jandrio Posted July 1, 2015 Share Posted July 1, 2015 Part two is based on a three-riff-by-riff-comparison.A simple patch is used, based on the famous Son of Plexi factory preset slightly modified ( http://line6.com/customtone/tone/1111375/ ).The patch was built using stereo headphones 'n a pair of studio monitors.The patch is played with a v2.21 JTV 69s-Korean-black, connected thru VDI 2 a v2.62 HD500.The middle 'n neck magnetic pickups r used (standard from the factory), tone 'n volume knobs=100%.Strings: D'Addario NYXL0942 09-42 (heavily worn-out). The HD500 is set 2 “Studio/Direct†mode, global EQ off, both inputs 1 + 2 = variax mags.The three comparison riffs r recorded using Audacity (usb, not mic).Since the Helix signal path is currently undefined, the HD500 will also b tested with:input 1 = variax mags, input 2 = aux.If significant variations exist, a new vid will be posted.... 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CipherHost Posted July 1, 2015 Share Posted July 1, 2015 Holy cr@p dude. US vs Korean, different chops. Line6 needs to make some videos real soon. I love the UI like we all do, but for 3X the cost... just sayin. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bartnettle1 Posted July 2, 2015 Share Posted July 2, 2015 I thought the Helix better but that clip shows a little difference. Mmm I thought it was same player on another video but it is your tone matching! Not bad Fairly close! The new methodology of Helix is its selling point. It is really something, especially if the FX in it rival what Fractal's FX8 has. I really like the routing options. For Live use it will shine if the FX for it keep coming. I can see having the stereo FX being routed to their own amps rather then mushed in with the Amp tones in a center amp. Really great for high gain definition. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PRSGuy Posted July 2, 2015 Share Posted July 2, 2015 Interesting...the last lick on the upper part of the neck sounds brighter on the HD500...but certainly in the ball park. Too early to tell anything other than you are very good at matching tones. :P Thanks for posting this... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cordevisser Posted July 2, 2015 Share Posted July 2, 2015 Lower strings sounds very muddy (Helix) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mbenigni Posted July 2, 2015 Share Posted July 2, 2015 I'll concede the Helix sounds better than the HD, but again, what is the deal with this "plexi" tone? It must sound vastly different in the room than it does in these videos because it's got to be the last sound in the world I would choose to demo an amp modeler. Too much drive, too much midrange... it just doesn't tell me anything about the Helix amp modeling. I could patch almost anything in my basement together and get that tone (excepting, perhaps, some good stuff going on just after the 20 second mark.) Please, for the love of all things holy, TURN THE KNOB. People use modeling rigs for the versatility. We don't need to hear that preset again. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scotty_burford Posted July 6, 2015 Share Posted July 6, 2015 Maybe I am cynical, but they will want to make the Helix sound great in comparison to the 500. Sean's HD500 ones are normally much better than that! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
phil_m Posted July 6, 2015 Share Posted July 6, 2015 Maybe I am cynical, but they will want to make the Helix sound great in comparison to the 500. Sean's HD500 ones are normally much better than that! The HD500 clips aren't Sean. This isn't an official Line 6 video. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bloodychoir Posted July 7, 2015 Share Posted July 7, 2015 The HD500 clips aren't Sean. This isn't an official Line 6 video.Not to state the obvious, which everybody is already stating under their breath, but the thing is cleared for pre order - where are the official videos? Need tones, need real time re amping, need, um, tones! Edit : Sorry Phil, just realised I'd assumed the Line 6 insignia denoted employment at the company, still if you have any insight on the dearth of vids and an incipient end to that dearth, most welcome. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hhuent Posted July 8, 2015 Share Posted July 8, 2015 Standing in line for a fractal fx8 but also wanted to testdrive the Helix also because of its brilliant UI. But I expected a significantly better sound than the hd 500 after listening to the marketing blurb - just something I cannot hear in the comparison video, especially when listening to the plexi stuff – tone and string definition, where is it? Still happy for every vid that does not mask the sound with high gain settings... 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hhuent Posted July 8, 2015 Share Posted July 8, 2015 Sorry for my premature statement above folks. I listened to the video again with proper earphones and had to realize the Helix sounds much more dynamic and refined. Still I could swear I listened to a shorter version of this video before, right? However, different miking, different player and playing skills with the Hd500, me thinks. but why use a video like that to market the helix? (Which indeed to me sounded slightly "muddy" (for lack of a better word) on the lower strings, for a plexi that is - as someone else pointed out earlier here. Well, no way around trying gear out for yourself if you want to shell out your hard earned money. Learnt this the hard way when I had the tc electronics so many went crazy about but Irealised after the purchase almost instantly it will never be for me... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Digital_Igloo Posted July 9, 2015 Share Posted July 9, 2015 It's not a Line 6 video. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
arislaf Posted July 12, 2015 Share Posted July 12, 2015 Part two is based on a three-riff-by-riff-comparison. A simple patch is used, based on the famous Son of Plexi factory preset slightly modified ( http://line6.com/customtone/tone/1111375/ ). The patch was built using stereo headphones 'n a pair of studio monitors. The patch is played with a v2.21 JTV 69s-Korean-black, connected thru VDI 2 a v2.62 HD500. The middle 'n neck magnetic pickups r used (standard from the factory), tone 'n volume knobs=100%. Strings: D'Addario NYXL0942 09-42 (heavily worn-out). The HD500 is set 2 “Studio/Direct†mode, global EQ off, both inputs 1 + 2 = variax mags. The three comparison riffs r recorded using Audacity (usb, not mic). Since the Helix signal path is currently undefined, the HD500 will also b tested with: input 1 = variax mags, input 2 = aux. If significant variations exist, a new vid will be posted.... Jandrio, you can easily replicate to 90% the sound if you will make a model on JTV with the danelectro on neck position only, set the plexi cab DEP RES 0% and the low cut frequency to the 120 hz. Actually anyone can do this . Take care. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jandrio Posted July 13, 2015 Author Share Posted July 13, 2015 Jandrio, you can easily replicate to 90% the sound if you will make a model on JTV with the danelectro on neck position only, set the plexi cab DEP RES 0% and the low cut frequency to the 120 hz. Actually anyone can do this . Take care. Aris tks, I will try ur suggestions and post results in a part 4 comparison vid. In my opinion the sound quality and not the quantity is of utmost importance. We know that the HX price is three times more than the HD price, so the point behind this comparison series vids was 2 explore whether the HX sound is also three times better than the HD sound. I'm trying 2 replicate the EXACT conditions the HX sound was produced/recorded in the sweatwater video. I only know that a helix plus a JTV69-USA was used with the selector switch in positions 3+5. I do not know: the input signal path; the variax mags/models mix; the fx chain and settings; the amp settings (assuming a plexi lead amp is used); the post processing applied in the HX sound (eq, mic recording,etc); So, in light of the abv, I'm proceeding using the trial 'n error method. In part 1 I started using the spank model pos.5 and the Son of Plexi preset. In part 2, I experimented with the variax mags and both inputs. I have found out that using variax mags and only one input (ie input1=variax mags, input2=aux) I get an almost 99% tone match (!). Now u say that with the danelectro model u can easily replicate 90% the sound (!!!) Clearly, it seems that the HD sound is very-very-close 2 the HX sound... So unless we get some really amazing HX sound samples, I really cannot c any reason at all 2 pay 1.5K only 4 having a fancy color ui and four stereo paths, fx loops, etc,etc, etc.... I consider a better 'n more powerful alternative 2 purchase THREE HD's instead and use then in tandem (imagine a stellar 6 channel sound with 6 amps!). :) ps in this comparison vid series, the hd sound is heard as recorded via usb in audacity; there is NO POST-PROCESSING whatsoever. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
silverhead Posted July 13, 2015 Share Posted July 13, 2015 ..... We know that the HX price is three times more than the HD price, so the point behind this comparison series vids was 2 explore whether the HX sound is also three times better than the HD sound. Jandrio, I appreciate the effort you are making here but I'm afraid I can't really see the point of this comparison. Firstly, how do you quantify and measure 'three times better'? It's entirely subjective. But more to the point, the proper comparison for Helix is to other options in its price range - like Axe or Kemper. I think you are making the same comparison that has been made here many times with the Axe, and to which most Pod HD owners agree: the Axe is not worth the extra $$ because the Pod sounds very good and (subjectively) very close. Yet Fractal and Kemper have strong high-end market share among users who will pay a lot more for any perceived quality improvement, quantified and measured or not. It's these users that Line 6 is targeting with Helix, thereby increasing overall market share. Helix is not primarily aimed as an upgrade for current Pod Hd users. So I think your point will be easily granted here, in the same way it has been granted for years re: AXE. Not worth the extra $$ for many users, especially those whose budget is very strained at that price. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jandrio Posted July 13, 2015 Author Share Posted July 13, 2015 .... Helix is not primarily aimed as an upgrade for current Pod Hd users.... i agree with u silverhead :) 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
phil_m Posted July 13, 2015 Share Posted July 13, 2015 I consider a better 'n more powerful alternative 2 purchase THREE HD's instead and use then in tandem (imagine a stellar 6 channel sound with 6 amps!). :) Well, I can say without any hesitation that one Helix is way more useful than three POD HDs. Nothing against the HD, but trying to sync three of them would be pretty futile. The thing is that with the one Helix everything you would want to do is seamless. I'd also say that being more than a bit presumptuous here basing all your "findings" off of a couple clips. Again, the HDs are great units, but I can't say I'd be tempted to go back after spending a few months with the Helix. Yes, it costs more, and that's definitely going to be a consideration for a lot of people. Line 6 understands that if they're going to release a device at a premium price point, it needs to deliver a premium sound and feature set. I think delivers that and some. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mbenigni Posted July 13, 2015 Share Posted July 13, 2015 So I think your point will be easily granted here, in the same way it has been granted for years re: AXE. Not worth the extra $$ for many users, especially those whose budget is very strained at that price. And it's worth emphasizing again that the Helix is significantly more affordable than a Fractal or even Kemper rig once you account for a footcontroller with even half this functionality. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
arislaf Posted July 13, 2015 Share Posted July 13, 2015 Jandrio, I appreciate the effort you are making here but I'm afraid I can't really see the point of this comparison. Firstly, how do you quantify and measure 'three times better'? It's entirely subjective. But more to the point, the proper comparison for Helix is to other options in its price range - like Axe or Kemper. I think you are making the same comparison that has been made here many times with the Axe, and to which most Pod HD owners agree: the Axe is not worth the extra $$ because the Pod sounds very good and (subjectively) very close. Yet Fractal and Kemper have strong high-end market share among users who will pay a lot more for any perceived quality improvement, quantified and measured or not. It's these users that Line 6 is targeting with Helix, thereby increasing overall market share. Helix is not primarily aimed as an upgrade for current Pod Hd users. So I think your point will be easily granted here, in the same way it has been granted for years re: AXE. Not worth the extra $$ for many users, especially those whose budget is very strained at that price. Well, I care more for the sound than the look and functionality of helix.. Comparing these units can be the deciding factor for most of us, and since pod HD can be compared easily to an AXE, the Helix should be better than these units, not same as pod... Too bad I am sailing and don't have time to make a comparison clip by myself. . My point is, that Jandrio is making a big favor for many of us that care for the tone more than anything :) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
silverhead Posted July 13, 2015 Share Posted July 13, 2015 I have no problem with comparing tones, and I appreciate the effort jandrio is making. My problem is with trying to make quantitative tone comparisons and presenting them as being somehow meaningful or objective. Here are two statements: "To me, the Helix sounds better than the POD HD." "The POD HD sounds 90% as good as the Helix." I fully understand the first statement. I think the second statement is meaningless, unless you add a subjective qualifier and remove the number, in which case it means exactly the same as the first statement - no more, no less. With these changes it says "To me, the POD HD does not sound as good as the Helix." That's all I'm trying to say here. I'm certainly not suggesting that we don't all make our subjective sound comparisons and make our individual purchases accordingly. We all do that, balancing perceived tone quality and budget considerations. But it's subjective and not quantifiable or measurable. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
phil_m Posted July 13, 2015 Share Posted July 13, 2015 The Helix 174.3245% better than the POD HD... I can show my work if you like. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
talwilkins Posted July 13, 2015 Share Posted July 13, 2015 The Helix 174.3245% better than the POD HD... I can show my work if you like. Please do! :rolleyes: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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