ColonelForbin

Yeah, technically you can use a standard XLR cable if you really need to. I ended up getting some AES/EBU cables made from a place here in Illinois called BestTronics. They are nice cables, they work fine; they are easy to distinguish from the XLR cables because for some reason the AES/EBU cabling uses a thinner cable and/or shielding, dunno. I can't tell any difference; though I haven't had to run them any significant distance, I just got a couple of 30', 20' and 10' so I would be able to L6Link the HD500 to the DT25, and the L2's to the mixer. I haven't used the L2's much with the HD500, should explore that option a bit more. Especially for using the JTV acoustic patches..

Wow, I learn something every day! I didn't take the time to know about *that* little feature. Saving the L2 speaker mode per patch on the HD500? Hmmm, I guess I know what I will mess about with tonight after work! Is there a way to edit that L2 speaker mode setting using the HD editor software?

That's an interesting point, gives me some ideas. I've used an HD500 with a DT25 and an L2t; though I haven't tried using the L2t in that electric guitar mode, or with the combo amp setting. I have typically used the L2t in studio/direct mode. It does raise a question: does the L2t direct out - when the HD500(x) is in combo/poweramp mode- create any mic emulation, similar to the manner in which the DT25 does? I can imagine the manner in which you are running it does create a situation where mic'ing the L2t would sound good, the combo/poweramp mode removes the mic and room modeling from the signal path, and just emulates the preamp, poweramp, and speaker. Next question, since the DT25/50 patches are supposed to use the "pre" versions of the amp models, rather than the "full" amp models, which is best for use with the L2t when rigged as the OP describes? I would imagine the full models, since there isn't an actual tube amp as is the case with the DT25. I've often wondered the best way to use both the DT25 and L2t when using the L6Link, I suppose some compromise would need to occur, since the outputs modes are global and can't be assigned per device with the L6Link settings. One specific way you could alter your rig, would be set the L2t as a floor monitor in front of you, and run the HD500 in studio/direct mode, and take the XLR outputs from the HD500x to the FOH mix. In that scenario however, you definitely would not want them to mic your L2t, since the HD500x is now providing the mic emulation. I will have to try that electric guitar mode, I've not explored the L2t much beyond it's use as a speaker and monitor, vs as a guitar amp! Cheers~

question here; I picked up a used M13 recently and it came with a G50 wireless. I've had some fun running the wireless in the 'standard' manner, from guitar to input of pedal, m13 and HD500. Was wondering, can the G50 be used as the output send:?> Meaning, the out from the pedalboard rig to the input of an amp for example?

I use an M13 in the FX loop of an HD500. A bit more in and out options there, however. I think what Triryche said should work; you would be able to set the FX loop position with the M13; it gives you decent control over the position of the FX loop, so you could set part of the M13 signal in the "pre" FX100 slots and the rest of the M13 effects in the "post" FX100 slot. Since the M13 also has a looper, for example, everything would go through the looper, including the tones created by the FX100. You would do something like this: guitar -> M13 guitar in -> M13 fx banks "pre" > M13 FX loop send (mono) -> FX100 guitar in -> FX stereo L/R out -> M13 FX loop return You could do something like make the "pre" fx on the M13 eq's, drives, distortion, wahs, comps, etc, and make the "post" fx on the M13 things like chrous and other mods, delays and reverbs. With my HD500 I run it like this: guitar -> analog pedalboard -> HD500 guitar in > amp model -> HD500 FX send (stereo) ->M13 inputs ->M13 L/R stereo out -> HD500 FX return. I use the M13 for "post" effects only, lots of mods, reverbs, and delays. Sounds great in stereo, it definitely does a killer job modeling all those effects!

You probably want to get one (or two!) of these: http://missionengineering.com/?product=ep1-l6 The Mission EP1-L6 is a high quality, all metal, vintage style expression pedal that is the perfect complement to your Line 6 amps and effects. Great for wah, whammy and many other effects, the EP1-L6 is designed to work out of the box with any of the Line 6 expression pedal compatible products such as the Pod HD, and the stomp box modelers. Check out the full list of compatible devices below.* The Mission EP1-L6 is built with the same all aluminum and stainless steel construction and highest quality components, that have made Mission pedals respected worldwide for their performance and reliability. The new version features a re-designed non slip rubber pedal surface, and new base plate with the Mission and Line 6 logos and the ‘Line 6 by Mission’ lettering. For modern control with a vintage vibe …. Get on a Mission. Compatible Line 6 devices: Pod HD 500 Pod HD 500X Pod HD 400 Pod X3 Live Pod XT Live Pod Studio KB37 Toneport UX8 M13 M9 M5 DL4 Delay FM4 Filter DM4 Distortion MM4 Modulation FBV Shortboard MkII Mobile Keys *Note that the EP1-L6 is the only Mission expression pedal that can be directly connected to the expression pedal input on Line 6 devices. Other Mission expression pedals are not compatible with the Line 6 pedal interface.

I suppose you would want to test all options; with the various outputs from the HD you might have benefits and limitations depending on the specifics of the studio. For example, the studio likely has a very high end soundcard interface, which depending on the type of software being used, may require use of their soundcard. With the new ProTools 11, you can use any soundcard, so that limitation is effectively removed in some cases, but in other instances, the DAW software may not function properly, or be routed properly to monitor audio playback when using the HD500 USB port- which defines the HD500 as the ASIO soundcard. The SPDIF option is a good one, because it allows you to send a digital signal into the studio's soundcard; assuming they can take that form of digital input. Last, there may actually be some benefit to using the studio console to take the XLR inputs, depending on the quality of the preamps / XLR inputs, you may actually be able to achieve a nice "warming" up of your signal quality, despite being subjected to additional A/D D/A conversions.

Yeah, the M13 is a lot of fun; I also recently bought a used M13, and it rocks! I also have been researching power options; I know the Voodoo Labs power supplies implicitly state that they will NOT power an M13. I think the higher current draw is the primary issue? Here's an archived thread, you may have already read through this: http://line6.com/supportarchivenew/thread/28368 "M13 is rated for 2000 mA.Some searching around the forum indicates that the M13 actually draws close to 1400 mA" SKB PS-55 = 1300 mA, 9VAC http://www.voodoolab.com/pedalpower_digital.htm "Line 6 (excludes M9/M13)" http://www.voodoolab.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=7&t=1565 "The M13 cannot be powered directly by any model of the Pedal Power series, it simply draws too much current. - John Clark (Voodoo Lab ® Magician/Tech)" Possible option to "mod" a pedal power device for use with the M13: VERTEX EFFECTS SYSTEMS Custom Pedalboard Design WEB: http://www.vertexeffectsystems.com "The Pedal Power AC can power the M9 without modification from either of the 9V 1200mA outputs on the right side of the front panel. The increased current draw of the M13 why it is unable to be powered by the Pedal Power AC. Which of the modded outs in your pictures would be appropriate for the M13? From what I understand, the M13 requires 9VAC at a minimum of 1.5A."

Going to check out the 'showman' size of the Diago board. I realized though the M13 fits decently on the Pedaltrain floorboard, because of the angle and height, it doesn't fit into the flight case. So that is going back to being the analog board, the HD500 stays in the Tarcase, and will give the Diago a try for the M13. It's got extra size behind the M13 where cables will be somewhat protected, at least not hanging way past the back edge. Somewhat expensive for a made in China case, though the Rondo flight case was $100, and I don't think they carpet the inside of the lid. Lip seems shallow enough that the first row of M13 footswitches should sit fine and be accessible. Will report back when it gets here. This review is a bit of a fluff piece, but for what it's worth: http://www.performing-musician.com/pm/may09/articles/diagoshowman.htm This one is similar, sort of a 'product overview' review. Does show the three case sizes next to each other, which gives a good sense of scale. http://gaspoweredguitar.wordpress.com/2013/01/09/incoming-diago-gigman-pedalboard/ This review is decent as well, the reviewer actually spoke with someone at the UK office: http://www.effectsbay.com/2012/05/diago-pedal-board-gigman/

I still feel that Line6's greatest recent success has been born from collaboration with other companies. The Variax itself was good, paired with James Tyler luthier, it's great. The modeling amps and POD's are good - paired with the Bogner designed tube amp portion of the DT series, it's great! As for the future of Variax in general, I would love to see them build some bridges with other major guitar companies. In reference to the original post topic, I think a Variax bass partnered with someone like Alembic, or Modulus would be a stellar notion! And I'd love to be able to get a custom shop PRS with next gen Variax hardware onboard. That, to me, is the next step forward. Expand the functional awesomeness of the Variax system into the realms of other fine instrument makers, styles, models, and such. No easy feat, but a cool idea, none the less. Especially PRS and Modulus!!! :)

Did some distracted noodling recording, messing around once I got everything to interface properly; surprisingly no ground loop issues and overall, not a lot of noise issues. Props to the Voodoo Lab power supply, I guess giving analog pedals isolated power does make a difference! And the M13 sits so well in the HD500 effects loop it's scary how easy it is to get some wild sounds with that pairing. Anyway, here's a link to some audio in a Dropbox link. I included the source 24bit/96k .wavs, and reduced size 320kbps .mp3 versions. Cheers! :) JTV-Keeley_HD500-M13_Audio Noodles

I just found another (more expensive) option; "Diago" pedalboards: Found this link, in their "user" gallery, someone else had this idea about putting an M13 in a lift off lid-style pedalboard case. Diago pedalboards M13 in Diago Showman pedalboard case Diago showman - Musicians Friend Showman PB03: Internal sizing: 29-1/2" width x 13-3/4" depth x 4" height (7/8" lip height) weight: 7kg (15.43 lbs) Tourman PB04: Internal sizing: 40" width x 17-3/4" depth x 4" height (7/8" lip height) weight: 10kg (22.04 lbs)

I am looking into some decent hard-case options for the M13. I haven't heard back from the guy who has the HD500 Tarcase for sale on Ebay; I sent him a message inquiring about getting a Tarcase built for my M13; will give that some more time, see if he gets back to me - I really, really like the used Tarcase I bought for my HD500; it's very sturdy, and well made, the black carpeted look is quite nice; subtle, vs. the bright silver / aluminum color flight case look (Rondo, Pedaltrain, etc) Looking around at other semi-affordable options, with a few that might work from Rondo. I pulled the M13 off the Gator pedalboard last night; I just wasn't jazzed on keeping this thing in a soft-sided case. And the angle/height up of the pedalboard was a bit odd, since the M13 is already stepped / tiered. Rondo has at least three cases that would work based on the M13 size (M13 is 15-1/2" wide, 12" deep, 3-1/2" tall). The smallest case option is much less $, but would be a tight fit with no room off the back for cables / power supply to be protected from anything; not ideal. That one would also only accommodate one external expression pedal. But, it's only $36, so not a terrible option. They have two larger sizes, which are the same interior dimensions: 29-1/2 wide x 15-3/4 deep x 5-1/2 height. The lower priced option is similar to the smaller case design; less sturdy latches. The more expensive option is a "flight case" style. Anyone care to chime in? I was thinking run two expression pedals, possibly one on each side of the M13 to balance the weight when carrying it. This sucker is not light weight, that is for sure! Rondo Cases: CNB PDC-410D-BK : - $35.95 - Max. interior size: 22" x 12 1/2" x 3 1/2" - depth of lid: 1" CNB PDC-410G-SSL : - $55.95 - Max. interior size: 29-1/2" x 15-3/4" x 5-1/2" - depth of lid: 1" CNB PDC-4100G-TN Flight Case : - $99.95 - Max. interior size: 29 1/2" x 15 3/4" x 5 1/2" - depth of lid: 1"

What is involved in the process of putting an Earvana on a JTV59? I see a couple of links in their webstore for "Gibson" style I am guessing? Gibson style shelf nut Gibson style retrofit

It seems (at least to me), that the "benchmark" of the JTV pricing is the JTV59 in Tobacco. While the other styles / finishes seem to vary alot in price, that one typically stays right at $1500. I got lucky - got mine when it was on sale back in February; Guitar Center had the sale, and Zzounds did a price match for me - was $1,071.18. I haven't seen them at that price since. (I am still on the payment plan for that particular impulse buy! But I must say, really happy with the guitar, the rig has come a long way since I added the JTV and DT25 to my HD500. My serial number indicates mine was built in March 2012, for reference, in terms of sales and/or build date.

Voted, #68! The status actually now says "in review" as of 3 days ago. Great idea!! You can control everything else on there with the exp pedals, seems like it should be do-able to control the looper volume too! In the meantime, I am totally going to figure out how to set up that looper / exp control on the M13. I need to read the manual and figure out how to adjust some fx selections, start creating a few custom banks of effects stacks.

Yeah, I stumbled into this M13 thing headlong in the midst of a bunch of semi-stupid ideas about how to split inputs and a bunch of other complex ideas that weren't doing so well when I actually plugged it all in. I was going to put my Eleven Rack into the HD500 fx loop and muck about with disabling the amp sims on the 11R when I found the M13 on Craigslist. At the moment, the M13 is sitting in the "post" section, running stereo in the HD500 fx loop. Sounds pretty stellar, I like the ability to have so many effects "on deck", and not rely as much on patch / amp model changes to accomplish those types of effects. Love the particle verb. Makes it sound like a rain stick is in the mix, somewhere in the background. Pairing that effect with delays and a hall or some other 'traditional' reverb gives the tones some nice depth and spacial effect for certain types of moods. Will probably try running everything through the pair of L2t's tonight, see how that goes. The "pre" effects for now, are a combination of the HD500 effects and some outboard analog gear - that's where I got stuck on the dual input / splitting the variax signal stuff. I had been using the fx loop in the pre position, and sending the 'variax mags' signal through the analog gear. But the fx loop actually works better in the post position through the M13, so I ended up running the 'variax mags' on one amp model through the HD500 "pre" fx (wah, comp, drive, etc) and the 1/4" variax going through the analog gear and on to the guitar in of the HD500. The M13 came with a G50 wireless unit, so that has been a nice means to send that 1/4" signal to the analog pedalboard. I am going to rig that up again tonight after work and record some more noodling around, in studio/direct, see what it sounds like. I got some really spacy sounds out of the last session before the memory card filled up. Prob leave the DT25 out of the mix for now, though it would be interesting to compare the studio/direct signal to the DT25 XLR out signal, all other variables being equal.

That is awesome - I didn't know that!! That's the missing link right there - I am liking the M13 + HD500, but was having looper issues because my noise gate is only tracking the input signal from the guitar; it was hearing nothing from the guitar after I started a loop; I may have to mess with using the M13 looper and see if I can route things properly so I can get the noise gate positioned properly. Being able to control the looper volume with the exp pedal is a stellar feature...

Hey there, just wanted to chime in on this- I bought a used M13 two days ago; I also use the JTV59 and HD500. *Loving* the M13. This thing is amazing! I am running it in the effects loop of the HD500 as my "post" effects processor. I am using a TRS splitter to run the HD500 fx loop in stereo to and from the M13. The one thing I didn't fully comprehend and/or appreciate about the design of the M13, is the amount of "on deck" effects - as you mentioned, basically twelve stomp boxes each with on/off footswitch - and all able to be configured / saved in presets. Four "on" at any given time. And the manner in which the footswitches work is nice - it just switches between the effects defined in each "fx" stack (across, 1-4, down, A,B,C.) It's been great for doing some crazy cool combinations of mods, delays and reverbs. And I am running dual amp paths, panning them hard left/right in the mixer before it hits the M13 - the ping pong and stereo effects sound pretty stellar routed through the HD500 effects loop. Something about that configuration just worked really well. I was also able to integrate my "pre amp model" analog pedalboard into the rig, and everything sounded stellar together. It got late (two nights in a row! lots of coffee making work do-able today) so I switched out of using the DT25, and just ran the 1/4" outs from the HD500 into my soundcard and monitored through some M-Audio speakers. The stereo effects are really nice when you have the speakers spread wide and you sit in the sweet spot. I can see how stereo is complex though, and presents unique challenges when creating a live sound, vs home studio noodling! Even just panning the two amp models center vs wide left/right made a fair bit of difference in the tone; and the stereo ping-pong sounds good regardless of the source feeding it, mono or stereo.

I suppose, quick response - if you had to choose, and all other factors like guitars, amps, etc being not a crucial factor - the HD500/500x gives you more overall functionality. And the HD amp models are *amazing*. You have a comparable version of the effects selections, just a different means to access it. The major bonus extras the HD500 offers: -ASIO soundcard -Line6Link -XLR mic input -XLR outputs -USB interface to use software editor / firmware update -Variax interface

Here's my take on the two units: I've owned an HD500 since 2010; I just bought a used M13 from a guy on Craigslist yesterday (sweet price for the M13, a Gator pedalboard, an expression pedal, and a Line6 G50 wireless unit!) So, here's where I am at with this stuff: they are both fan-friggin'-tastic, for specific reasons that are hard to compare them to each other because of. I also use a JTV59 and a DT25 amp. So, for me the HD500 is indispensable : it powers the JTV with the vdi cable, and it handles the L6Link to the DT25. In Link mode, the HD500 and the DT25 work together to render the amp models - so part of the signal path is digital (the preamp and the FX) and the rest is analog (the Bogner switching and tube amp portion). One other side note, the HD500 can also be used as a USB ASIO soundcard for doing studio/direct type recording. The M13 does not have a USB port, I believe you have to use a MIDI interface to update the firmware. Also, I don't know if there is any standalone software editor for the M13. On the HD side, the recent firmware updates for the HD500/HD500x and the JTV series now allow the JTV to connect to the computer through the HD500, which allows you to edit patches for the HD500 using the HD editor, and the JTV using the HD Gearbox - which is pretty cool. For me, I am a little FX happy/crazy - am also in the midst of assembling a sweet analog pedalboard and using the JTV/HD to create dual amp models with split inputs (with the JTV and HD, you can assign the variax models and the variax mags to two different inputs and split them through their own amp model preamps and their own FX paths). In the use of the M13, I am placing it in the FX loop of the HD500, in the "post" amp model section, and using the M13 primarily for mods, delays and reverbs. One feature the M13 offers, which I didn't fully appreciate until I rigged all this stuff up for the first time last night, is the "on deck" feature. Yes, the M13 only offers four effects "on" at any given time. HOWEVER, it offers - as you rightly mentioned - up to 12 total effects blocks assigned and ready at the tap of a footswitch. These 12 can be *any* of the effects, in any order in any combination. They are switched up manually, or they can be programmed into "scenes" or rigs, or whatever they call it. It also doesn't run out of DSP near as I know - the HD amp modeling can get pretty DSP intensive, especially when using the full amp models, vs the PRE versions which are specific for use with the DT amps. So, for me, pairing the two is stellar! My rig was hum free, totally quiet and noise free in the HD500 FX loop, and I don't even need to use a noise gate, for the most part, until I start cranking really high gain amps. Both are very versatile pieces of gear, though with very different applications.

Yet another take on this: PedalSnake http://www.pedalsnake.com/ http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6T0Zeal-eec http://www.youtube.com/user/PedalSnake

Power Adapter: Specs: 9V, 2000mA, 2.5mm barrel diameter Some folks are saying the actual draw is closer to 1400mA, but if it gets underpowered, it won't run properly, in terms of the lights and displays. Here is a thread from the archives: http://line6.com/supportarchivenew/thread/28368 "Re: Line 6 M13 Power Adapters by phil_m on 2010-02-03 18:23:31 Nope. Won't work. The 1200mA jacks on the Pedal Power AC don't have enough juice to consistently power the M13. I actually found that out the hard way. I was using that with my M13 for a while, and I was having weird anomolies with the LCDs. Well it turned out the voltage was dropping because the M13 was drawing too much current off the 1200mA jack. When I switched back to the Line 6 adapter, all was fine." Apparently you can "mod" the Voodoo Lab to power the M13: http://www.voodoolab.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=7&t=1565 http://www.vertexeffects.com/ A side note, you can power the M9, just not the M13: "The Pedal Power AC can power the M9 without modification from either of the 9V 1200mA outputs on the right side of the front panel. The increased current draw of the M13 why it is unable to be powered by the Pedal Power AC."

I thought the Voodoo Lab had a power supply that would do Line6 models - but according to the manual the "Voodoo Lab digital" will not power any of the HD500 / M9/ M13 gear "Note that PODxt & HD, M9, M13 and the JM4 Looper cannot be powered by Pedal Power Digital." http://www.voodoolab.com/manuals/pedal_power_digital_manual.pdf

I just added an M13 to my rig last night (got it off craigslist), and I am doing something similar to this. I use the HD500 and DT25; the M13 is in the HD500 effects loop, and the "pre" effects feeding to the HD500 guitar in are coming from analog pedals. Actually doing parallel signals, running two amp models then merging them mono before hitting the M13. Running the 1/4" through the analog gear, and also using the VDI from my JTV59. Still working out some issues, and have yet another learning curve with the M13, but the overall effects are quite familiar since I've been tweaking with the HD500 since 2010. I may end up actually putting an outboard chorus pedal in the M13 effects loop before the delays and verbs, not sure yet. I like the challenges of making analog and digital gear play well together. The DT25 does make the HD500 a lot more useable; the feel of the amp is there, it's not so 'virtual' amp model anymore; the tactile feel of turning knobs on the pedals is also crucial; while programming everything is important with this gear, to a certain extent, you have to approach it like a painter preparing his palette before beginning. Sketch out the forms, determine the colors, then premix certain tones and shades so they can be applied when the time is right. The M13 is fantastic for that "on the fly" vibe, when you want control over specific effects and pedals on/off, rather than entire scene or patch changes. Especially since I am relegating to a "post" amp model portion, before the L6Link hits the Bogner power amp portion of the DT. I think I will end up building a variety of M13 scenes with pedals in specific locations, or at least following some sort of logic to where / why the sequence occurs (mods, then delays, then reverbs?) Might put a comp or drive pedal into a 'clean boost' type slot, right after the preamp. But most of that will happen before the amp model / preamp, with the analog gear and the FX/FS that I set up in the HD500, also in the pre slot.