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best way to connect helix in stereo with to 2 powercab 112 plus

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Hello everybody,
I am going to buy a Helix and 2 powercab 112 more and I will want to know what is the best way to connect a helix in stereo with 2 powercab 112 more to have the best sound possible.
Use the XLR Doite and Left outputs or the L6 Link?

Thank you in advance for your clarifications

 

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2 hours ago, aurelienpinteau said:

Hello everybody,
I am going to buy a Helix and 2 powercab 112 more and I will want to know what is the best way to connect a helix in stereo with 2 powercab 112 more to have the best sound possible.
Use the XLR Doite and Left outputs or the L6 Link?

Thank you in advance for your clarifications

 

 

Forgetting the connections for the moment... why do you feel the need for 2 Powercabs? The answer will depend on what you actually need your rig to do. If you're playing live, forget trying to run stereo. It's a nightmare waiting to happen, and that's never worth the trouble...for myriad reasons. 1 Powercab will more than suffice.

 

If you're playing and recording at home... that's a different story, and a stereo rig is glorious, but 2 Powercabs is way overkill... and they would be ill- suited for mixing and monitoring multi-track recordings, anyway. For that you need a good pair of studio monitors, which will run you ~$1000 less than the cost of 2 Powercabs...

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2 hours ago, cruisinon2 said:

 

[...] If you're playing live, forget trying to run stereo. It's a nightmare waiting to happen, and that's never worth the trouble...for myriad reasons. [...]

 

 

I don't necessarily disagree, but I'm curious if you think it's just running stereo with two powercabs that would be the nightmare, or running stereo altogether. If one were trying to use two powercabs in stereo, without a house PA system, by putting them on opposite sides of the stage, that's definitely a recipe for disaster. You'd get one guy standing in front of the left cab wondering why he's only hearing every third delay beat. 

 

But doesn't the powercab have its own XLR out so that you could send each one to FOH as right and left channels, respectively? In that case, I would expect a stereo setup would be to place the cabs just to the right and left of the player, and send each to FOH via the XLR outs (or two mics... but that would be a headache all its own).

 

Maybe I'm just coming from a misconception about how loud the powercabs are. I didn't expect they would be loud enough to use as part of a band without a PA system, and so I didn't think of them being used stand-alone like in the first scenario, above. 

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1 hour ago, rzumwalt said:

 

I didn't expect they would be loud enough to use as part of a band without a PA system, and so I didn't think of them being used stand-alone like in the first scenario, above. 

Why not: I never was able to turn my old Acoustic G100T tube combo with 1x12" in 50 watt mode full power in this scenario, and we had a loud drummer with a huge drumkit.

So one 250 Watt powercab should be able to blow your drummer away twice - why more? Just guitar does'nt need much power to get really loud.

 

I have two selfmade "powercabs" 400 watt each with a 12" coaxial driver. Why?

1. I want to use it for bass too

2. I want to use ist as "party PA" when i need one

3. Just sleep better knowing to have a lot of overhead

 

Actually, i link them digitally to the Helix without any problems, but some people prefer XLR connections for less risk for problems on stage. Maybe they're right.

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4 minutes ago, mikisb said:

[...] Just guitar does'nt need much power to get really loud. [...]

 

I'm with you in concept, but my understanding is that the powercab isn't amplifying "just guitar." Doesn't it have to reproduce higher and lower frequencies than a typical guitar amp in order to capture the pitch shifting and other effects Helix puts out? 

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1 hour ago, rzumwalt said:

 

Maybe I'm just coming from a misconception about how loud the powercabs are. I didn't expect they would be loud enough to use as part of a band without a PA system, and so I didn't think of them being used stand-alone like in the first scenario, above. 

I was concerned about volume before I bought my PC+. My band is very loud, but I'm having no problem keeping up with them. I do have the PC+ up as high as 3 o'clock at times, but that's as far as I've had to raise it. 

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7 hours ago, rzumwalt said:

 

I'm with you in concept, but my understanding is that the powercab isn't amplifying "just guitar." Doesn't it have to reproduce higher and lower frequencies than a typical guitar amp in order to capture the pitch shifting and other effects Helix puts out? 

 

You're overthinking things. Most of the time you'll end up EQing away all those "extra" frequencies that are normally filtered out by a "real" guitar cabinet. High and low cut filters are a necessity to varying degrees, depending on the tone. The purpose of an FRFR rig is to provide an un-colored "clean slate" for a modeler... its what allows a device like Helix to convincingly mimic so many different kinds of amps... but a lot of the time you're not gonna want all those "extra" frequencies. 

 

8 hours ago, rzumwalt said:

 

I don't necessarily disagree, but I'm curious if you think it's just running stereo with two powercabs that would be the nightmare, or running stereo altogether. If one were trying to use two powercabs in stereo, without a house PA system, by putting them on opposite sides of the stage, that's definitely a recipe for disaster. You'd get one guy standing in front of the left cab wondering why he's only hearing every third delay beat. 

 

But doesn't the powercab have its own XLR out so that you could send each one to FOH as right and left channels, respectively? In that case, I would expect a stereo setup would be to place the cabs just to the right and left of the player, and send each to FOH via the XLR outs (or two mics... but that would be a headache all its own).

 

Maybe I'm just coming from a misconception about how loud the powercabs are. I didn't expect they would be loud enough to use as part of a band without a PA system, and so I didn't think of them being used stand-alone like in the first scenario, above. 

 

You don't want stereo in a live environment, period... Powercab or otherwise. It never works. No matter what you do, the only one in the room who'll end up hearing the desired stereo spread is the one guy who happens to end up standing dead center between the mains... everywhere else it'll sound odd. Depending on how everything bounces around the room, you can get weird phase issues, and any stereo FX are totally wasted. Its totally unnecessary... sound guys will look at you like you have 3 heads if you insist on running stereo. Or they'll just nod, and then run you mono anyway,  unless they're actually willing to make everything sound like crap out front. 

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To answer the OP.

 

L6 Link will detect whether you are running one or two cabs and configure them as a mono or stereo set-up accordingly, in addition if they are placed relatively close together you can minimise the cable run between them, and not have to run 2 longer leads from the Helix.

 

If you wish to send to FoH from there use the XLR out from each cab.

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20 hours ago, cruisinon2 said:

 

Forgetting the connections for the moment... why do you feel the need for 2 Powercabs? The answer will depend on what you actually need your rig to do. If you're playing live, forget trying to run stereo. It's a nightmare waiting to happen, and that's never worth the trouble...for myriad reasons. 1 Powercab will more than suffice.

 

If you're playing and recording at home... that's a different story, and a stereo rig is glorious, but 2 Powercabs is way overkill... and they would be ill- suited for mixing and monitoring multi-track recordings, anyway. For that you need a good pair of studio monitors, which will run you ~$1000 less than the cost of 2 Powercabs...

 

23 hours ago, APi_Gangoriff said:

Hello everybody,
I am going to buy a Helix and 2 powercab 112 more and I will want to know what is the best way to connect a helix in stereo with 2 powercab 112 more to have the best sound possible.
Use the XLR Doite and Left outputs or the L6 Link?

Thank you in advance for your clarifications

 

hello Cruisinon2,

thank you very much for your comment and I actually specify that my use will be limited to my home studio and I wish to have the best sound possible to please me a maximum :-)

So you raise a topic that I turn around and for which I can not make a decision : What models of speakers can I use to get the best sound possible?

I have watched the active speakers FRFR but there are so many that I am lost. What choice to do to get the best quality ratio because as you raise the budget is a non-negligible criterion in the acquisition of the equipment of my home studio..

Do you have any advice to give me ?

 

Thx

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41 minutes ago, APi_Gangoriff said:

What models of speakers can I use to get the best sound possible?

 

This is one of those questions that doesn't really have an answer..."the best sound possible" is entirely subjective. But generally speaking I'd stick with the big boys...JBL, Yamaha, Sony, etc. Personally, I'm partial to JBL, but they all make powered, near-field monitors, and used properly, you should be able to get sounds that make you happy with any of them. If the price tag doesn't matter, then just figure out what size makes sense for the space they're gonna be in, and audition a few different pairs if possible, and pick the ones you like best. 

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To answer the OP connectivity question, Daisy chain the L6 Links from Helix to Powercab 1 in, then out of Powercab 1 to Powercab 2 in.  I think Helix recognize when two L6 Link speakers (DT, Stagesource, Powercab, etc.) are connected and assigns one left and one right.  

 

On the second topic, I have Tannoy 8in studio monitors.  I actually took Helix to Guitar Center and tried them all and preferred these over the others.  I really thought they were all I wanted.

 

For actual studio work and Helix, the Tannoys are great.  But I have to say, for just live type jamming along to songs, backing tracks, Rocksmith, etc. I honestly prefer just the single Powercab over the studio monitors.  I am considering a second one myself.

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30 minutes ago, roscoe5 said:

I think Helix recognize when two L6 Link speakers (DT, Stagesource, Powercab, etc.) are connected and assigns one left and one right. 

More than this: my selfmade monitors use Hypex PSC 2.400D Modules each and it works with digital daisy chain too.

I think that tHelix always sends both channels thru the digital cable and each speaker picks his part if correctly configured.

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On 7/25/2018 at 6:43 AM, cruisinon2 said:

You don't want stereo in a live environment, period... Powercab or otherwise. It never works. No matter what you do, the only one in the room who'll end up hearing the desired stereo spread is the one guy who happens to end up standing dead center between the mains... everywhere else it'll sound odd. Depending on how everything bounces around the room, you can get weird phase issues, and any stereo FX are totally wasted. Its totally unnecessary... sound guys will look at you like you have 3 heads if you insist on running stereo. Or they'll just nod, and then run you mono anyway,  unless they're actually willing to make everything sound like crap out front.  

 

I agree with you but my use is the home studio and I am right in the center of the room so is this playing condition stereo is it also a pb ?

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18 hours ago, cruisinon2 said:

 

This is one of those questions that doesn't really have an answer..."the best sound possible" is entirely subjective. But generally speaking I'd stick with the big boys...JBL, Yamaha, Sony, etc. Personally, I'm partial to JBL, but they all make powered, near-field monitors, and used properly, you should be able to get sounds that make you happy with any of them. If the price tag doesn't matter, then just figure out what size makes sense for the space they're gonna be in, and audition a few different pairs if possible, and pick the ones you like best. 

Indeed it is the question that breaks my head for several months :-( and you reassure me by confirming me that there is no obvious answer.

I will continue to search and thank you for your lights ;-)

Thanks also to the other members and I stay tuned if you have any other advice to give me.

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13 hours ago, roscoe5 said:

To answer the OP connectivity question, Daisy chain the L6 Links from Helix to Powercab 1 in, then out of Powercab 1 to Powercab 2 in.  I think Helix recognize when two L6 Link speakers (DT, Stagesource, Powercab, etc.) are connected and assigns one left and one right.  

 

On the second topic, I have Tannoy 8in studio monitors.  I actually took Helix to Guitar Center and tried them all and preferred these over the others.  I really thought they were all I wanted.

 

For actual studio work and Helix, the Tannoys are great.  But I have to say, for just live type jamming along to songs, backing tracks, Rocksmith, etc. I honestly prefer just the single Powercab over the studio monitors.  I am considering a second one myself.

Thank you Roscoe5,
for your answers and opinions on the questions.

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12 hours ago, mikisb said:

More than this: my selfmade monitors use Hypex PSC 2.400D Modules each and it works with digital daisy chain too.

I think that tHelix always sends both channels thru the digital cable and each speaker picks his part if correctly configured.

Thank you guys,
I understand that the two modes worked but it does not know if there are differences and which mode of connection is better? ;-)

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3 hours ago, APi_Gangoriff said:

 


I agree with you but my use is the home studio and I am right in the center of the room so is this playing condition stereo is it also a pb ?

 

A studio is a completely different ballgame.... nothing wrong with stereo in that setting.  

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21 hours ago, cruisinon2 said:

 

A studio is a completely different ballgame.... nothing wrong with stereo in that setting.  

thank you I am confident now

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These are my favorite discussions. Someone will come out left field and ask a question that makes everyone examine all the possibilities - even if they think it makes sense or not. Sometimes you didn't even know you wanted to know about that subject. I have toyed with the idea of stereo for a long time and didn't ask. This is a really good argument for forums like this. My thanks to all - I still see this as a useful site.

Now I'm headed back to the search that got me here - "is the powercab useful for pedal steel players?" TW

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I bought 2 PC +s before I got the Helix I use the PC+ in speaker mode I will use a different speaker sim on each cab.... Have not used this live yet.......

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I use two PC+ with Helix, sounds sublime! I simply use the left and right XLR outputs from Helix.

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