litesnsirens

OK I have created a feedback submission in the product feedback section. I actually combined it with another suggestion that I had, and by the time I was done typing I realized it could be the same really versatile product, so I tied it all in. The following is what I submitted. "It's my understanding that others have suggested this, so I am seconding the motion. Line 6 six has a lot of options for guitar and vocals for wireless live sound. So you have the wireless technology. It seems the only step that's missing now is an In Ear Monitor system. Especially now that you have this amazing new mixer that can create 4 different monitor mixes. Maybe make the system Line 6 Link enabled? include a model that can transmit on different channels based on the ABCD monitor assignment? On a similar note, for silent rehearsals, a Line 6 Link enabled headphone pre-amp would be a very cool product as well. This would take the jam hub idea and blow it out of the water. My band currently uses a jam hub at some of our rehearsals and it has some limitations but the M20d with such a product would cover all those limitations and allow users to use the same channel settings that they use live anyway. Perhaps even combine the two ideas, make the transmitter with separated ABCD transmitting channels but include alternate headphone pres on each of the channels which would allow users to rehearse with wired headphones as opposed to blowing off a battery for a rehearsal."

I've tested this out, just out of curiousity, and I thought it sounded great. But then again, if Abe Laboriel is using one as his bass rig, that says it all and my 2 cents is a blip on the screen...

Not yet, but I'm on it....

The Bose cross over at 140hz which is well below the 700 - 1000 hz so they can't really even pull it off with the 7 ft towers. Still, I have to admit that having gigged and rehearsed them for a few years, they certainly do show characteristics unlike any other speakers I've used in the past 35+ years. So they must have enough of it right or figured out some kind of workaround to the challenges described in this thread. They do fill a room with sound really evenly and the sound drops off in volume far less that regular speakers, and the sound does come out horizontally and not vertically so it doesn't bounce off the ceiling. But some of these advantages can turn into disadvantages. For instance if you are on a fairly high stage, you have to try to tip the L1's to try to point the sound downwards. And the 170 degree horizontal dispersion makes them more prone to phase cancellation if you are trying to use just two of them in a L/R configuration. I also found that, if the room was empty, yes, you could have tolerable stage volume with the L1's behind you and still fill the room with sound. That works up to a point but when you have a really crowded room the bodies could start to swallow up the sound. Then if you crank it up to compensate you get into issues of feedback, intolerable stage levels, or just simply not enough power. That's why I had to come over to Line 6. I just played one of my regular clubs last night that really would push the Bose to the limit and expose the above mentioned deficiencies. My dream stage rig killed it, with lots of room to spare. And in fact the bar managers and waitresses, all commented on how amazing the sound was. I had the main output set to -5db, every speaker level set to the halfway detent and you could still argue that maybe it was too loud. For mains I was only using 1 L3s, and 2 L3t's. 3 L2t's handled the monitoring. It was awesome. I don't miss the "line array" at all.

Perfect!! thanks for the quick response.

Is there a way to bypass the virtual tilt on the L3t/L2t without mounting them on a pole. The short poles are back ordered at Long and McQuade, I have ordered them but until they arrive I'm wondering about sitting the L3t on top of an upright L3s. I'm wondering how this will affect the sound.

Line 6 six has a lot of options for guitar and vocals for wireless live sound. So they have the wireless technology. It seems the only step that's missing now is an In Ear Monitor system. Especially now that they have this amazing new mixer that can create 4 different monitor mixes. Maybe make the system Line 6 Link enabled? include a model that can transmit on different channels based on the ABCD monitor assignment?

It definitely would work well for acoustic guitar like that, but I think you would need some sort of amp and or speaker cabinet modelling on the signal before it hits the L3t. So if you want to run mp3s to play along with, you may some sort of multi-effects unit or there may even be a single stomp that can accomplish this these days. But I would suggest bringing your guitar to a Line 6 dealer and trying it out. Also the fact that your guitar can go that low still doesn't preclude using the L2t. I would try it out as well the tone you get may be just fine. I just like the L3t a lot better for running my Roland TD-11K drums through. I like it even more with the L3s sub attached, that doesn't mean it still isn't good with just the L3t.

The L3t seems to offer a significant increase in bottom end. Not to say that the L2t has none but not as good as L3t. For guitar I would say the L2t will be fine in that regard, if you were looking put put bass guitar or electronic drums through the L2t you would notice the difference. This is probably because the L3t is tri-amped and one of the 10" speakers is dedicated to low frequencies. I would imagine the the 2t the 10" driver handles both low and midrange frequencies.

As I stated above Jon, if you guys at Line 6 can make the latency reasonable for recording to a DAW, it would be an amazing enhancement!!!

Hey listen if they could get the latency down on this device it would be amazing as an interface. Especially if you can use the on board effects to monitor but record dry, like what happens now when you record direct to SD card. Antoniocd is right, though, the latency as it stands at the lowest possible buffer size is still a half second, so you can record you initial tracks if you are monitoring direct from the M20d and it's perfect, but everything you record is hitting the "tape" a half second later so if you have to do over dubs or even punch ins, forget it. The effects are so good that you can easily come up with a great sound and then monitor direct which gives you 0 latency, it's when you have to monitor back the already recorded material that you get into trouble. I don't really understand the technicalities behind getting this machine to play nice with DAWs within an acceptable latency but I hope it can be done and I hope they are working on it. I somewhat agree with Antoniocd's frustration although it's got nothing to do with being mad at Line 6 and everything to do with being so close to a complete miracle box but just missing the mark. I know, it does a ton already and I absolutely love the M20d (although I am still having a few issues with SD cards, but I'll start another thread for that) but it just begs the question - WHY???? If they could get this working it would make the M20d the total package and answer for a crapload more people.

I had the same expectation, based on first glance reading of the literature. But after it didn't work, when I re-read the literature, it's not claiming anywhere that you could successfully use this as a recording interface for your daw. That said, I just got a little Presonus Audiobox USB. It's only 2 channels but if I need to record a band I will just record directly to the M20d, import the files to my DAW and then do individual overdubs with the audiobox.

Here is the final product, it's going to work perfectly. I just wanted to show the scale of how small these LED lights are. They were pretty damn expensive but they throw a lot of light for such a small package.

I would recommend the L3t's as your mains and the Bose as monitors. I found the B2's gave me nice bottom end far more than when I was using 6 B1's. I would say you will get as much bass response from 2 L3t's as you can get from your B1's. And if you do use the Bose as monitors, I would make the set up simpler and just leave 2 of the B1's at home and just use 2 per unit, they should be enough for monitoring. In the future you might consider adding a single L3s it really thumps.

I get what you're saying, but essentially when I cut the pole, it will just be to hold the lights in place. I want them to be basically resting on the top of the speaker but with the pole inserted for security. It's hard to tell from the picture but those lights are really light and small. It's 21" wide and maybe 8 lbs. So the additional weight etc. wouldn't be significant. But that's MY lights and MY circumstance so I can see how you wouldn't promote such use as a general practice. Given that you're saying these speakers are barely within certification, adding heavier lights, raised up higher than the speaker and wider could seriously compromise safety. These lights will overhang past the speakers 4" on either side less if they are corner to corner which is the most likely scenario. With the speakers facing directly forward, I would likely have the lights on a 45 degree angle back towards the stage. In MY situation I think that if a drunk were able to knock over the speaker with MY lights on top, the speaker would be going down anyway. I do appreciate the input though I will be vigil in setup and watching over to try to minimize the risk.

So those Fly mount screws could serve another purpose. I'm working on a project now to see if it will work. I bought a couple of these from Long and McQuade up here in Canada. I don't think the holes will line up but I'll just drill some holes if I have to to line up with the fly mount screws. But once I have that done, I'll cut some very short speaker/light pole so that I can set up my lights on top of the L3t's. These are the lights I have, I have 2 of these and these 4 little lights are really powerful and really lightweight and can easily light up the stage. I'm hoping this will work out nicely but I thought I would share in case others want to try or if Line 6 wants to look into making something that fits perfectly.

Well, I had the Bose L1 Model II's which I sold to get a dreamstage system. The Bose sound great no doubt, and I would still recommend them for I high number of situations, they're light, they set up really easily, you don't need monitors very pristine sound. But when you have to get into bigger venues with noisy audiences they may not have the balls to give you the coverage you are looking for. I think Line 6 has totally set themselves apart with these speakers. With the more detailed two channel mixer, which includes feedback suppression, effects and acousting guitar body modelling you're getting quite a bit of bang for the buck. The L3t is comparable to the Bose L1 compact in price but I would suggest that you are getting more power. It's heavier but I would see even easier to set up because you just set it down and plug in. The bass response in the L3t is pretty impressive even without the L3s. The Bose were great because I could fit our bands entire PA (2 Bose systems with a B2 each) in my Mazda 3 sport. But guess what, the L3s fits in the back door and I can slide it in on the wheels and fit 2 L3t's behind it. Then there's still a fair bit of room for my guitar and guitar processor. I haven't tried to fit my 2 L2t's in yet but I'm guessing if I need to I could fit them in the front seat. I'll know on Saturday when I try to load all this stuff in my car. So I don't know that there is any reason to go for a line array, With this system I can take what I need for the gig I'm doing. These have pretty good horizontal coverage too 100 degrees as opposed to the 170 degrees that the Bose have. But that Bose coverage can work against you if you are trying to use 2 in a L/R configuration because the coverage is so great they are susceptible to phase cancellation. I think Line 6 should stick with this product it's a winner and just continue to add more options in the way they did with the L2t. Maybe some smaller sub options?

So the issue, if I understand it correctly is just that you lost functionality on the iPad? the stagescape M20d continued to function as did the speakers? You just lost control from the app? If so that's no reason to lose positivity of Line 6. I would have thought a sound man's first priority would be SOUND, not whether or not he can faithfully control the stagescape from his iPad. What is he doing anyway that he has to continually fiddle with the controls all night. I will admit that if you are maintaining wifi but losing functionality, it's an issue that needs to be addressed and Line 6 needs to know about it so that they can work to fix it. But I don't know that many of us would run into that problem or notice it if we did. Personally, I may use the ipad to go out front and do a virtual sound check. And throughout the night, I may make an adjustment or two here and there, if things change as the room fills up with people. But I'm on stage at that point and I just go straight to the M20d and do a quick tweak between songs. I sure as heck wouldn't do a restart of the M20d during a set just so I can play with my iPad. That would wait for a break. If the sound needs to be adjusted that badly in the middle of a set, I would suggest the sound check never got completed, which of course can happen. Sometimes, you don't even get a soundcheck. Of course, I'm just throwing all that out there in good fun and out of curiousity. Getting back to the real issue, is what may have caused it. As I said anytime I mess with the ipad app, it's never for extended periods of time like that. IF there is an issue it's in getting the two to connect in the first place, but once they're locked they are locked. I had heard that an issue that can prevent the app from connecting to the M20d in the first place is if there is another wifi network going on in the background. I wonder if it's possible that another wifi network could cause problems even after your made a connection with the network you are using to link the ipad to the M20d. Although if it took a restart of the M20d to fix I don't know that this would make sense. Unless of course you didn't try just turning the wifi on the ipad off for a bit and then turning it back on. I don't mean just closing the app and re-opening, I mean going into settings and turing wifi off then turning it back on and choosing your network again. Turning the M20d off and on would essentially do a similar thing as it would remove the network for the ipad and then allow it access again. Not identical, but close enough that it could resolve the same issue. If it is something like this, I don't think that there will be a fix via firmware or app updates. It's just a fact of life. You may have to figure out a way to make a stronger wifi network to make the connection more stable. It could be totally something else, I'm just thinking out loud here.

Can't help you there, I don't have a DT25 or DT50 and I never will have. I don't need it to get great sounds. I do like the concept of it and I'm sure it sounds great but so does the L3t and L2t. I've done experiments with my other guitar players HD500 using line 6 link which automatically put the L3t in guitar mode. If I remember correctly I think it automatically bypassed the HD500's speaker modelling. It sounded awesome but it also sounded great using the speaker modelling going into an input on the L3t, so in that respect it's very versatile. I think once you get the L3t you'll better be able to decide if you actually need to use both, but if you are determined that you do need both I don't think the L6 link would be the way to go. Isn't there a direct speaker out on the DT series amps? That would likely be the better route to go, I have a feeling that if you did try using the L6 link, and it worked, it would be telling the L3t to go into guitar mode all the time unless you spend a bunch of time setting things up so that it doesn't. I think you would have to do something to every patch to make the L3t stay in PA mode. If you just use the direct out into an input it will just help make your DT louder, if you even need that. Once it arrives try all the scenarios and see what's best and hopefully report back, I'd like to hear about your findings. You may just find that using the HD500's speaker sims through the L3t in PA mode kills. Maybe not, it will be interesting to see what you come up with.

I can't possibly see how adding more instruments would detract from your guitar tone. Most of the time I use two L3t's either with a L3s or without but either way I am either running everything (drums, bass, two guitars, 3 vocals) or if no sub, 4 vocals, electric guitar and acoustic guitar. In both of those scenarios the sound is outstanding and loud with plenty of headroom. If I am just jamming and only need my voice and my guitar I take a single L2t and still get amazing sound quality. In whatever situation I have used these speakers the guitar tone has never suffered, in fact the guitar tone shines. I used to own 2 Bose L1 model II both with B2 subs. I loved the guitar tone of going direct through them but I have to admit the guitar tone is much better through these speakers, and I didn't think that would be possible. Much thicker and warmer guitar tone. I'm even finding that with a little EQ work I can get the vocals to be close to as good as they were on the Bose. I play through a Roland GR-55, my other guitar player plays through an HD500, both of us are extremely happy with our guitar tones and like I said, these tones are competing for speaker space with drums, bass, vocals and each other. That includes the fact that my GR-55 is a guitar synth and I sometimes do keyboard sounds through it. No worries, these speakers will handle all that easily.

I was wondering about a way to try to possibly get more use out of the USB inputs. My idea may be possible, maybe not. The idea is to try using a USB recording interface with the M20d. I'm sure it's not possible at this time, although I haven't tried. The problem I see as it stands is that the M20d would have to "see" the USB interface, so as is necessary when using such a device with a computer, drivers would likely be necessary. So I'm throwing it out there, that if Line 6 were to include some drivers for some popular USB recording interfaces, it would be possible for M20d owners to expand the number of inputs without having to create an M40d or the like. I don't know if doing so would be as complex or more so than making it possible to link 2 M20d's via USB. I'm just throwing the idea out there. If you only needed a few more inputs this would be a less expensive option than buying a second M20d. The problem I see, that may be standing in the way, is that as it stands it is impossible to use the M20d as a recording interface because the best possible latency it can provide is a full 1/2 second. If adding a USB interface or a second M20d would suffer the same latency, the I guess the latency issue would have to be rectified first. Which would be awesome in it's own right, Imagine being able to use the M20d as a recording interface. It blows my mind that a device this amazing can't do it already, but who knows. Anyway, just some thoughts.

I haven't tried it yet to be honest, but on the touch screen you can swipe all the channels to the left to show another complete blank set of channels. The hardware encoders are assigned to the currently displayed set of icons (for lack of a better way to describe it). There are only 12 encoder knobs but 20 inputs (if you include USB and SD card. When you swipe to the left all the encoders will be unassigned, unless some got assigned that you couldn't see. So you could have all your individual channels on the first "Bank" of icons and then monitors and subgroups once your swipe over to the next "Bank".

Well, here is something interesting, I wanted to try to affect all the files at once to try to give them titles that would put the songs in a certain order. So I loaded them into itunes, right clicked on the first file gave it a track number and so on. Then I dragged them directly from itunes to the USB drive. Voila, I put the USB in the M20d and there were no ghost files only the actual mp3s. I was able to do a load all and they all played perfectly. I'm assuming it had nothing to do with me numbering the songs but more the accidental discovery of putting the files in itunes first and then dragging them onto the USB drive. Hopefully this helps other mac users.

Thanks for the replies guys. This is good to know. I think this leaves me with two choices, either see if there is some way to have the mac show me the hidden files so I can delete them from my card, or... load the files onto my PC at work and then back onto the SD card from the PC and see if there is some kind of wizardry I can perform during that process to leave those extended files behind.

I was wondering if anyone else has tried this and if so if they are having the same experience as I am. I recently went through some issues with my M20d regarding on of my SD cards in which the card would not be recognized in record mode. I re-installed the firmware and was able to get my card working however one issue still persists and I am wondering if anyone else is having this problem. If I load a bunch of mp3s onto an SD card to play music between sets. The actual file loads in but there is also some sort of dummy file that loads in with the exact same file name except that it is preceded with a period then an underscore. And it is only on the M20d. If I put the SD card back into my computer the dummy file doesn't show up. So for example if I were to load on the file "I Saw Her Standing There.mp3" then put the SD Card into the M20d I would see the following when I go to the add to setlist menu on the M20d; "I Saw Her Standing There.mp3" "._I Saw Her Standing There.mp3" The second file won't play, if I try to do an "add all" I get a message stating that the M20d couldn't play the file because the "add all" function is including all the dummy files. This means I have to go through and individually add every other file from the list so that none of the dummy files get added. It's very tedious and time consuming, especially if you want to load a quiet set for during dinner and then some dancing music for between sets.