. But if you could, Simply once you tap a delay time all delays map to the same  time or multiples thereof!

[CraigGT]

Someone created an 'Amp Room' setlist with all the amp models in similar setups.

I'm not at home so can't look where I got it from though.

 

Craig

[PeterHamm]

Someone created an 'Amp Room' setlist with all the amp models in similar setups.

I'm not at home so can't look where I got it from though.

 

Craig

 

 

it's here.

 

http://line6.com/support/topic/25703-amp-room-every-amp-in-a-setlist-for-a-strat-and-a-les-paul/

[MusicLaw]

<Snip>What would be really be nice is if you could save parameters to effect defaults or if the defaults stayed at the lasted edited setting for that particular model type.

 

^^^^^^

This

 

If Helix's firmware were enhanced with a "Remember" feature to keep/remember the last used settings of each parameter of a Model in the Model List, this would make life much easier for users and eliminate the need for users to manually save their own remember Model in a Template Preset! The press encoder button for each parameter, on each Page, of a Model's parameters (on the Helix itself) could be left as it currently operates such that it would return the respective value of the individual parameter to the Factory Default value for that Parameter.

 

The Mic list's encoder knob (and I believe a few other encoder knobs) were not as of fw 2.12 restoring the Factory Default parameter value. Rather it would reset the Mic Lists to the first Mic in the List. This would have to be revised/corrected.

[MojoAxe]

I've found it's very easy to cut-n-paste blocks from one patch to another which got me to thinking that it might make sense to dedicate an area of one of the setlists to be a library of effects.

 

For instance, there could be a "Delay" preset that consists of an amp/cab in the first block followed by a half dozen or so different delay effects. Each delay block would be set up differently and normally they would all be bypassed. Whenever I need a delay for a new patch, I could just go to this preset and audition each delay to determine which one I wanted. I could then cut-n-paste it to the desired patch.

 

Within the library area there would be presets for my favorite delays, chorus, reverbs, amps, etc. Whenever I'm building a new preset, I could pick and chose effects from the library area, copy them to my patch, then make any final tweaks.

 

I dunno, this is just a thought. I'll have to give it a try to see if it's a practical approach.

[MusicLaw]

I've found it's very easy to cut-n-paste blocks from one patch to another which got me to thinking that it might make sense to dedicate an area of one of the setlists to be a library of effects.

For instance, there could be a "Delay" preset that consists of an amp/cab in the first block followed by a half dozen or so different delay effects. Each delay block would be set up differently and normally they would all be bypassed. Whenever I need a delay for a new patch, I could just go to this preset and audition each delay to determine which one I wanted. I could then cut-n-paste it to the desired patch.

Within the library area there would be presets for my favorite delays, chorus, reverbs, amps, etc. Whenever I'm building a new preset, I could pick and chose effects from the library area, copy them to my patch, then make any final tweaks.

I dunno, this is just a thought. I'll have to give it a try to see if it's a practical approach.

^^^^^^

Given Helix's ample Empty SetLists (including the empty slots in the Templates Setlist), what you suggest is a perfectly sensible and practical method!

 

I would still love to have my Favorites version of Models appear in the Model's List, or, in a subsorted Favorites version of the Models List, so I could directly select which Model (Factory Default or My Favorite) when inserting the Model Block in a Signal Path -- without having to copy and past from the Templates Setlist.

[zooey]

Hate to keep saying this, but copy-paste doesn't work well with snapshots.

[HonestOpinion]

This post is a bit off topic regarding leveling and more snapshot-centric but perhaps slightly relevant. Zooey is correct about copy and paste in regards to snapshots. Ideally it would be nice to have the option to copy over for example an amp block with all its snapshot states to a new preset.  So if you had a snapshot with a Clean (SNAPSHOT 1), Crunch (SNAPSHOT 2), and Lead (SNAPSHOT 3) snapshot, the amp states for all three snapshots would copy over to the new preset with their respective settings for those three snapshots. However this cannot currently be done. You can copy the block over to a new preset or within the preset and it will reflect the state and parameter settings from only the single snapshot it is copied from. 

 

The current behavior I have observed with copy and paste with snapshots is the following:

1. You can copy and paste an entire snapshot only within a preset.
2. You cannot copy an entire snapshot to another preset. An already populated preset cannot have an entire snapshot copied to it for obvious reasons, it would overwrite the preset with a different set of blocks. You also cannot copy a snapshot to a new preset although this is not really an issue as you can copy the entire preset over instead.
3. You can copy blocks between or within presets. Whatever snapshot you copy the block from will determine the state and parameter settings of the copied block. If you go back and copy the same block from a different snapshot with different parameter settings in your source preset, it will overwrite the settings of the block in your target preset for all snapshots.  So again, ideally you would be have the option to copy over a block with all its snapshot settings to a new preset. I suppose in lieu of that it would be great if you could copy the block from each snapshot in the source preset to its respective snapshot in the target preset and retain the parameter settings from the source snapshot. A more ponderous process but the flexibility to do this would be helpful. At least that way you would be able to copy over your Clean, Crunch, and Lead settings one by one. Ultimately though it makes more sense and would be more efficient to be able to copy over the block with all its respective snapshots at once because otherwise the Editor would have to determine whether you are copying in an entirely new amp block or the same one (example in 1st paragraph) with different snapshot settings.

I can easily see why some of the rules regarding snapshot copy & paste exist and should remain but implementing the option to copy a block(s) with all its snapshot states might be doable and very helpful.