Time between preset swtiching unbearable.

[mikedub]

Switching noises should be mitigated in the next release. Delay artifacts are due to a lack of Global tempo parameter, which we eventually hope to solve as well, but preset switching time is our top priority right now (and it's already WAY faster in the latest internal beta build). In the meantime, if two presets are set to the same tempo, any delay artifacts should be minimized.

 

Thanks everyone for your patience.

 

Thanks for this post Digital Igloo.  It's reassuring to know that these issues have been acknowledged and are being worked on by Line6!  I will look forward to the hopefully immanent update being released.

 

I will also try altering some of my delay times to see if I can minimise the strange sounds I get between certain patches in the meantime.

 

Thanks for your help B)

[mcbeddall]

Try contacting your supplier, I did a few weeks ago and they agreed to a full refund despite being about 40 days over my cooling off period, in the end however I decided to stick with it because at present there are no other multi fx out there that appeals to me, I'm pretty confident line 6 will sort out the issues but I totally agree with what your saying

[urbanspaceblast]

Switching noises should be mitigated in the next release. Delay artifacts are due to a lack of Global tempo parameter, which we eventually hope to solve as well, but preset switching time is our top priority right now (and it's already WAY faster in the latest internal beta build). In the meantime, if two presets are set to the same tempo, any delay artifacts should be minimized.

 

Thanks everyone for your patience.

Thanks. I appreciate the update.

[kevell99]

Sorry, it's not meant to be that way. We won't change our songs in tempo or anything else, because Line6 isn't able to deliver a working processor. My patience has gone. I'm waiting 5 weeks for the update now to get the product that was promised. We are customers and no suppliants. We paid hardly earned money for this and got little in return. I'mvery upset.

The first person I talked to at the Line6 service told me he couldn't reproduce switching noises or delay noises. Ah, O.k.

So we're all wrong, it's just our imagination.

Thank you Line6, well done.

That's not what he said - presumably if you're switching from one patch to another within a song the tempo will be the same anyway...?

 

On that though, the android feature of being able to double tap the tempo and enter it exactly needs to be on iOS in order to keep patches at the exact same tempo!

 

Thanks for the updates Igloo, we all appreciate them! (except Timmi, apparently).

[mcbeddall]

We have about 4 changes of tempo per song but none of them deliberate

[Varialogue1]

Mcbeddal I vote your last quip to be best post 2015. Take a bow. I enjoyed it immensely.

[nremondelli]

We have about 4 changes of tempo per song but none of them deliberate

Classic.

[bond19]

At the end of it all- Joking aside- this lag issue is a real problem, which has caused me to return my Line 6 Firehawk in exchange for an HD500X.  When I first got my Firehawk, I enjoyed exploring and figuring out how the thing ticked, but there were too many issues (with the lag problem being one of the main ones), which made me evaluate my time spent tinkering- it was just too much messing around, trying to "work around" issues with the device to get patches that "played nice" together.  I'll be a few 0's & 1's over on the HD500X forum- cheers!

[gjhardwick]

Is there an ETA on the latest firmware yet?

[stevekc]

Not to start rumors, but the new Line-6 Helix also appears to suffer long patch change delay

 

http://line6.com/support/topic/14264-helix-faq/page-21?do=findComment&comment=112220

 

mdmayfield's Photomdmayfield

20 Aug 2015

That video from Andertons is funny and informative. The sounds are gorgeous, coming direct from the Helix.

 

The video clearly shows the gap between patches - it sounds like between 750ms and a full second. (Much longer than the HD500 which I'd estimate is 150-ish ms.) For me, that's no big deal since I pretty much never change patches within a song: only between songs.

 

For some people with extremely complex effects for different song sections, it might be a dealbreaker, but I'd bet that the majority of those situations can be worked around with judicious use of the multiple paths and the ability to toggle more than one effect or parameter with a single footswitch.

 

Bummer about the 20-25 second bootup time; again not a big deal for me personally, but it sounded like at least one pro player in this thread has to wait to power their rig until like 1-2 seconds before the downbeat, so it wouldn't work for that person.

 

EDIT: Apparently this was not the final 1.0 firmware. Who knows what optimizations may still be possible, or whether there's still debugging code or other things artificially slowing things down on the unit they showed on the video.

 

 

[phil_m]

Not to start rumors, but the new Line-6 Helix also appears to suffer long patch change delay

 

Well, that is starting a rumor, because the actual time it will take is unknown still. The 1.0 firmware has not been created as of yet, so any videos you are using pre-launch firmware without any optimization being done on that feature yet.

[stevekc]

 

 

 The 1.0 firmware has not been created as of yet, so any videos you are using pre-launch firmware without any optimization being done on that feature yet.

 

Thats not good for a product that is supposed to ship in 2 weeks  - I guess the reports of October 2015 ship date for Helix are true. Not going to be fun updating firmware for 500 units prior to shipments to dealers. 

 

Of course no manufacturer mentions "patch change delay time latency" in their spec sheet, but for many pros, if it takes longer than 150 milliseconds to change form one patch to another patch - that is cause for a refund.

 

I know this "long patch change time with sonic anomalies " aspect of the Firehawk FX was never mentioned prior to my purchase.

For Line-6's sake, I hope they do better with the Helix. But I've come to expect a beta tester experience with all new Line-6 products purchased in their 1st year of production. Hopefully the Firehawk FX will not be orphaned after the next firmware update, because it often takes two or three firmware updates to achieve an acceptable product. As it stands now my Firehawk is OK for personal practice , but too embarrassing for use at a gig where I'm being paid to deliver a show

[mcbeddall]

Zoom publish their latency times when changing patches, but as the g5 changes patches in 2 milliseconds I guess they would shout about it

[Paultm]

Switching noises should be mitigated in the next release. Delay artifacts are due to a lack of Global tempo parameter, which we eventually hope to solve as well, but preset switching time is our top priority right now (and it's already WAY faster in the latest internal beta build). In the meantime, if two presets are set to the same tempo, any delay artifacts should be minimized.

 

Thanks everyone for your patience.

 

Hey Digital_Igloo any update ?

[dan_robbo_100]

I know Radatas mentioned about the delay tails and in Timmi's video he's having the same problem i'v got too. Unless iv missed it i'v got this problem:

 

I'm switching between patches with different delay times and instead of the delay muting and going to the new setting I get crazy sounds like when you change the delay while playing, which I know technically thats what I'm doing but why doesn't it change patches without doing that? Unless I turn off the delay before changing patch I can't stop this from happening. Someone HELP!!!!!  

[mcbeddall]

We all have this problem unfortunately, line 6 are working on a fix but we don't know how long it will be, using the same delay times in both patches would help, or having the delay set to off so that when you change patch you then have to switch the delay on via one of the footswitches, not ideal I know but that's all we can do

[nremondelli]

Is this something we are sure can be fixed by a software update? I ask because I'm still within my 45 day return window.

[stevekc]

My typical worst case Firehawk FX Patch change noise occurs under these conditions 

 

1 ) Select the factory preset "03C Move Like Jagger"

 

2) Strum a chord and let ring, and while the chord is still ringing, select factory preset "03D Tighten Up"

 

3) I always get a very loud high volume burst of noise duration 80 milliseconds  - totally unacceptable for professional gear.

 

 

Same  very loud burst of noise during patch change also occurs frequently on other presets too

 

like changing from "04C Day Tripper" to "04D 4 What Its Worth"

[gjhardwick]

I do get the impression that since the Helix was announced, the Firehawk has been sidelined somewhat, which is strange considering the Firehawk was still a fresh product at the time...

[nremondelli]

That stinks because I really like it. It is the first modeler that I thought sounded good, especially the Hd models AND was simple to use.

[silverhead]

There is a firmware update coming that is intended to address the lag and artifacts issues. We don't know when. But if you like the sounds and can be a little patient you probably will be happy in the end.

[stevekc]

I hope Line 6 can get the Firehawk ASIO Audio Driver for Windows working.

Compared to my HD500X , FireHawk has Nothing but distortion ( its a Kazoo)  here and zero buffer controls (windows 8.1)

And it's a shame that my old XT Live had far superior USB Audio routing and re-amping features not found either HD500X or Firehawk FX.

The fact that these flaws passed quality control at Line -6 speaks volumes to me and has changed my mind on the further Line-6 purchases.
I guess nobody at Line 6 plays rhythm guitar then take a Solo with a different preset mid song?

 

 

 

if you're still in time, do yourself a favour, give it back. I

 

Get your money back - 

Sure wish I could return mine.

Firehawk is one purchase I regret 

 

* No compatibility with Variax Workbench

 

* No MIDI control over USB

 

* No PC /Mac Editor

 

* Broken USB Audio ASIO Driver that is really a joke.

 

* massive noise anomalies during patch changes while playing guitar 

 

* No compatibility with Line-6 Monkey

 

* Its clear the Firehawk is just a AMPLIFI FX100 with a bit more switches and Variax VDI input - but I assumed too much  for a device that I paid $450  

 

At my live gigs, I still employ the dying art of playing both Rhythm and Lead Guitar - so swift patch to patch change time without gaps / mutes / noise anomalies have a high priority for me   

[Paultm]

So I called Line 6 Europe support today, an update should be released in September but could not be more specific. I am struggling to compensate as I play rhythm & lead too.

[nremondelli]

I boxed it up and returned it. Playing around with a Boss GT-001 now.

[stevekc]

Post a review  / comparison of what you find is good /bad between GT-001 vs Firehawk. 

 

fwiw - here is an independent forum for GT-001 

http://www.vguitarforums.com/smf/index.php?board=148.0

 

http://www.vguitarforums.com/smf/index.php?board=149.0

 

GT-001 User created patches 

http://www.vguitarforums.com/smf/index.php?board=150.0

[bond19]

In a couple of days I will have 2 new units to take the place of my Firehawk - A boss GT-100, and a POD HD500X.  I am going to choose the one with less lag time between patch switching as it is my main concern.

[stevekc]

I own both of those  - 

 

I prefer the GT-100, because I can easily tweak the FX with its dual LCD displays and good User controls   -= its nearly point and shoot - No scratching my head and and spinning an encoder, to play "where's waldo" as I navigate folders on a stage lit bleached out poor contrast solid white HD500X LCD, just to adjust the tremolo depth mid song 

[bond19]

I own both of those  - 

 

I prefer the GT-100, because I can easily tweak the FX with its dual LCD displays and good User controls   -= its nearly point and shoot - No scratching my head and and spinning an encoder, to play "where's waldo" as I navigate folders on a stage lit bleached out poor contrast solid white HD500X LCD,[/size] just to adjust the tremolo depth mid song [/size]

Yes, I just got the GT-100 - the screens are bright. Which one has less lag?

[bond19]

Unboxed my HD500X a few hours ago and I must say the build and quality is better than the Firehawk. I started tweaking patches, and right off the bat, the lag time was way less than the Firehawk. Thanks Line 6!

[Varialogue1]

I stumbled on the Amplifi forum. It's worrying. They started a thread in November 2014 that the lag was awful. Almost 1 year later someone just posted that the problem hasn't been fixed. Are we Firehawkers poor deluded fools waiting for Prince Charming aka a firmware lag solution who will never come? Is bond 19 the only man with any sense? Discuss

[mcbeddall]

My patience is running out that's for sure, I've tried not to bash the firehawk as plenty of people are doing that for me and we're stuck with the situation as it is and have to make the best of it, but the fact remains that the firehawk should never have been released in this state, it's disgusting really, there is no way these issues were missed during development, it's clear that they knew of the problems and just thought to hell with our customers

Paul hindmarsh did a video from musicmesse in Germany and you can see the frustration on his face as he tries to keep his patch changes in time, this was recorded prior to release.

I will certainly avoid being an early adopter of any future line6 releases.

Digital igloo will probably chime in in a few days time just to calm us all down again, thing is, firehawk isn't his project, so why aren't the firehawk developers in here giving us an explanation

[Varialogue1]

Absolutely right. The Firehawk is a prototype. Line 6 needed to concentrate on the helix and just decided they couldn't invest any more time in the firehawk. It's like a baby born 3 months premature. I'm on the verge of starting a band again after a few years off but I can't take this thing anywhere with me. I actually love my Firehawk in many ways. It's not her fault. God help Line 6 if the helix suffers the same lag. Anyone paying that money will not be as understanding as us. At the moment, I'm just practicing so I'm ok but if I start going out into the world soon eBay will get 10 per cent of my Firehawks value. If I manufactured smoke alarms that suffered lag, I'd have no customers. Line 6 has mugged me.

[Varialogue1]

If the Firehawk is Betamax, what are my vhs options?

[stevekc]

I've lived through this before . It's the typical Line-6 owner experience for any new product they release

Around 18 months after purchase, Some Line-6 products finally get the firmware update that allows the actual product to deliver promised features, it's a gamble , let's face it - swatting bugs in the new Helix will always command the full attention of the Line 6 engineering crew, while Firehawk is IMHO merely a tarted up Amplifi FX100.
If I knew Variax Workbench Hd and Monkey were not compatible with Firehawk , I never would have purchased.

I would sell mine on EBay , but there are already a few used Firehawks already there and by the time I pay sellers feed ,and take a bath , I might as well keep the Firehawk as a doorstop to remind me not to buy a Helix
http://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_from=R40&_sacat=0&_nkw=%22Line+6+Firehawk+FX%22&_sop=15


the usual suspects in Line-6 Marketing will never tell you about lurking problems with Fitehawk FX - never revealing the minefield of problems that exist for serious live use at gigs

Why provide Patch select switches if these always deliver a loud chirp if you actually use them mid song.




My Vetta combo + FBV as a stereo amp and MIDI Controller for my Kemper is looking more attractive

[mcbeddall]

Surely there's some kind of legal obligation for line 6 to refund people? No sane person would argue it can be used in a live situation

[Varialogue1]

'Ready for anything. Stage. Studio. And everywhere in between'. Misdescription anyone?

[bond19]

I had to move on- the Firehawk initially lured me away from my choice of an HD500X, because of its ease of tone creation, and it's pretty colored lights, but the lag problem was too much for me to handle, so now that I have an HD500X coupled with the edit app, I am where I should have been back at April (with extra knowledge of all the amps and effects learned from the Firehawk). I am happy now. I am still confident that Line 6 will adress the lag issue, as well as the freeze ups, and to tell you the truth, once coupled with a kick a$$ firmware, If I have the opportunity to get another one at a good price, I will probably give it a second chance, but I need a unit to rock out live.... right now.

[Timmi]

Well done. I'm in contact with the shops where I bought the Firehawk and the stagesource L2T in May.

Hope they take them back.

The whole thing with the Firehawk is absolutely disappointing, evidence of incapacity for Line 6.

[gjhardwick]

I ran out of patience I sold mine at a loss on Ebay.  Bought a Zoom MS100BT at a third of the price to tide me over in the meantime...

[agrimaldi74]

A couple of weeks ago I purchased a Firehawk fx from a music store that sells also online, because I could not find it in my city. 
It was not available but I could preorder it, since it was already "on the way" to the shop. 
Two days ago I sent the shop an email asking for an update and they told me that Yamaha informed them that all the Firehawk are currently stopped in Germany for an "update" that shouldn't be just the normal firmware, but they couldn't give any detail more, and that therefore I should be happy of this delay because it will be "positive" for me in the end.

Could this be a hardware/firmware fix for this issue?