External amp switch doesn't work ? help

[oliverspark]

Hello

 

I just bought the Marshall Silver jubilee 2555x (re-issue series), 2 channels amp... (1 single button marshall footswitch ) ...very basic amp !

 

When i plug my helix in 4cm with my amp (Helix template : preset  "4 cable method") , i  connect a jack from "helix ext amp" to the input of the jubilee footswitch 

 

then i'm going to "command center" to assign the footswitch "ext amp"

>> i tried to select 1 tip / 2 ring or 1&2 >>> it doesn't switch the channel when i load the preset :(    any idea ???

 

[tagmusenmagnus1]

I haven't played with that feature at all, but if there is only one button, you should probably use a normal mono cable, and there would be no ring. Only tip and sleeve.

What cable are you using?

[wearethreads]

IIRC, some marshalls the channel selector on the amp has to be a in a certain selection in order for the footswitch to work. Does it work fine with the stock footswitch?

[oliverspark]

yes, stock footswitch works absolutely perfect and looks like this :

 

so i'm using a single guitar jack mono cable....

 

but it doesn't work ???

[oliverspark]

i'm using this :

 

[phil_m]

Hello

 

I just bought the Marshall Silver jubilee 2555x (re-issue series), 2 channels amp... (1 single button marshall footswitch ) ...very basic amp !

 

When i plug my helix in 4cm with my amp (Helix template : preset  "4 cable method") , i  connect a jack from "helix ext amp" to the input of the jubilee footswitch 

 

then i'm going to "command center" to assign the footswitch "ext amp"

>> i tried to select 1 tip / 2 ring or 1&2 >>> it doesn't switch the channel when i load the preset :(    any idea ???

 

 

In this photo, you're assigning the Ext Amp function to an Instant Command, not a footswitch. That means the amp will change channels when you bring this preset up. Is that your intent? You mentioned that you wanted to assign this function to footswitch. To do that, you need to select the icon for whatever footswitch you want to assign this command to, and than set it. If you're using a mono cable, you'd want to select 1(Tip).

[oliverspark]

Yes, i have tried both option :

 

instant command

 

and

 

assign the function to footswitch 12 (for example)

 

 

 

in both cases, no switching at all...

[tagmusenmagnus1]

I know that you write Example, but switch 12 is tap tempo and would probably not work - guess you have tried another ? 
 

And just to be sure - you know that you cable is fine ? 

[oliverspark]

Tagmusenmagnus1 >>> :P what a great observation !!!

 

i didn't realize that i was assigning on the tap tempo footswitch !!! (i was pushing on the empty footswitch 11... instead of 12 )

 

i will try again today with correct footswitch assignement ;-)

[oliverspark]

So, i have correctly assigned ext amp (tip 1) to footswitch 11, and tried several cables (mono guitar jacks, speaker cable  and even a stereo jack... ) :

 

something is happening on the amp (the amp led is lightning differently (less or more) BUT it does not switch the channel ???

 

 

 

 

 videos :

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H4yOEn9t9Y8   (footswitch assign mode)

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eU6t3T_-ndI (instant command mode)

 

 

???????

[tagmusenmagnus1]

Hmm.. That is really weird! 
 

Have you tried changing the Channel-select pÃ¥ the amp - Some amps need to be on Clean og Crunch to work properly. 

Is the led-shift the same as when you use the normal Marshall-switch ? 

[rudomat]

So, i have correctly assigned ext amp (tip 1) to footswitch 11, and tried several cables (mono guitar jacks, speaker cable  and even a stereo jack... ) :

 

something is happening on the amp (the amp led is lightning differently (less or more) BUT it does not switch the channel ???

 

 

 

 

 videos :

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H4yOEn9t9Y8   (footswitch assign mode)

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eU6t3T_-ndI (instant command mode)

 

 

???????

no...it´s not weird...helix´s channel switch function simply  does not work with many amps...i´ve got four amps at home right now, and it doesn´t really work with only one of them!!! and because i´m really, really angry about that, i´ll now start a thread, where we could collect all not-switching or not correct switching amps...i think it´s gonna be a very long list, cause i can´t imagine that it´s only been bad luck, that all of my four amps are not working correctly...;-(

[fukuri]

I can't find details in the manual

Does anyone know what type of switching the Helix supports?

I assume it's short to sleeve rather than voltage differential but it would be good to know from someone technical

[fukuri]

Your video is encouraging insomuch as it is actually switching something and consistently

So it is likely something to do with the pin out of that particular amp

I'll do a quick bit of reading

[fukuri]

So, i have correctly assigned ext amp (tip 1) to footswitch 11, and tried several cables (mono guitar jacks, speaker cable and even a stereo jack... ) :

 

something is happening on the amp (the amp led is lightning differently (less or more) BUT it does not switch the channel ???

 

 

 

 

videos :

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H4yOEn9t9Y8 (footswitch assign mode)

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eU6t3T_-ndI (instant command mode)

 

 

???????

A couple of people have asked but I don't see an answer

Have you tried the switching with the amp volume switch pulled out?

[fukuri]

What amps do you have Rudomat and which one works

[rudomat]

What amps do you have Rudomat and which one works

here are some amps, we know that don´t work correctly:

 

mesa boogie dc-5 (user: rudomat; doesn´t switch at all)

vox nt50 (user: rudomat; switches, but as soon as you connect, the expr. pedals´ worth drops from 100% to 97%...)

orange dual terror (user: rudomat; switches, but leads to ground loop at unusable volume...)

hughes&kettner tube20 (user: rudomat; doesn´t switch at all)

friedman smallbox (user: ultraknilch; switches, but as soon as you connect, the expr. pedals´ worth drops from 100% to 97%...)

friedman jj100 (user: JC-Tonequest; switches, but as soon as you connect, the expr. pedals´ worth...his helix got tuned to work from line6 support!!!)

mesa boogie v:25 (user: GadgetGuitar; doesn´t switch correctly...)

mesa boogie mini rectifier (user: GadgetGuitar; doesn´t switch correctly...)

[oliverspark]

So you can add the Marshall 2555x silver jubilee, and the Marshall YJM100 in the list .... (doesn't switch at all)

 

I have tried all the switch button position on the jubilee ( volume & input gain pulled out or normal position) ... nothing works.

 

an alternative would be to buy the voodoo lab control switcher ?? (but i even don't know if it will work with my amp...)

 

 

i have 30 days to return the jubilee to the store.... that's really a shame because it's a great amp.

[rudomat]

So you can add the Marshall 2555x silver jubilee, and the Marshall YJM100 in the list .... (doesn't switch at all)

 

I have tried all the switch button position on the jubilee ( volume & input gain pulled out or normal position) ... nothing works.

 

an alternative would be to buy the voodoo lab control switcher ?? (but i even don't know if it will work with my amp...)

 

 

i have 30 days to return the jubilee to the store.... that's really a shame because it's a great amp.

that´ll work for sure...but that´s not why we bought helix, right....?

[oliverspark]

Interesting topic on marshall forum :

 

with the silver jubilee :   somebody tried to put a marshall footswitch with LED (instead of the original without led) : the led was lightning but not switching the channels !

 

"If the resistance is too low, the amp may still see this as a closed circuit. I was thinking he could try increasing the value of the resistor between the switch and LED."

 

so it looks like it is the same switching problem like the mesa mark V 25 ??? the answer was to input an extra resistor in the jack ??

 

 

 

@ Line6 >> IF it is the answer for most of the non working amps.... it would be great to make that "switching cable" available for everybody like fractal does with his humburster cable ?????

[fukuri]

Ok firstly lets split out the amp switching issues

Ground loops hum is a different issue that will occur with almost any amp and footswitch in any setup

There are remedies but let's not Lump them together

 

Secondly the expression pedal is also a different issue and I'm not really sure what you mean by worth . Do you mean the maximum value drops to 97%?

 

It's worth bearing in mind that amps have many different switching methods

The Fractal guys are having very similar conversations over there.

I'll try what I've got lying around here (I don't have access to all my amps at the moment but I've got a few)

 

It would be really useful if Line6 would confirm if the switching is short to sleeve only

[oliverspark]

In the Helix manual (p38) : "connect ext amp 1/2 only to amplifiers that utilize "short to sleeve" footswitch input ...

 

( but what is a 'short to sleeve' input ???)  

[rudomat]

Ok firstly lets split out the amp switching issues

Ground loops hum is a different issue that will occur with almost any amp and footswitch in any setup

There are remedies but let's not Lump them together

 

Secondly the expression pedal is also a different issue and I'm not really sure what you mean by worth . Do you mean the maximum value drops to 97%?

 

It's worth bearing in mind that amps have many different switching methods

The Fractal guys are having very similar conversations over there.

I'll try what I've got lying around here (I don't have access to all my amps at the moment but I've got a few)

 

It would be really useful if Line6 would confirm if the switching is short to sleeve only

i´m no tech...fact is - if you implant two relays like this (as a2dconverterguy found out and posted here)...

http://line6.com/support/topic/16178-helix-4cm-amp-switch-mesa-v25-and-mesa-mini-rect-not-working/page-2?do=findComment&comment=135363

...then all three problems are gone: 1. it switches, 2. the immense ground loop, i´m talking about, is gone, and 3. the problem with the expression pedals´ worth drop is gone as well, so i though guess these problems do cohere... 

 

...for extra costs of about 1$...;-(

[fukuri]

I don't see any mention (or any reason) why implementing those relays get rid of 4cm ground loop him or have any effect on the expression pedal

Can you show me what I've missed?

Interesting thread though it looks like he Helix switching isn't done using relays. I can understand why not. Fractal have to put massive disclaimers in their manual saying if it is not a short to sleeve switching amp or you don't know what you are doing you can damage the unit

I think line6 have taken a safer approach which is having some unintended consequences

[rudomat]

I don't see any mention (or any reason) why implementing those relays get rid of 4cm ground loop him or have any effect on the expression pedal

 

i´m no tech....but a2dconverterguy seems to be one...see here...http://line6.com/support/topic/16178-helix-4cm-amp-switch-mesa-v25-and-mesa-mini-rect-not-working/page-2?do=findComment&comment=135363

he told me and he was right...

[fukuri]

i´m no tech....but a2dconverterguy seems to be one...see here...http://line6.com/support/topic/16178-helix-4cm-amp-switch-mesa-v25-and-mesa-mini-rect-not-working/page-2?do=findComment&comment=135363

he told me and he was right...

No he didn't unless I missing something

All he is saying is you can potentially retrofit relays to the Helix if you have a carefree attitude to warranties and excellent soldering plus electronics skills

 

At no point was 4 cm grounding mentioned or expression pedal sweep even discussed

 

As for 'at the cost of only a dollar' really?

Ok I'll send you a dollar. Go and fit one to a helix

 

Also how do you know he was right? Have you retrofitted one to a helix?

 

I understand your frustration but you have to be reasonable. I don't think you have enough of a technical background to make the broad sweeping statements you are

 

There is an issue here but it is being muddied by 4cm grounding and expression pedal sweep

 

So let's just focus on the Amp relay please

[oliverspark]

No he didn't unless I missing something

All he is saying is you can potentially retrofit relays to the Helix if you have a carefree attitude to warranties and excellent soldering plus electronics skills

 

At no point was 4 cm grounding mentioned or expression pedal sweep even discussed

 

As for 'at the cost of only a dollar' really?

Ok I'll send you a dollar. Go and fit one to a helix

 

Also how do you know he was right? Have you retrofitted one to a helix?

 

I understand your frustration but you have to be reasonable. I don't think you have enough of a technical background to make the broad sweeping statements you are

 

There is an issue here but it is being muddied by 4cm grounding and expression pedal sweep

 

So let's just focus on the Amp relay please

 

+1

 

i'll never open my Helix, i'm not technician at all...

 

and i think that i'll not keep my silver jubilee if there's no relay switching possibilities....

[Turnerbrown]

You can add the Marshall AFD100 to your list also. Can't change between afd/#34 mode of turn on/off FX-loop

[rudomat]

No he didn't unless I missing something

All he is saying is you can potentially retrofit relays to the Helix if you have a carefree attitude to warranties and excellent soldering plus electronics skills

 

At no point was 4 cm grounding mentioned or expression pedal sweep even discussed

 

As for 'at the cost of only a dollar' really?

Ok I'll send you a dollar. Go and fit one to a helix

 

Also how do you know he was right? Have you retrofitted one to a helix?

 

I understand your frustration but you have to be reasonable. I don't think you have enough of a technical background to make the broad sweeping statements you are

 

There is an issue here but it is being muddied by 4cm grounding and expression pedal sweep

 

So let's just focus on the Amp relay please

i can tell you, using an external midiswitch got me rid of the ground loop, ok?  and the expression sweep problem is gone as well...fact.

 

ps.: you are right - i don´t have enough technical background, but a friend of mine does, as well as a2dconverterguy, who´s been so nice to send me some messages...i don´t know if that´s enough explanation and confirmation for you...

 

pps.: ...and you can always send me a dollar...

[fukuri]

I'm not a mind reader

You didn't say any of that up until now

And it's not like I didn't ask you twice !

[fukuri]

If you really like the silver jubilee this will solve that issue for you

http://www.rjmmusic.com/products/mini-amp-gizmo/

[oliverspark]

supported marshall for mini amp gizmo :

 

 

 

1962 Combo, DSL100 ,DSL201    DSL401   DSL50    JCM900  JVM Series Amp has built-in MIDI support   Mode Four Supported with custom cable   TSL100 Supported with custom cable   TSL122 Supported with custom cable   TSL60 Supported with custom cable   TSL601 Supported with custom cable   TSL602 Supported with custom cable  

​

* silver jubilee, yjm100 and afd 100 are not in the list ... and these 3 amps have relay switching problem with Helix ....

 

Marshall seems to have modified their footswitch circuitry since the release of the YJM100 / AFD 100.... and now the re-issue of the Jubilee ...

 

so i'm not sure at the moment that it will work with an external midi switching  system ??

 

my ex-YJM100 sounded better than the jubilee, and i sold my YJM mainly because of no midi switching possibilies.... and same problem again with the jubilee ?

I'm totally f***ed and bored with relay switching problems...

[phil_m]

vox nt50 (user: rudomat; switches, but as soon as you connect, the expr. pedals´ worth drops from 100% to 97%...)

 

Kind of getting off topic a little, but I had this happen with my Egnater, but if I power cycled the Helix while the expression pedals were plugged in, they recalibrated correctly and worked fine.

[oliverspark]

Here's a reply on marshall forum concerning HELIX/ Marshall Jubilee :

 

The original channel switch is just a plain grounding scheme. I see no reason why Marshall would change that.

The footswitch or front panel switch > make ground connection - Rhythm channel; no ground connection - Lead channel.

The Helix is where the problem lies, not the amplifier or the cable.

The fact that the LED was still lit on Rhythm channel indicates the Helix is not making a direct connection to ground potential.

 

 

​if this can help to find a solution ...

[rudomat]

Kind of getting off topic a little, but I had this happen with my Egnater, but if I power cycled the Helix while the expression pedals were plugged in, they recalibrated correctly and worked fine.

thanks...i´ll try power cycling...by the way - the problem is about the onboard expression pedal...

[rudomat]

Kind of getting off topic a little, but I had this happen with my Egnater, but if I power cycled the Helix while the expression pedals were plugged in, they recalibrated correctly and worked fine.

hi and thanks a lot! tried that with the nt50 and power cycling really recalibrated it...so i guess that´s a bug...is line6 aware of it or should i write it to the bugs-thread..? 

[Turnerbrown]

I can confirm that the marshall DSL-1C amp switching works, and I guess that  that the Marshall DSL-1H will work with amp switching. This have only the channel switching classic gain - ultra gain , so using only a instrument cable here (no TRS)

[Flotsam71]

I have a Marshall JCM2000 DSL 50.  I also can not get the amp switch to work. It seems like it changes the channel....but sound is muffled, and there is a lot of buzzing. My other switch for the amp works fine. Any thoughts out there. Thanks

[fastnloud]

seems like line 6 is avoiding the issue here. There is a very real problem with helix and channel switching a lot of amps. and for 1500 bucks i think they should offer to repair the problem with the unit and stop blaming the user.

[fastnloud]

f.y.i....does not work with either of my amps, a diaz cd-100 and a warren haynes special. both use the normal channel input jacks so nothing special here.its just a simple boost switching actually not really a channel switching thing. but for 1500 bucks it should at least perform this simple task.. not happy at all with line 6 support here.