hideout Posted August 18, 2016 Share Posted August 18, 2016 I'm currently perfectly happy with the stability of 2.0. I had one crash but it's been admirably stable since. Any compelling reasons to go to 2.01? If the upgrade process wasn't so tedious and sometimes precarious, I wouldn't be asking this. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
phil_m Posted August 18, 2016 Share Posted August 18, 2016 The two biggest fixes with 2.01 imo were the input Z fix and the thing with the delay time changes with snapshot changes. If those don't effect you, I guess it's your prerogative to not install the update. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hideout Posted August 18, 2016 Author Share Posted August 18, 2016 Hmm. Not sure that mine is actually suffering from the input-Z issue. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
guitarphil11 Posted August 18, 2016 Share Posted August 18, 2016 I just bought a Helix and updated the first day, it was honestly very simple and I had no problems. Obviously I didn't have any presets yet so the backup may cause some issues but it was straight forward. The biggest thing that confused me is the download links for everything are actually in a forum, and the "download" button is in the lower right of the post. That can probably be improved so its more straight forward having links side by side. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bsd512 Posted August 18, 2016 Share Posted August 18, 2016 I think another change was reverting the pitch shift algorithm to the pre-2.0 method which affected a number of folks, so if that's an issue for you, and I think it related to tracking and chords, that might be a reason to update. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Verne-Bunsen Posted August 18, 2016 Share Posted August 18, 2016 I've been batting this around too. When I did the 2.0 update, I was unpleasantly surprised to find that my IRs weren't backed up in a way that put them back in the same slots. That took some time to sort back out. Not sure if it's worth the hassle of doing that dance again. I've thought of numbering the file names, but the names are already so truncated by the OS that it's hard enough to capture the relevant info without sacrificing a couple of characters to numbering. Decisions, decisions! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hideout Posted August 18, 2016 Author Share Posted August 18, 2016 Frankly I don't understand why we should even have to worry about the order of the presets we've created. Is it really that hard to make the Helix remember which preset goes in which slot? Mine were all screwed up order-wise. To my mind the only reason we should back things up before an update is in case something goes wrong. If the update was successful, the presets should still be there and in the same order. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spikey Posted August 18, 2016 Share Posted August 18, 2016 hideout, in order to make things play nice together after the patch, Helix requires a reset/rebuild of the factory patches by holding down a couple of buttons and turing power on. This also clears out the user banks iirc. That (right now) is why presets are not in the same order as you may have left them. If you saved your presets and set lists, then its just a matter of replacing them in the order you choose. I agree it would be easy if the update remembers what we had beforehand. What is, and what should be are always different in most cases. ;) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hideout Posted August 19, 2016 Author Share Posted August 19, 2016 I don't know... It just seems like keeping the order of the presets isn't that much to ask for. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HonestOpinion Posted August 19, 2016 Share Posted August 19, 2016 I don't know... It just seems like keeping the order of the presets isn't that much to ask for. As long as you use "Export Setlist", the "Import Setlist" will restore your presets in exactly the same order to exactly the same slot they were in. It is the IRs that need to be prefixed with a number so that you can restore them to the correct slots. I think the IR saving and restoring could really bear improvement. Not only is keeping them in the right slots a bit of a pain but the truncation of the names often renders the names useless as information like cap versus cone and mic distance, are often in the truncated part at the end of the IR name. The namespace for IRs truly needs to be longer. I personally always like being on the latest firmware as long as it does not have a major bug but I could see waiting for the next version to upgrade if the differences between 2.0 and 2.01 don't particularly impact you. The difference between these two versions are not as significant as some of the past revisions. Note: I personally hope Line6 proceeds with their improvements to the pitch shifting regardless of whether it impacts the presets others have sold or created in prior firmware versions. If they can do it without impacting former presets adversely all the better. I do understand people not wanting older presets to be impacted by new firmware versions (particularly when they sold or purchased them) but sometimes that is the cost of getting better tracking, greater authenticity, or other improvements. I think Line6 has been outstanding in providing continuity from one firmware version to the next in this regard so far but if the old ark needs some movering, so be it, I will adjust my presets accordingly. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
silverhead Posted August 19, 2016 Share Posted August 19, 2016 Frankly I don't understand why we should even have to worry about the order of the presets we've created. Is it really that hard to make the Helix remember which preset goes in which slot? Mine were all screwed up order-wise. To my mind the only reason we should back things up before an update is in case something goes wrong. If the update was successful, the presets should still be there and in the same order. There's another reason to back up setlists (not bundle) before an update. Sometimes a firmware update includes new or modified factory presets (as happened recently with v2.0). In order to install the new presets you need to overwrite all existing presets. Without a backup of your existing custom presets/setlists you can't reinstall them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rocco_Crocco Posted August 19, 2016 Share Posted August 19, 2016 Meh... I am at 2.0. I am going to wait for the next big update as I don't have any noticeable bugs at the moment. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hideout Posted August 19, 2016 Author Share Posted August 19, 2016 Meh... I am at 2.0. I am going to wait for the next big update as I don't have any noticeable bugs at the moment. Yeah, me too. I still don't see why we should be forced to have to reload our customized presets and set lists. It's fine for Line 6 to have new presets that take advantage newly implemented features but I want it to be my choice as the whether or not they get loaded onto the Helix. As a gigging musician, I want to be able to update my Helix and use it immediately as I always have. Then later, at a time of MY choosing, check out the new presets... If I want to. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HonestOpinion Posted August 19, 2016 Share Posted August 19, 2016 Yeah, me too. I still don't see why we should be forced to have to reload our customized presets and set lists. It's fine for Line 6 to have new presets that take advantage newly implemented features but I want it to be my choice as the whether or not they get loaded onto the Helix. As a gigging musician, I want to be able to update my Helix and use it immediately as I always have. Then later, at a time of MY choosing, check out the new presets... If I want to. I would love to see the backup and restore of IRs and presets be done automatically as part of the firmware upgrade process. Another option would be for them to be upgraded in place although a backup is always a good idea before a firmware upgrade, even if nothing needs to be reloaded. This could make upgrading more failsafe and painless for users while encouraging people to enjoy the latest and greatest firmware versions with all the benefits they provide. Given that Line6 is still adding and improving Factory presets I still think it is a good idea for people not to edit their Factory presets in the "Factory" user lists but instead to copy them to a User list and edit them there. That way new and improved Factory presets can be automatically installed by firmware updates to the Factory lists and your User lists can be backed up and restored exactly as they were. For people who use the Factory lists for their own presets they could have the option of restoring their old Factory presets. For most people though five User lists (excluding the Templates and Factory lists) is more than enough for customizing their own presets and the Factory/Template lists can be used for reference. If you do edit your Factory lists I suggest exporting the edited presets individually by highlighting them all and hitting "Export". This will enable you to restore as many as you want without completely overwriting the potentially new Factory presets after a firmware upgrade. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WickedFinger Posted August 19, 2016 Share Posted August 19, 2016 I think another change was reverting the pitch shift algorithm to the pre-2.0 method which affected a number of folks, so if that's an issue for you, and I think it related to tracking and chords, that might be a reason to update. Improved upon the basic glitch burble of all monophonic tracking pitch shifters and octave things they are still sadly not polyphonic (chords) tracking as so much new technology is these days. Wondering if it is just beyond the scope of the in unit technology?? EHX does it in their effects and they are not extreme high tech pedals. Many get away with slight detunes on 1 step and get reasonable tracking but they are not by any means polyphonic tracking effects. = Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HonestOpinion Posted August 19, 2016 Share Posted August 19, 2016 Improved upon the basic glitch burble of all monophonic tracking pitch shifters and octave things they are still sadly not polyphonic (chords) tracking as so much new technology is these days. Wondering if it is just beyond the scope of the in unit technology?? EHX does it in their effects and they are not extreme high tech pedals. Many get away with slight detunes on 1 step and get reasonable tracking but they are not by any means polyphonic tracking effects. = Exactly WickedFinger! Polyphonic tracking would be awesome! These and other kinds of improvements are precisely what I do not want to see rolled back just to preserve the status quo for old presets. If they can make the improvements without impacting old presets all the better but I will opt for improved functionality and better sounds with a little work required on my end tweaking old presets any day of the week. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bsd512 Posted August 20, 2016 Share Posted August 20, 2016 Note: I personally hope Line6 proceeds with their improvements to the pitch shifting regardless of whether it impacts the presets others have sold or created in prior firmware versions. If they can do it without impacting former presets adversely all the better. I do understand people not wanting older presets to be impacted by new firmware versions (particularly when they sold or purchased them) but sometimes that is the cost of getting better tracking, greater authenticity, or other improvements. I think Line6 has been outstanding in providing continuity from one firmware version to the next in this regard so far but if the old ark needs some movering, so be it, I will adjust my presets accordingly. I whole heartily agree with this and posted somewhere in some other thread with a similar sentiment. I'll take the improvements any day and rework any patches I have that may have changed slightly - though chances are I wouldn't because the improvements would likely make those patches better, even if they didn't sound exactly like I originally made them. :) But I can understand the dilemma L6 is in. On the one hand they improve the modeling quality, UI usability, etc, which benefits users. Also they could refactor their own internal code making it more maintainable over time. Sometimes such refactoring necessitates wiping and reloading/migrating old patches to new formats, UI workflow changes, etc, but makes future development and additions much easier and extends the life-cycle of the firmware before it eventually gets to the point where maintenance and additions get so hard that it's no longer viable and they have to retire it and start over with a new design. Essentially, we'd get longer life out of the Helix with continual improvements along the way. On the other hand, they'll have lots of customers that will complain loudly about every little thing that works differently after a major firmware update. And I can understand their point of view too. Folks may have dozens of patches they've spent 100's of hours on and now have to "fix" them. It's a dilemma. Transparent updates are not always possible. My own personal customer-vote is - upward and onward, keep the firmware improvements coming even if it means I need to go back and change patches or they way I work. I'll adapt. I'm good with translucent updates at the benefit of platform improvements for the greater good. :) 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hideout Posted August 20, 2016 Author Share Posted August 20, 2016 Well, at this point, I'm so satisfied with how everything sounds and works that only a global effects loop, one that is unaffected by preset changes, or independent preamp and power amp blocks would be the only things that would get me to update again. Other than those two things everything's just peachy for me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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