Jtv59 Popping Noise Changing Models Though Hd500

[edstar1960]

My JTV59 is on fw2.0 and it makes a popping sound when my HD500 changes the model selected when I change patch using Fs1 to fs4.

I have tested the HD500 with a standard guitar and the patch changes are silent. I have also tested with the JTV and each patch set to DONT FORCE and its ok, but if the HD500 patch forces a model change then I get a popping sound when I press the Fs.

I will roll back my JTV to an earlier fw and see if the popping disappears, and if it does then hopefully I can identify which fw introduced it. I suspect it was v2 as I did not have this problem before.

This popping is particularly noticeable when connected up to my DT25 and also changing amp models, and at volume the popping is really clear and not what you want mid song or even between songs.

Has anyone else had this issue? Thanks.

[snhirsch]

Does it seem affected by which particular patches are involved?  I routinely use the HD-500 to switch, e.g. between six and twelve-string Rickenbacker models and don't recall ever hearing any artifacts.  Can you tell me what models you are switching between when this occurs?  I'll try it on my setup.

[edstar1960]

Does it seem affected by which particular patches are involved?  I routinely use the HD-500 to switch, e.g. between six and twelve-string Rickenbacker models and don't recall ever hearing any artifacts.  Can you tell me what models you are switching between when this occurs?  I'll try it on my setup.

 

I am using TELE pos 1 and 5 and Lester 1.  But the problem is with any model change.   I know that from the very early days just manually switching banks on the Variax 700 and the JTV 59 would often result in a loud pop when moving to the acoustic bank - never found out why that was - but it never used to be a problem when auto switching from a POD floor unit such as the X3L or the HD500.  But with this latest fw release it is there.

 

I am going to rollback to 1.71 to see if it goes away and then roll forward and see if/when it reappears. 

[edstar1960]

I have rolled back to 1.71 and the popping noise has gone.

 

I have a gig tonight so I have not got time today to roll forward to see when the popping will re-appear. That will have to wait till tomorrow.

[JeffersteinVS]

I also have the same issues on the 59 with a hd500x/ reverb or delay patchs make the pop even worse

[edstar1960]

I also have the same issues on the 59 with a hd500x/ reverb or delay patchs make the pop even worse

 

What version fw are you on with your JTV59?    The problem does not occur at v1.71.     I will be rolling forward one version at a time to see when it reappears, because I jumped from v.171 to v2 and hit the problem.  I will have to stick with whatever the latest version is that is "pop" free for now.  Once I determine which level introduces the problem I will report it to L6 via support ticket.

[JeffersteinVS]

I am on 2.0 my selft. I bought the guitar with 2.0 on it from sweet water. let me know what the latest version that is pop free is if you could. thank you!

[edstar1960]

OK - finally managed to find some time for this - then I realised I had to roll back to v2 before I could roll back to another level of fw - I should have rolled back one at a time until the popping vanished rather than go back to v1.71 and roll forward.

 

I had the SAME midi error failure at the end rolling forward to v2.0 - then I realised I had used my normal VDI cable so I swapped it out for the shorter cable that came with the JTV usb interface dongle and tried again. This time to my surprise when I had unplugged everything and reconnected it all, Monkey told me I had fw 2.0 on my guitar although it had just told me it had failed with the midi error - weird.  Anyway, I took advantage of the situation and selected the roll back option and chose 1.82 this time. (I know I should have tried the going back one at a time BUT I had made my mind up I was rolling forward one at a time).   Good news is that the popping does not occur at fw 1.82.

 

Now I have to try 1.9   so watch this space  ....    :)

[edstar1960]

I have now moved on to v1.9 and  I can report the popping is not happening.

 

I will stay on this for a little while before I venture to v2.0 again.  Perhaps the popping has been cured by the reflashing or it was introduced with v2.0, I won't know until I go back to v2.0.

[edstar1960]

I have raised a support ticket with Line 6 to bring this to their attention.

[JeffersteinVS]

Thanks let me know what comes of the support ticket. I am gong to roll back one of my jtvs to 1.9 tonight

I have raised a support ticket with Line 6 to bring this to their attention.

[edstar1960]

Thanks let me know what comes of the support ticket. I am gong to roll back one of my jtvs to 1.9 tonight

 

HI - Line 6 have just responded saying "first they have heard of this" and "can I post a sound clip of the problem".

I pointed out that you are also experiencing the issue and that I had rolled back to avoid the issue and have some gigs coming up and won't have time to roll forward and back in the meantime.  I have asked if they can try to recreate it, as if it is a problem with fw v2.0, then it is easy to recreate and spot, and if not then it points to an issue with our JTVs or the way we updated our fw which caused us to have the problem.

 

If you still have a JTV that is exhibiting the problem - would you be able to make a quick recording showing the problem and post it to this thread?  I can then point Line 6 support to this.

 

Thanks very much.

[Rewolf48]

First they have heard about it?

 

Is that direct confirmation that Line 6 don't bother with monitoring threads in this forum: http://line6.com/support/topic/2167-jtv59-to-hd500-vdi-getting-a-pop-when-i-change-patchs-that-also-change-variax-model/ ? edstar was on that one too back in August.

 

I also get a pop when changing Models via HD500 expecially going to Acoustics, won't be able to record anything until at least Sunday

[JeffersteinVS]

yeah i opened a ticket for this a while back too, im sure everyone is experiencing the issue who uses 2.0 with a vdi connection allowing the pod to control the variax model changes

[Charlie_Watt]

If they don't know about this they are not playing their JTV's because they all seem to do it.  They should be more careful about this because it is important to folks that are playing live and switching models.  This is one of the coolest features of the JTV!  It's all about controlling the DC levels of the models I believe.  The Variax500 only did this  when first switching to the Acoustic bank.  It did not pop when switching to any other banks and it only popped once switching to acoustic.  I always found this to be annoying.

[edstar1960]

Thanks everyone for confirming that this is not isolated to just me and JeffersteinVS.   I have cross referenced both this thread and JeffersteinsVS's earlier thread in my support ticket and mentioned several people have confirmed they get this problem..  Hopefully Line6 will take notice and get it fixed.

[Charlie_Watt]

They do seem to be very slow on bug fixes and updates for JTV lately:

 

WB HD bugs - discovered right after release.

 

No Pod Driver for WB HD (everyone is waiting for this one!)

[edstar1960]

They do seem to be very slow on bug fixes and updates for JTV lately:

 

WB HD bugs - discovered right after release.

 

No Pod Driver for WB HD (everyone is waiting for this one!)

 

I guess that is no surprise considering they have just been taken over by Yamaha - I guess all priorities are being re-evaluated as they get assimilated.  I hope it doesn't add too much of a delay to getting these items fixed.

[Rewolf48]

Probably more about the new product (or products?) being launched at NAMM next week.

 

They are fueling speculation with little hints on the main website, about how they have "re-invented" guitar amplification. I expect that it has been taking up all their time for most of last year.

 

For some reason no speculation threads have taken off here, but this one is more active than most: http://www.thegearpage.net/board/showthread.php?t=1370086

 

I just hope that:

 

a) The Launch and Delivery are not disconnected like with the JTVs

 

b) That they have been bundling up the bug fixes and improvements for the other products with integration into whatever it is so that we get some fixes soon 

[pugdealer]

I also have the same issues on the 59 with a hd500x/ reverb or delay patchs make the pop even worse

Same here

 

JTV-69 (brand new) on 2.0, HD500 on 2.2, and popping noises, specially on patches with delay(s). I've rolled back the POD DH500 firmware, and popping seems to be less on previous versions, but still there!

[edstar1960]

Same here

 

JTV-69 (brand new) on 2.0, HD500 on 2.2, and popping noises, specially on patches with delay(s). I've rolled back the POD DH500 firmware, and popping seems to be less on previous versions, but still there!

 

The popping goes away completely on JTV fw 1.9, so you can bypass it.   

[pugdealer]

Yeah, I read that before, but I want to keep 2.0...I'll wait for a fix and endure it as is meanwhile! :/

[arislaf]

Same here, count me in :) I also have poping noises same as above.

[JeffersteinVS]

This is the response I got back from the support ticket

 

Hello,

I have tested this and confirmed that this does happen.  To my ear, this almost sounds like a clip when the 2nd patch is loaded.  I have found that when I am not strumming before changing tones I do not hear this pop.  So, from that, my best explanation for this pop is that it is a clip when the new patch is loaded, since audio is still passing through the system while the next patch is loaded.

The best recommendation I can give is to change your patch and then strum your note.  I like to think about it like punching in during recording.  You don't want to wait for the guy to start playing before you punch him in, you punch him in just before he starts playing, otherwise there is a pop.  The same principle applies here.  Stop playing momentarily (mute the instrument), change your patch, then keep playing and you will not experience this pop.

This may be something that will be resolved moving forward but I cannot say that with any certainty or time frame at this time.

Jon
Line 6 Customer Support

[ColonelForbin]

This may be something that will be resolved moving forward but I cannot say that with any certainty or time frame at this time.

Jon
Line 6 Customer Support

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Funny response!! Considering this was NOT A PROBLEM with the 1.9 firmware. That guarded and carefully worded response makes me think the problem is not going to be solved anytime soon. My guess: DSP max out related - which they don't want to admit since they cannot fix it. So, if you stay forever on 1.9, you will never get HD models. If you roll forward, you must endure a [glitch / error / noise].

 

The reason I speculate "DSP" related, is because the new models are higher fidelity, which translates to more file size allocation, and ultimately which requires higher end processing power. Just guesses really. I will get to jam on it for the first time tonight, and if I can find a 1/4" cable, I will at least update to 2.0 before  go.

 

One question / clarification : Does the Popping Sound occur when changing patches with the guitar "muted" as L6 support indicated we should do? For me that's not a terrible thing; as long as some kind of patch change can occur without that popping sound.

[edstar1960]

This is the response I got back from the support ticket

 

Hello,

I have tested this and confirmed that this does happen.  To my ear, this almost sounds like a clip when the 2nd patch is loaded.  I have found that when I am not strumming before changing tones I do not hear this pop.  So, from that, my best explanation for this pop is that it is a clip when the new patch is loaded, since audio is still passing through the system while the next patch is loaded.

The best recommendation I can give is to change your patch and then strum your note.  I like to think about it like punching in during recording.  You don't want to wait for the guy to start playing before you punch him in, you punch him in just before he starts playing, otherwise there is a pop.  The same principle applies here.  Stop playing momentarily (mute the instrument), change your patch, then keep playing and you will not experience this pop.

This may be something that will be resolved moving forward but I cannot say that with any certainty or time frame at this time.

Jon

Line 6 Customer Support

Thank you for sharing. I must say I am very disappointed with that response. It was not present at 1.9 and it is present at 2.0. When I was testing out scenarios where the problem occurred, I tried muting the strings and still got a pop, not as loud but it was still there. The vague reference to whether or not it will be fixed is probably due to the take over, and that they have probably suspended all decisions on product support and direction until Yamaha take over completed. :(

[JeffersteinVS]

If you want to use one model guitar per song your ok, i like switching from a les paul for distortion and then to a strat in 5th position for my cleans = POP

 

This may be something that will be resolved moving forward but I cannot say that with any certainty or time frame at this time.

Jon
Line 6 Customer Support

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Funny response!! Considering this was NOT A PROBLEM with the 1.9 firmware. That guarded and carefully worded response makes me think the problem is not going to be solved anytime soon. My guess: DSP max out related - which they don't want to admit since they cannot fix it. So, if you stay forever on 1.9, you will never get HD models. If you roll forward, you must endure a [glitch / error / noise].

 

The reason I speculate "DSP" related, is because the new models are higher fidelity, which translates to more file size allocation, and ultimately which requires higher end processing power. Just guesses really. I will get to jam on it for the first time tonight, and if I can find a 1/4" cable, I will at least update to 2.0 before  go.

 

One question / clarification : Does the Popping Sound occur when changing patches with the guitar "muted" as L6 support indicated we should do? For me that's not a terrible thing; as long as some kind of patch change can occur without that popping sound.

 

[edstar1960]

Update:   My support ticket has been updated to say that the guy looking at it is playing catch up and still has not got round to mine but he will leave it open until he gets time to review it.   Let's see if I end up with the same response as JeffersteinVS.   

[smrybacki]

Update:   My support ticket has been updated to say that the guy looking at it is playing catch up and still has not got round to mine but he will leave it open until he gets time to review it.   Let's see if I end up with the same response as JeffersteinVS.   

The check is in the mail dude lol....

[edstar1960]

The check is in the mail dude lol....

 Ha ha   :D

[edstar1960]

Here is my reply from Line 6 support:

 

Hi,

Sorry for the very late reply I was working on this this morning with a 59 and 89 we have here in the office and could not get either to pop with the presets listed below.

However, I do see from the threads that several people are experiencing the same thing...

Is it possible for you to update this will a video of the guitar behaving like this. 

If I have an exact repro like this I can  consult with engineering about it.

Thanks,
David

 

**** END QUOTE ***

 

Does anyone have an audio or video of the problem that they could upload to this thread for me?  I don't want to move back to firmware 2.0 just to recreate this, if I don't absolutely need to.  So if someone already has a recording or still has the issue and can quickly upload a recording for me that I could pass on to Line 6 support, then that would be greatly appreciated.   Many thanks!

[edstar1960]

Has anyone got an audio recording demonstrating this problem they could upload to this thread for me to pass on to Line 6 support?  Many thanks.

[edstar1960]

I have just raised this on IDEASCALE - so please vote for this to be fixed!

 

Here is the link:  http://line6.ideascale.com/a/dtd/Please-fix-popping-noise-changing-JTV-model-from-HD500/605833-23508?submitted=1

 

Thank you!

 

:)

[edstar1960]

Line 6 have acknowledged receipt of the audio file demonstrating the issue (thank you canerakcil) and have forwarded it to engineering for review.  The representative looking after my ticket has still been unable to reproduce the problem with a JTV at Line 6.  He has suggested that I double check that it is not a gain issue swapping from a low volume patch to a high volume and vice versa and to ensure all my patches are levelled volume wise and he has also suggested that perhaps it could be a latency issue and to try a different Cat5e cable for the VDI connection.  My patches are fairly even regarding volume and I have tried two different VDI cables and the Cat5e cables that come with the JTV and still get the problem, however, those suggestions may help someone else.

I will let you know when I get a further update with news from engineering.    

[cruisinon2]

The representative looking after my ticket has still been unable to reproduce the problem with a JTV at Line 6. 

 

I really don't understand how that's possible. I can build two patches from scratch, choosing amps at random, and I'll get the popping sound when I switch between them. If I could find a way to NOT get it, it would be a minor miracle, yet nobody "official" can reproduce it? Ugh...

[edstar1960]

I really don't understand how that's possible. I can build two patches from scratch, choosing amps at random, and I'll get the popping sound when I switch between them. If I could find a way to NOT get it, it would be a minor miracle, yet nobody "official" can reproduce it? Ugh...

 

Neither do I - but that is what has been relayed back to me.

 

When JeffersteinVS reported the same problem his L6 support rep did manage to reproduce the problem but the reps advice was to not to have any notes ringing from one patch to the next and he was also sure when or if it would be addressed but that was around the time of the Yamaha take over announcement, so no real surprise about that comment.

 

I got the popping even when I tried muting strings between patch changes and the audio I sent in from user canerakcil also showed a clear pop in between patch changes without chords being played.  Many people have reported it so it's not just something unique to my equipment or setup.  Seems like this is another one of those mystery fw 2.0  bugs that only affects some users.

 

I have pointed out to my L6 support rep that the other rep had managed to reproduce the issue and suggested perhaps they get together to see if they can get a handle on the issue.

 

I will report back when I get another update.

[Rewolf48]

In case my vote hasn't been heard - I have it too with latest Firmware on JTV and HD500.

 

Not that bad if both patches are electric, but really loud pop if going into Acoustic model

[edstar1960]

Line 6 support have come back to say that they don't think this is a bug or an issue and that it is something that will happen with any stomp box if you attack a note as you press the footswitch to engage the effect or change the patch.

 

I know that this problem started happening when I moved to fw 2.0, I know I get the problem even when I mute the strings between patch changes, I know the problem goes away or diminishes significantly when you go back to fw 1.9, I also know that I am not the only one that has had this problem and surely everyone who has reported it can't have just happened to have changed their playing style and forced the issue. Furthermore, if it was as simple as attacking the note and pressing the footswitch then surely anyone can recreate it - yet my Line 6 support rep said he cannot recreate it.

 

And how do they explain that the problem only happens when HD500 patch forces a model change on the JTV and goes away if you set HD500 patches to DONT FORCE or if you use a standard guitar? Surely if it was playing style it would occur all the time.

 

I have pointed all these issues out and have asked that they look at it again - and I have asked what the engineers say about the problem - but if anyone else would like to chime in and raise a support ticket to add substance to the case for fixing this bug then I would greatly appreciate your help.

 

Thanks!

[edstar1960]

This is fixed with JTV fw 2.1

 

:)