roscoe5

Dude, Helix on Double Bass is a great idea! I have a double bass gig tomorrow. I may give it a go if I can get a preset setup. I have a Schaller magnetic pickup, K&K Bass Max, Barcus Berry 1360B bass transducer bridge, and a K&K PRO ST Preamp, I run only 1 of the two piezos depending on the gig type. I had been running that into a Markbass Compressore and Markbass Super Booster pedal for VLE & VLF filter (like a super easy EQ), boost, and DI out. With Helix multi-in, I shoould be able to run a stereo cable from the stereo jack snapped between strings below the bridge to the Helix and a Y cable to split it between say guitar in and aux in or something. The Aux in may be stereo, but I'll have to test it as I need to control each input separately. I too bought Helix for guitar, but found it great for electric bass at home or on a gig. Cant believe I haven't tried it on Double Bass.

I didn't see your *.at4p Amplitube preset file. You might not have clicked Attach This File after you selected the file via Choose File. I've done that more than a few times ;) Also, the forum site may not accept that *.at4p file type. You can change the extension to something general like *.txt to post it and I can change it back.

I only proposed it as an alternative if the cab only block didn't sound right to you. Honsestly, I haven't tried it myself but now curious of how my Mesa Triaxis and Marshall JMP-1 would sound into a "turned down" Helix amp + cab block. Maybe a bit of eq on it would help. Personally for myself, I would set up two identical patches to A B. One with my physical gear and one with my XLR to desk signal chain to a full range speaker or headphones. Then I would adjust the XLR path to be as close as possible to my physical rig. You should be able to get close with Helix Cabs, Helix amp + cab (amp gain down and master up), cab IRs, or cab + amp IRs. I see you are using a Mesa 50/50 amp. Not sure what kind of cab you have. I IR'd my real Mesa 2:90 power amp into virtual Recto cab with V30 speakers. My Triaxis sounds really similar into that IR to what it sounds like through my real 2:90 and Recto 2x12 cab. But let me know if you can't get a match with Helix. I could try to whip up an IR for you. It might help too if you could record a short jam just straght out of your Formula pre out and the same jam with your full mic'd rig and send or post those wav files. You can record both simultaneously with Helix and two tracks.

You might try a similar Helix amp+cab block on your XLR to board split signal chain and adjust the gain and eq on the preamp on that block to try to match your real power amp and cab sound, i.e. turn the gain down.

Yeah, you can split the signal before you go out to your power amp and speaker out, pop in a Helix cab or IR, and set to XLR out. Both will function the same but sound different. You'll probably want to experiment with amps as well as preamps. To me the amps sound a little dark into a tube power amp and guitar cab, but may sound better through your split path to the board with HX cab or IR. I think the Helix Cabs and most IR'S are made with clean amplifiers to try to get the purest signal from the cab for use with full amps (physical and model). Ideally Line 6 would post separate tube guitar power amp models for this type of split preamp and power amp and 4CM routing. Lack of power amp models is what inspired me to make tube power amp + cab IR'S. While you don't get the distortion of the tube power amps, you do get back more if the tube power amp into cab frequency response. Its a bit of a tube amp filter on a regular cab IR if you will. To me, these sound better with the Helix tube preamp models than Helix cabs or cab only IRs.

Totally ripping off Freeset Friday naming convention, sorry sminchk67 ;) So, the evolution continues. More research and more testing have resulted in version 2 production (v2). The bad...I really should go back and remake the v1 IR's (now filed on dropbox in v1 folder) The good...v2 IR's seem to have MUCH better sound and feel IMO. Clearer, crisper, more controlled response, more usable. Amps really do have an effect on the overall response of the cab and resulting IR, almost as much as the speaker and mic. I'm going to take a little different approach in the v2 IR's and categorize them with amp type clean (CL), mid-gain(MG), and high gain (HG) along with the cab type and speaker. I may hold off on producing any more cab-only IR's as there are plenty of those out there. The daily special is (again) a Mesa Recto 412 cooked high gain (HG) with your choice of side (speaker), Celestion Vintage 30 (V30), Electro-Voice EV12L (EV), or Mesa Black Shadow (BS). Salt and pepper (Low Cut & High Cut) to taste (70Hz LC & 7000Hz HC is good). I highly recommend pairing with the '92 Cali Rectifire (model), but pairs well with other reds (high gain amps). For desert , SM57 with a touch of condenser (mic). Enjoy! Update 4/15/2016: From some good feedback for some more thickness in the mids and highs, I have moved the SM57 off the center cone an inch or so. IR's with an OC suffix attached and on Dropbox. Also added a set with the condenser 87 "C" replaced with a ribbon 121 "R" mic. SM57 is still off center. Just added a set of SM57 2" off center (to darken them up a bit more), still mixed with ribbon 121 mic. Revised the naming convention a bit to represent mics and mic position. i.e. the first 4 I posted are now "0i57R" suffix to represent SM57 0in on the cone on one side, mixed with a condenser 87 mic on the other side. Posted some 1/2 ribbon 121 and 1/2 condenser 87 IR's for each speaker type by request (RC suffix). Moved everything to Dropbox for easier management https://www.dropbox.com/sh/009bkqzooza1aop/AACchidYhkM2TgZa6ljTiAI3a/IR/V2?dl=0

If by "bypasses" you mean effects/model blocks on & off, then yes. Helix manual MIDI section on p.48 gives you the CC's. Unless you have some sort of MIDI bridge/router on the Mac, then I think you will need to connect direct to the Helix.

From some of the feedback so far, it seems that maybe some sort of Line 6 VDI to 8/13 pin adapter box (and maybe 1/4" for lesser functionality), likely with a small gateway circuit board inside and/or Variax processing, and Variax model packs, either in Helix, or the adapter/Variax box, would allow many people to integrate the guitar part of their rigs in the Line 6 Variax system. I feel user guitar Variax integration would be in the spirit of what Line 6 has achieved with user amplifier, MIDI, and computer software integration with Helix. Maybe they can call it HariaX ;)

That's some good info to consider too, thanks!

That's interesting too. May be a bit more invasive than I want to go. I bet I can find a Peavey AT-200 in a few local Peavey shops to test it. It seems to have the same tech. The Graph Tech Ghost option seems more appealing at this point. I still would like to see Line 6 put out a solution as we should be able to control and edit within the L6 ecosystem. Seems like a no brainer to me to put out a $200-$300 kit and Variax model packs. I dont know how much processing power Variax models take and the impact on Helix. Maybe the processing would remain in the Line 6 Variax kit. But coming back up to 30,000 feet, I think a stereo piezo/magnetic signal from a guitar split into current Helix I/O run through an acoustic IR block would be just fine for me at the moment. A $200 uninvasive upgrade to a guitar and nothing further required from Line 6.

Line 6 Idea Scale Posted http://line6.ideascale.com/a/dtd/Helix-Variax-Model-Pack-and-13-pin-MIDI-compatibility/817048-23508 Helix Variax Model Pack and 13 pin MIDI compatibility Develop Helix Variax Model Pack(s) for non-Variax guitar/bass owners. Develop some sort of 13-pin MIDI compatibility (13 pin to VDI adapter?) for use with Graph Tech Ghost Piezo systems, and maybe Roland GK systems.

Line 6 Idea Scale Posted http://line6.ideascale.com/a/dtd/Helix-Variax-Model-Pack-and-13-pin-MIDI-compatibility/817048-23508 Helix Variax Model Pack and 13 pin MIDI compatibility Develop Helix Variax Model Pack(s) for non-Variax guitar/bass owners. Develop some sort of 13-pin MIDI compatibility (13 pin to VDI adapter?) for use with Graph Tech Ghost Piezo systems, and maybe Roland GK systems.

So, because I have a PRS trem model...no holes required. Wires will go through the trem block. Also, there is a video of a guy who did this to his PRS and installed a $28 Seymour Duncan triple shot pickup ring switching system. He was able to fit the electronics in the controls cavity. http://www.seymourduncan.com/accessory/triple-shot-flat https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tZLOs23Vx6o Some nice sounds from a PRS SE https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6UcOdf6vLs0 So looks like a $200-$400 project depending on if I attempt the 13 pin MIDI system. I might go for the package and put aside the GK portion for now if I can. If the PRS is a success, I may attempt it with y Les Paul. Since I have to get the SD triple shot pickup ring switch anyway, I can notch that for the wires. Thanks again for your help guys! I'll try to get the Mark V power amp + cab and Mesa 20/20 power amp +cab IR's posted soon, and maybe try to take another stab at an IR of the Amplitube Acoustic Sim, as a thank you :) PS: Line 6, give us something compatible with Graph Tech Ghost piezo system 13 pin MIDI kit ;) http://www.graphtech.com/products/brands/ghost/product-detail/pk-0440-00-ghost-hexpander-midi-preamp-kit-(advanced)?id=282d984d-b16d-4dc1-b591-650224e7c53d http://www.graphtech.com/products/brands/ghost/product-detail/pk-0680-00-ghost-acoustic-phonic-hexpander-preamp-kit-for-guitar-(complete)?id=d6d7984e-b0d1-47c5-b53f-24af005f54c2

Yeah, I don't think I would drill any holes in the wood, but appreciate the ideas! Pickup rings are replaceable. And whew, $1000 for a VDI wireless would be a no go for me.

I'm trying and cant get it to work either yet.

I would be just fine with the little wires showing. Better than screwing in and clamping on a Roland GK3 pickup. I guess if it really bothers me, I could collect the wires in some black heat shrink tubing or tape and maybe pass that through the outer face of the pickup ring.

Holy crap, that may be perfect! I need to dig in a bit, but my PRS single cut trem (from my Tremonti wannabe days) is gathering dust. It do like the PRS's splitable humbuckers for single-coil sound. Now if Line 6 would put out some Helix guitar/acoustic/bass models to internally process the 6 (or more) separate piezo signals. I would be up to spending $100-200 on those in lieu of buying a Variax again.

No doubt. I paid $3k for my Les Paul Custom. Even used JTV USA guitars have come up on eBay for $2500'ish I think, and JTV is starting to get a bit old for tech. Although it still sounds great. Dont get me wrong...I did like the JTV, I just liked my guitars better. I actually purchased it open box for $799 from Pitbull Audio I believe. So the price was right where i wasn't really regretting anything. Sort of wishing now I hadn't sold the JTV/HD/DT/L2M "dream rig", but I had a friend that wanted it all as a turn-key package and offered me a good price for it. I wasn't using at the time, so I let it go...let it goooooo. Roland GK pickups are still viable tech, although the Roland processors have evolved. Kind of ugly hanging off a guitar too, so I think there is room for improvement there. With the foot editing capability of Helix and external expression pedals, I dont HAVE to have all of the controls up on the guitar. I think just a piezo bridge/pickup with an electric guitar input and stereo and/or dual output (or VDI!) to Helix with some level trim pots (even small ones) would suffice for now. I wouldn't even mind if it was a box on my guitar strap. Hey Line 6...I don't see a Line 6 Relay wireless solution yet with VDI connection yet. I wouldn't mind if separate magnetic & 6-transducer piezo connectivity was wrapped up in a Line 6 Relay wireless solution strapped to my guitar strap with a Relay box with VDI out on my pedalboard. Otherwise, just a guitar strap box with magnetic and 6-transducer piezo connection to VDI cable with a Helix guitar models pack will do just fine . Throw a Roland GK output jack on there too if you like ;) I'm thinking $500-$600 would be my budget for a retro/external solution, whether it be a future Line 6 solution or pieced together Fishman piezo bridge or Roland GK solution. I'm trying to have some faith in Line 6 this time though and may at least hold out until Summer NAMM ;)

To preface this topic, many might say that I should buy a Line 6 Variax, but I used to own one along with HD500x, DT50 amp, and L2m speaker. I found that I really only liked it for the acoustic sims, and much preferred my traditional electrics (Les Paul Custom, PRS Singlecut Trem, G&L USA Strat, Fender USA Tele, and Jackson USA SL1) into my real amps. Helix has changed my opinion about the amp models vs. real amps, but I still prefer my USA guitars to the Korean? JTV Variax I had. I was wondering if anyone has experience with a piezo retrofit on a guitar and Line 6 Pod or Helix. I mainly want to just use it for acoustic sims and acoustic IR's. Maybe a good acoustic sim model or pedal would be fine. The Amplitube Acoustic Sim pedal model actually sounds pretty good, even with my Les Paul humbuckers, but I cant seem to figure out how to capture an IR of it. The Fishman Powerbridge system looks promising, and I have an old Fishman/Morley Blender pedal. Probably wouldnt need the pedal though with Helix routing capabilities. http://www.fishman.com/products/series/powerbridge/index.php Taking it a step further, I'm also wondering if there's any hope Line 6 will put out say a Variax external kit, similar to the Roland GK-3 pickup kit for use with Roland synth. I see a RakVax was developed for use with Roland GK-3 pickups and Variax guts into a rack enclosure. This would be pretty cool allowing you to use both Helix and Roland GK Guitar Synths. It looks like it is still viable, maybe for custom order. May need a sacrificial Variax though. Could be a money pit with less than ideal results. http://www.rackvax.com/products/rackmount/rackvax-electric/ http://forum.rackvax.com/viewtopic.php?f=12&t=260 GK13 pin to Variax adapter. http://www.rackvax.com/store/#!/GK-13-pin-to-Variax-Adapter-Module/p/3958715/category=1173774 It would be really cool if Line 6 would put some modified Variax acoustic models right in the Helix for use with either acoustics or electrics with (or without) piezo pickups. Similar to a Fishman Aura pedal. I would consider a USA James Tyler Variax, but I really don't like making that kind of investment on embedded technology that will change. It seems that Line 6 could accomplish most/all of what they are doing inside a Variax with a split piezo signal and external options and Helix, like the Roland does with the GK system. I would not be opposed to purchasing pickup kit or adapter box (GK or Fishman, etc.) and a Variax model pack for Helix. Maybe a "simple" Roland GK to Line 6 VDI adapter would bring current Roland GK users into the Line 6 world also as I don't think Yamaha ever offered a similar solution. In my mind, Variax is Line 6's 1 up on competitors Fractal, Kemper, etc. I think having to purchase a propriety guitar to access that technology is possibly a turnoff to users that are in that market sector. Developing an external solution, or integrating with an existing one, would bridge the gap. I mean, isnt that what Helix is all about anyway? Nerve center of YOUR rig and all that?

It sounds like you are trying to find your Impulse Responses in the Cab block. IR's are a different model block.

Glad to hear it man! I've enjoyed your posts, even without a Helix in hand.

I would be interested in taking a few Helix-use IR requests if you guys need something you're not getting from Helix or other IR's. I think I am only bound by my physical tube amps on hand and the Amplitube 4 cabinets. So far I've been able to create anything I was wanting or needing myself. Option 1: Explicit specs Speaker cabinet or combo cabinet type Pure cabinet or power amp + cabinet (can use Amplitube amps or any of my physical amps through the TAD Silencer line out or FANTA XLR) Can mix and match any speaker type in 12" cabs. Can model smaller cabs, but cannot swap speakers. Can have two mics on a cab in a single IR (i.e. one side dynamic, and the other ribbon), each on any cone location or distance. Can mix in room mics for smoother, more ambient sound (not sure I would recommend this for live patches) Option 2: Give me Helix amp preset with HX cabs or IR (prefer only an amp and cab/IR, no other blocks) that are close and describe what you don't like about them. Or just specify Helix amp block(s) you are interested in using it with. Option 3: Send me an Amplitube cab or amp + cab preset, along with the Helix preset if you can. That's the quickest IR to make. It's easy to test a Helix preamp or amp with an Amplitube cab. Just set it up the way you want it and save it as a preset and send it to me. Note you will not get the reverb from the room mic feature. If you turn room mic all the way down, the resulting IR is REALLY close to just the cab and cab mics. Option 4: Heck, just throw something out to me and see what you get. Gear on hand: Amplitube 4 (all cabs, all mics, 90%+ of the amps for power amp + cab IR's) Tube Amp Doctor Silencer Mesa Simul 2:90 stereo tube power amp w/ 6L6 tubes, Deep, Modern, or 1/2 Drive (minimal effect on the IR) Mesa 20/20 stereo tube power amp with EL34 tubes Marshall 100/100 stereo tube power amp with EL34 tubes Mesa Stiletto Deuce II EL34 tubes, tube/diode rectification, bold/spongy power Mesa Mark V 6L6 tubes, tube/diode rectification, pentode/triode Note that power amp + cab IR's offer a bit of color you would get from the tube amp direct to cab. I also think the sound good with Helix preamp blocks if you need some flexible post preamp routing options. I cannot create full amp models, pedal models, distortions, etc. IR's only offer linear characteristics (frequency, phase), not non-linear (distortion, compression). I plan to only make cab-type IR's at this time. Link to Dropbox for examples I have made for myself. You can try some Amplitube-only cab and power amp +cab IR's, as well as some physical power amps + AT cab IR's). https://www.dropbox.com/sh/009bkqzooza1aop/AADhgWBm3EfcN6205-IWaGZaa/IR?dl=0 Will list in-progress and completed IR's here ...

More IR's created while I had everything hooked up to the Stiletto Mesa StilRect 8080 2SM57.wav - Celestion Seventy 80's Mesa StilRect AlAl 2SM57.wav- Alnico Blues Mesa StilRect BSBS 2SM57.wav - Mesa Black Shadows Mesa StilRect EVEV 2SM57.wav - Mesa EV12L's Mesa StilRect GBGB 2SM57.wav - Celestion Greenbacks

What would you guys think about being able to export your setlist to Excel *.xlsx or *.csv text file, edit it in Excel with all of the copy/paste/concatenate/etc. tools, then import it back in? Line 6 could likely create a simple preset list Excel export/import tool in the Helix app. A lot of software companies either build in this type of functionality or publish it in an API for third parties to develop it. It may also be possible to export block settings, change values (copy/paste from others/etc.), and import back in. This might also be helpful for checking purposes.

IR's created of my Mesa Stiletto Deuce II EL34 power amp into an AT4 Recto cab with a couple of configurations mic'd with SM57's. Mesa StilRect V30EV 2SM57.wav - 1/2 V30's & 1/2 EV12L's Mesa StilRect V30V30 2SM57.wav - V30's Mesa StilRect 8080 2SM57.wav - Celestion Seventy 80's Mesa StilRect AlAl 2SM57.wav- Alnico Blues Mesa StilRect BSBS 2SM57.wav - Mesa Black Shadows Mesa StilRect EVEV 2SM57.wav - Mesa EV12L's Mesa StilRect GBGB 2SM57.wav - Celestion Greenbacks Attached and on Dropbox https://www.dropbox.com/sh/009bkqzooza1aop/AADhgWBm3EfcN6205-IWaGZaa/IR?dl=0 From here on out I should probably just post weekly. I like sminchk67 Freeset Friday, how about Thursday IRs-day. Sorry for the flooding of IR posts and just brain dumping on the forum...I got a little excited and carried away :D Mesa StilRect V30EV 2SM57.wav Mesa StilRect V30V30 2SM57.wav Mesa StilRect 8080 2SM57.wav Mesa StilRect AlAl 2SM57.wav Mesa StilRect BSBS 2SM57.wav Mesa StilRect EVEV 2SM57.wav Mesa StilRect GBGB 2SM57.wav