HX Stomp limited to 3 snapshots even if using external midi controller such as MC6?

[RichardLainegard]

So, been trying to find info on this... 
Say I have the HX Stomp and a Morningstar MC6 as an external midi controller.
Could I then for each preset have all six buttons on the MC6 be 6 different snapshots
within a preset and keep the three on the stomp to go between presets and a permanent tap/tempo?

Or, is the HX stomp hardwired to only handle 3 stomps, regardless of whatever external footswitch
or midi you throw at it?

[phil_m]

There are three snapshots per preset, period.

[RichardLainegard]

4 minutes ago, phil_m said:

There are three snapshots per preset, period.

 

was afraid that was the case... 
On the fence between the Stomp or the FX with a micro preamp.

Then again, the FX would only give me one more snapshot
(is that then also limited to 4 per preset?)

[phil_m]

19 minutes ago, RichardLainegard said:

 

was afraid that was the case... 
On the fence between the Stomp or the FX with a micro preamp.

Then again, the FX would only give me one more snapshot
(is that then also limited to 4 per preset?)

 

Yes, the HX Effects has 4 snapshots per preset.

[PeterHamm]

As soon as you add something like the MC6 or other pedals (nothing wrong with that) you're getting real close to the price/functionality of LT, and should probably just consider that.

[gunpointmetal]

22 minutes ago, PeterHamm said:

As soon as you add something like the MC6 or other pedals (nothing wrong with that) you're getting real close to the price/functionality of LT, and should probably just consider that.

Unless you already have the MIDI controller. If you building a whole new rig around the Stomp and need to start adding external hardware, it probably makes more sense to just get the LT. Make some friends at GC who can hook you up with the Friends and Family discount and its not that much more.

 

I do think some of the "crippling" on the stomp isn't necessary. If someone does have a MIDI controller, why shouldn't they be able to access more snapshots. And why doesn't it use "dynamic DSP" like the helix where you can add blocks till it can't do it anymore? Seems silly to me. I was all stoked to grab one for a backup, then seeing the six block limit, the three snapshot limit, there is a still a patch gap even though the DSP is being limited....I'd rather just stick with my Firehawk FX.

[rvroberts]

Yes, it's a bit of a strange beast - just a little too limited to be much use to most of us.  

[d0stenning]

10 hours ago, PeterHamm said:

As soon as you add something like the MC6 or other pedals (nothing wrong with that) you're getting real close to the price/functionality of LT, and should probably just consider that.

 

 

Give there are many who already own a MIDI foot controller - be it MC6 or something much cheaper like one of the ActitioN range - the argument about cost doesnt really work.

 

Its even possible to switch snapshots via MIDI over USB - so it could be that for some performers - an iPad connected to the Stomp  running some app that sends MIDI CC messages would also work fine. 

 

So really - it would be very helpful if L6 in a future update - allowed for more than 3  snapshots.

[RichardLainegard]

16 hours ago, PeterHamm said:

As soon as you add something like the MC6 or other pedals (nothing wrong with that) you're getting real close to the price/functionality of LT, and should probably just consider that.

 

Good point, I've already had the Helix floor and the Helix LT, but in the end found them
too big and cumbersome for traveling. My absolute size limit is what could fit on a Metro 16 board,
and that leaves the HX Effects with a Mooer Micro Pre (or similar) or the HX Stomp and potentially
some external switcher for more functionality. The HX Stomp and a MC6 would both fit on a Nano board,
so functionality and price aside, that's a huge size and weight difference compared with the Floor and LT.

[shmaque]

On 10/16/2018 at 3:07 AM, d0stenning said:

 

 

Give there are many who already own a MIDI foot controller - be it MC6 or something much cheaper like one of the ActitioN range - the argument about cost doesnt really work.

 

Its even possible to switch snapshots via MIDI over USB - so it could be that for some performers - an iPad connected to the Stomp  running some app that sends MIDI CC messages would also work fine. 

 

So really - it would be very helpful if L6 in a future update - allowed for more than 3  snapshots.

Agreed 100%. I can get behind even eliminating the dynamic dsp at this price point, but the 3 snapshot limit feels extremely underhanded as a user. I was really hoping to see it expanded to at least 4 or 5 in 2.70, but alas, no. Really hope they'll at least consider this for future fw revs...

[pbatts]

Have you guys considered the concept of Stompshots rather than Snapshots?

 

With the MC6, you can send up to 16 messages with a single button press. That's 16 toggles, parameter changes or whatever for a given Stomp Preset/Snapshot.

[Kilrahi]

On ‎10‎/‎21‎/‎2018 at 1:17 PM, shmaque said:

Agreed 100%. I can get behind even eliminating the dynamic dsp at this price point, but the 3 snapshot limit feels extremely underhanded as a user. I was really hoping to see it expanded to at least 4 or 5 in 2.70, but alas, no. Really hope they'll at least consider this for future fw revs...

 

The complaint kind of confuses me. Yeah, it's three snapshots per preset, but there's no reason why preset 1A can't be nearly identical, or in fact identical, to preset 1B, which then has an additional three snapshots which you can tweak.

 

Does anyone really use all of their individual presets for completely unique and disparate settings?  Because that's a lot of presets. I'd recommend having preset 1A, 1B, and 1C be virtually identical and then think of your snapshots - which are a total of 9 in that preset section, being how you jump around. Surely 9 variations of a theme could cover most situations.

[shmaque]

41 minutes ago, Kilrahi said:

 

The complaint kind of confuses me. Yeah, it's three snapshots per preset, but there's no reason why preset 1A can't be nearly identical, or in fact identical, to preset 1B, which then has an additional three snapshots which you can tweak.

 

Does anyone really use all of their individual presets for completely unique and disparate settings?  Because that's a lot of presets. I'd recommend having preset 1A, 1B, and 1C be virtually identical and then think of your snapshots - which are a total of 9 in that preset section, being how you jump around. Surely 9 variations of a theme could cover most situations.

 

Kilrahi, I think you're missing one of the fundamental benefits of snapshots vs presets - the delay (however subjectively short) associated with forcing the unit to load a new dsp chain (preset) vs the instantaneous response of a snapshot change. That's kind of the entire beauty behind snapshots. If you're stopping in between songs, sure preset changes get you there just fine. If you rely on continuity and trails, you're screwed. So surely, your proposed scenario does *not* cover most situations for any of us in that boat. 

 

5 hours ago, pbatts said:

Have you guys considered the concept of Stompshots rather than Snapshots?

 

With the MC6, you can send up to 16 messages with a single button press. That's 16 toggles, parameter changes or whatever for a given Stomp Preset/Snapshot.

 

Also, yes, I've considered "stompshots" (and will actually be using a MC6 to do exactly this to overcome the snapshot limitation) - it just stinks for those of us whose setlists change drastically one week to the next to now have to program two units for every change as opposed to being able to leverage capability that's a huge boon in every other helix family platform. 

[Kilrahi]

2 hours ago, shmaque said:

 

Kilrahi, I think you're missing one of the fundamental benefits of snapshots vs presets - the delay (however subjectively short) associated with forcing the unit to load a new dsp chain (preset) vs the instantaneous response of a snapshot change. That's kind of the entire beauty behind snapshots. If you're stopping in between songs, sure preset changes get you there just fine. If you rely on continuity and trails, you're screwed. So surely, your proposed scenario does *not* cover most situations for any of us in that boat. 

 

 

Fair enough, and that's a good point.  Just to clarify, I ask more to make sure I understand the problem and learn from it BEFORE I'm ever in that situation. Better for me to get the limitation now than through the hard way. 

[shmaque]

On 10/31/2018 at 3:43 PM, Kilrahi said:

 

Fair enough, and that's a good point.  Just to clarify, I ask more to make sure I understand the problem and learn from it BEFORE I'm ever in that situation. Better for me to get the limitation now than through the hard way. 

Yeah sorry - didn't mean to have my contempt for the shortcoming bleed through in my response. :) The sad part is that snapshots are flat out amazing, and the hx stomp shortchanges that feature in a way that feels excessive and artifically limiting. I suspect (and this is pure speculation) that even though the stomp technically supports 5 footswitches, the extra features associated with capacitive touch made it simpler to just limit to 3 snapshots. I'd like to believe the reason is more complicated than that, but somehow I don't believe it is. 3 is just a very small number, and once you get into the territory of compensating with a more capable midi switcher (eg the mc6) the question of why you'd chose stomp vs LT really comes back into play. 

[msn815]

All you have to do is make one preset on the stomp with all of your effects. Use each stomp on the mc6 to toggle them on and off as needed just like a snapshot. Then use the hx stomp to manually control the effects or parameters. The flexibility is insane with an hx stomp and mc6.