DunedinDragon

I honestly can't think of a single good reason for combining vocals and guitar through a Helix except in the case of maybe a solo artist where that's all that there's going to be. In any normal band situation it's going to further complicate things for a soundman that, by your definition, has questionable skills. There will not be a single source of control over the entire mix which pretty much ensures a bad mix for the audience in some way or another. Hopefully you'll have this sound person's dedicated attention for at least a certain amount of time during sound check. If you can manage to stand out in the audience area you should be able to guide the person in how things sound best in a mix. If he can move faders, he should be able to get it closer and with less problems than you trying to adjust the mix in your Helix. Tell him to leave all channel EQ's flat and simply worry about getting the right mix and set effects ONLY on the vocals and you stand a reasonable chance of having a good sound. A couple of other tricks: Have him turn down the master fader output for the audience and concentrate solely on adjusting the levels of the stage monitors by themselves with input from the band BEFORE you start adjusting the main audience mix. Get your stage volume set so that it's not bleeding too much into the audience area, then go out far enough into the audience area to be able to clearly hear each element of the mix (vocals versus instruments). By doing those two things you should be able to at least get his concentration on stage mix versus FOH mix and hopefully have a better chance of things being right.

Generally speaking disabling the Helix volume knob tends to me most appropriate when going to a mixing board so that you can appropriately gain stage the incoming signal from the Helix so that it has enough headroom. I never disable the Helix volume knob when going direct to speakers as I always set my powered speakers at unity (12 o'clock position) and control my output with the Helix volume knob. Bear in mind that just because you have the Helix volume max'd out doesn't mean your signal won't be too hot for the preamp that you're going into whether that be the preamp on a powered speaker or a preamp on a mixing board depending on the settings you have in your signal chain. That's ultimately why you need to manage your signal levels within each preset using the amp model's channel volume. The signal meter on the Helix that's accessed by selecting the output block isn't perfect but it will give you a pretty good indicator of how hot your signal is. I generally have that signal meter hitting between 60 to 65 percent and never have any problems with my patches being too hot.

The fact is, digital modeling is consistent regardless of manufacturer. It's nothing more than taking measurements on a circuit board and implementing mathematical algorithms that duplicate those behaviors. As long as the computing resources are consistent (which they are on all units), the difference will be in how familiar the person using the modeler is with how to use the facilities of the unit to get the sound they want. A person that's familiar with any two units will be able to produce equivalent sounds as has been demonstrated on Jason Sadites YouTube channel. So you can pretty much dismiss all "product A sounds or feels better than product B" as nothing more than confirmation bias. That doesn't mean that there aren't meaningful differences when it comes to any individual user or situation. The important factors in evaluating the various units are going to be amps and effects have been modeled, how often they provide updates, ease of use, and flexibility for building signal chains, and practical features that allow you to interact with the outside analog world be that inputs and outputs. For my money, THESE are the factors that have Helix written all over them, particularly when you examine the Floor, Rack, and to a lesser degree the LT. What comes with smaller form factors are usually limitations in usability and integration ability. All Helix units have the same amp and effect models, but have limitations on the complexity of signal chains you can build. So a lot depends on how you intend to use the unit and what you will be using it for. For example, I have two Helix floor units. One unit is dedicated to my studio and serves as a backup for my other unit which is used for live performances. In my studio the Helix works as my audio interface to the DAW and has my vocal microphone, electric guitar, acoustic guitar, keyboard, bass, and drums constantly connected so I can easily select the preset for which instrument I want to record on a given track, arm the track and start recording while monitoring the tracks and inputs either through my studio speakers (Yamaha HS7) or through my headphones. My live system is connected to my QSC Touchmix 30 mixing board and is connected to Yamaha DXR12 speakers for gain staging purposes at home. In addition to my guitar input I also have my BeatBuddy drum pedal attached to the mixing board and controlled via MIDI from my Helix floor. These are the real practical examples of what differentiate the modelers and where you'll find the most practical differences between the different units.

I haven't noticed any difference in timing with MIDI PC messages in 3.1, and I use it consistently every time I change presets to select the matching drum track on my BeatBuddy to the preset I'm loading.

I think this may be related to one of the MIDI bugs that was fixed in the 3.11 release. Read the release notes and see it it applies.

These two things tell you everything you need to know. I think @HonestOpinion's advice is a good one to follow, and Id start with the mixer and/or the audio selector box. The very fact you have a mixer means there are more than just the Helix coming into it so there's a whole world of things we're not being told about your entire signal chain and what it consists of. At home when I practice and dial in presets I have a fairly complex setup myself and I'm always connected to my mixing board which is a QSC TM-30 which is primarily used to gain stage all my signal levels for live performances. In addition to my guitar channel on the mixer attached via XLR outputs from the Helix, I also have a BeatBuddy connected vial XLR output to a different mixer channel, and the mixer has it's output going to a single Yamaha DXR12 speaker. My Helix is also connected via USB to my laptop where I run HXEdit as well as play regular audio/video tracks which get played through the Helix outputs to the mixer via it's XLR connection to the mixer channel. I control the volume of the audio tracks from the laptop, not the mixer. All of this works reliably and consistently with no difference in output regardless of whether I'm running HXEdit or not. I eventually intend to add an Aeros looper unit to my setup, but that will be connected the same as the BeatBuddy with it's output going direct to it's own mixing board channel. Since I intend to only use it to play backing tracks I won't have a guitar signal going to it, but if I did want to use it that way I'd use a send and return.

How are you monitoring the Stomp and how is it connected for output? HXEdit has nothing to do with processing the Helix signal chain, but it may have something to do with your USB connection to your PC.

I think maybe the first thing you may want to consider is abandoning your assumptions about what's required for guitar or bass based on the way things have generally been done over the last 40 or 50 years. Clearly the rules have changed as RD2RK points out. The world of amps and cabinets has been, if not displaced, then augmented significantly by the preamp and FRFR arrangement. I'm a big supporter and adopter of this new modeling world, but even I was hesitant to accept that a bass operates in exactly the same way as guitar when my band went to a completely amp-less stage using preamps and going direct to the mixing board and depending on the FOH speakers and good quality stage monitors, but it very clearly works, and works quite well. The number of folks using the same arrangement as RD2RK of Helix to a 12 inch FRFR speaker for bass exemplifies this change dramatically. Bottom line, there is no magic sauce...there's only personal preferences and what will work best in your situation.

Typically you would want to reserve your XLR outputs for long runs such as going to the mixing board. There are LOTS of different ways to do things, but the standard in the industry is: powered speakers receive line level signals, mixing boards receive mic level signals. Line level is a considerably higher signal level than is mic level. Lower level signals are much less prone to line interference and have less signal loss. All of that being said, let's get serious about "best" quality signal level when it comes to the Helix volume knob. The Helix volume knob is what determines the bit-level of conversion that takes place when the digital signal you've been messing with inside your Helix preset gets converted to an analog signal. Although signal to noise ratio is often cited as the reason, the actual reason is the number of bits being used in the conversion from digital to analog. Some people say they can hear the difference between a high bit rate and a lower bit rate. These people are easily identifiable because they have very large ears and look a lot like a bat. I for one used a 1/4" line to my Yamaha DXR12 on stage for 4 or 5 years on my Helix with my speaker gain set to 12 o'clock and my Helix volume knob typically between 11 to 11:30 and never heard one bit of difference between that tone and the tone I would get from my XLR cable running running at Mic level full volume (with the Helix volume knob disengaged) through QSC KLA12 line arrays and my on stage DXR12...but then I just have normal human ears. The bottom line for me in that situation was, I was in a traditional band with amps and live drums, so it was up to us to manage our stage sound and volume so I needed a way to easily set it, which is the Helix volume knob. As for the audience, I want the absolute MOST control over sound consistency going to the audience and managed at the mixing board, so I sent a full level signal to the board so that it could be appropriately gain staged against all the other signals coming into the board from instruments and voices to be more easily and precisely mixed with everyone else for the FOH...where it REALLY matters. In the last year due mostly to COVID, we've changed our personnel and approach and we no longer use any amps, personal FRFRs or acoustic drums on stage. All of our signals go direct to the mixing board (at full volume, mic level) and the mixing board provides us with our individual monitor mix as well as the audience FOH mix, so there is no direct connection to a stage monitor from the Helix. In both case in the ideal world, the audience always gets the best mix. On stage, we get the mix that serves our individual purposes best...which is absolutely NOT going to be the best mix for the audience. Now you can choose to approach it however you want. I can only tell you my reasoning for how and why I did it the way I've done it based on my experience as both a musician and a sound man. Ultimately you have to decide what best suits the way you and your band operates.

I doubt you would want to run full Helix volume direct to your speakers as you'd want to set your speaker's gain knobs to 12 o'clock and then manage the volume from your Helix volume knob. That's the most practical way to do it with 1/4" cables. Normally you'd disengage your volume knob on the XLR outputs to send to a mixing board. In that case you would use Global ins/outs to set the XLR output to Mic level and specify the Volume knob would not be controlling it....which in effect sends the signal out of the XLR outputs as if the Helix volume knob was set on full.

I do understand what the OP is worried about and have experienced it to one degree or another through the years. Not during performance but often when I'm working on a preset at home. I do 90% of my changes on the Helix itself and there have been times when I'm using one of the knobs that I accidently turn it while trying to navigate which results in a change. I've never really worried about it because I save my presets often during and after I finish with them so if I inadvertently change something I simply move to a different preset then back to the original preset which will be the last saved version. I might have to re-do a couple of things, but that's pretty easy since I just did them them before the incident happened. Granted the tap tempo can be a problem and it would be nice to lock/unlock it on a preset basis, but that's the only situation I could think of that would be of benefit. To me that's no different than any other computer or device I've ever owned. If I make a mistake, I back out and then come back into it which reflects the state prior to my changes. I'd rather do that than have to deal with constantly turning protection on and off. It works the same but without the hassle.

If you want a simple fix for allowing better airflow as well as a better incline on your Helix floor, I use two fairly good sized door stoppers, one on each side at the rear of the board. It's not fancy, but it works great. https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B07MTX9DK4/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_search_asin_title?ie=UTF8&psc=1

Quite honestly recording should be a no brainer with the Helix. If your preset sounds good it's just a matter of hooking it up to your DAW via USB and pressing record. Very little should need to be done other than getting the right signal level and, assuming your listening with the same headphones through the Helix when you play it back, sound the same. Or have you left out some details about how you're playing it back?

It's never a good idea to run your powered speakers very much above unity (12 o''clock on the gain knob) as that invites a number of problems, the worst being clipping and the insidious which is triggering the built in limiter on the speaker. My setup is a pretty common one. I disengage the Helix volume knob from my XLR outputs and set my XLR outputs to Mic level. This will send the best quality and most manageable signal to any PA system. When I use a direct monitor from the Helix 1/4" outputs I always have my Yamaha DXR12 set to unity (12 o'clock) and my typical Helix volume knob setting will be around 11 o'clock, but that varies with your speaker and how you have it placed, but I always adjust the level with the Helix volume knob. My patches normally run at about 60 or 65% on the Helix built in signal meter and are adjusted primarily by the channel volume level on the amp model in my preset as HonestOpinion mentioned.

Just to be crystal clear on this, although you can split your signal and send the signal without the cabs/IRs to your amp and physical cabinet and the one with the Helix cabs/IRs to the DAW, there will very likely be differences in what you're hearing from your physical cabinet and the Helix cabs/IRs simply due to the fact the Helix cabs are modeling the sound based on the mic models and how they were placed. Just wanted to make sure you understood that.

Yes, I exclusively run the BeatBuddy ONLY from the Helix. It really depends on the song how I approach it. Sometimes the changes in the drum parts lines up with multiple changes needed in the signal chain in which case I'll use a Snapshot, but that's not really all that common. I'd say most of the time it's just easier to use a snapshot to make complex changes to the guitar setup and just use a stomp to transition song parts simply because you need to use a MIDI toggle command with the ON button sending the part change (next, previous, or specific part) and the OFF button sending a zero to make sure the transition doesn't keep repeating. I've sent a feature request on the BeatBuddy to be able to trigger a part change without repeating the transition as a single MIDI command. So what I do now is just use a non-latching stomp attached to something like a gain block (set to 0) to send both MIDI values. I have an entry on IdeaScale proposing incorporating the ability to create a MIDI script assgned to a stomp or snapshot to send multiple, sequential commands...but that's the big limitation right now on the Helix. Generally I always use an instantaneous MIDI command attached to Snapshot 1 which will load the MIDI drum song that relates to the Preset I'm using, so simply selecting the preset puts the BeatBuddy in sync with the preset. Since I have a preset per song, it all works great with each song getting it's own drum track. I almost always have one stomp to Start, one Stomp to End, and one Stomp to Fill, then sometimes one stomp to pause/restart, and sometimes one stomp for part transitions. Because I use a preset for each song I have plenty of snaps and buttons available and never really run short. What I'm waiting for is the Aeros to provide a MIDI command to change the active pre-recorded loop which is currently in development. That way the MIDI I send to the BeatBuddy will trigger the Aeros part I might need as well. All theoretical at this point, but I'm hoping it will be possible soon. BeatBuddy Start and End already line up with the Aeros.

I have almost the same situation as what you're describing with a BeatBuddy, L6 wireless and probably eventually an Aeros. The difference in my setup is I created a secondary "outboard" which contains all that that stuff along with a single powerstrip that provides power to everything on that board as well as the Helix and sits separately from the Helix normally placed behind me off to the side. In my case I don't need any direct access to any of those units since I operate everything from the Helix via MIDI. My secondary outboard has two sets of cable groups. One cable group goes to the Helix providing the power cable, 1/4" guitar cable from the wireless, XLR cable for the output from the Helix, and MIDI cable. A second cable group provides the XLR cables that run to the mixer from the BeatBuddy, Aeros (eventually), and from the Helix all marked appropriately for the mixer. I did this primarily because I don't want all the clutter in front of me especially since I don't really have any direct interaction with any of those units on the outboard and I only need a single power plug for everything I use on stage. It's probably not as convenient as a single board, but not nearly as much stage clutter, and only takes a few moments to hook up or tear down. When I tear down I simply loop up each cable group and place them on the secondary outboard into it's own case and it's ready to go for the next gig or to hook up at home. I got a simple extension cord with a right angle power plug that goes from the outboard to the Helix that's permanently a part of that cable group.

I think we're all saying the same thing in different ways. I'm a bit confused about exactly how you would envision how a more simplified approach to gain staging by Line 6 would work. Gain staging always has and always will be about managing the signal level. However, the signal level is never the full story. A distortion pedal is a classic example where, depending on how you've adjusted the parameters, the ultimate signal level may be affected by either the level of the distortion pedal, or the gain/distortion level of the pedal, or in some cases even the tone configuration. Assuming your baseline gain staging is established at the amp, what you are willing to adjust in the distortion pedal is dependent on the sound you're trying to achieve, and could even cause you to consider changing the output of the amp rather than to adjust any specific element in the distortion pedal. That's not something any automated process is ever going to be able to achieve. Being able to examine the effect in isolation could be useful in certain circumstances such as is the case with the gain reduction meter. But even with a gain reduction meter you're only evaluating visually how gain reduction is being applied to the signal, but not whether it's pleasing or consistent with the sound you're wanting to achieve. But there again, the visual representation of the level of gain falls well short of what you subjectively are after in terms of the overall sound of the preset, which again isn't something one can automate. It all comes down to the one thing that gets repeated over and over in these forums which is that your ears are going to be the ultimate judge, not the signal meters. Nothing could exemplify this more prominently in my opinion than the new Retro Reel effect where parameters such as Saturation and Level and even Tape Speed can have an effect both on the overall signal level as well as the overall tone the effect is providing based on where it's placed in your signal chain. That's where the only "tool" Line6 could provide to help is YOUR ears.

As I mentioned, if you start by gain staging the amp(s) in isolation and use that as your standard for your level, it's pretty easy to detect whether any given additional block you add is affecting the level of your signal by simply turning it on and off and correct it immediately. Or you can do as your doing and turn off everything in the signal chain but the amp(s) in the chain then turn each one on individually and correct it based on the level of the amp. You only run into the problem you're talking about if you set up all the elements and THEN start trying to gain stage them individually. Naturally anything you add that increases the gain will always effect anything down stream of it including amps. It still all comes back to using your amp output level as the standard for where you want your signal chain gain staged and simply address it on each block as it gets added.

Speaking of welcoming someone to the real world, that's NOT BT on the WING, those are ethernet connections just like the ones on PCs or on almost all other digital mixers on the market nowadays and are used for remote control surfaces either over a direct LAN connection or via a WIFI...not BT. The prescribed BT protocol doesn't provide enough flexibility nor high enough speed for two way interaction with remote control surfaces because that's not what it's really designed for. But also bear in mind ALL of the digital mixer companies have had varying degrees of connectivity issues primarily due to the environments they work in. My QSC TM-30, which is a direct competitor to the Behringer WING, is rock solid at home. But in performance it has been affected by numerous things like neon lights, or long distances, or tablets that go to sleep and have to be rebooted in order to re-establish the two way interactive connection to the mixer. I'm sure that could be overcome using a direct 802.11 connection, but I don't think I want to run an ethernet cable from the stage to the mixer. I'm not saying I wouldn't like a WIFI connection to control the Helix, but in the environments we all tend to work in it's not the golden goose you might think it is. Sorry if that bursts YOUR bubble.

HXEdit is a simple dumb terminal program that allows you to control the Helix functions rather than using the controls on the unit. It doesn't receive, nor is it aware of what is happening with your signal inside the Helix. That's why the master output meters are on the Helix unit. It's not really necessary to gain stage each block unless you're monkeying around with volume settings in each block. Generally your basic output level is controlled via the channel volume of your amp block, or by the output block. Those are the only two places where you're guaranteed you can change the volume without affecting the tone. By and large your best approach is to set your volume level using the channel volume of the amp, or through a simple gain block if not using an amp and then use the various volume controls on the other blocks to make the minor adjustments to the volume to compensate for when that block is engaged. To put a finer point on things, these adjustments are made only to the digital representation of volume output in your signal chain. The actual analog output level going to the outside world is controlled via the Helix master volume knob position, unless you've specified a given output (XLR or 1/4") is to be disconnected from the signal chain in which case the analog output level of your signal chain will be as if your Helix volume knob were set at full volume. You would then gain stage the signal based on the gain control of the receiving device (mixing board, or powered speaker for example).

Everybody has seen this on all our units because that's what it's designed to do according to the Helix manual and the big quick reference sheet which you may want to familiarize yourself with. I can only assume by "folders" you're talking about setlists which is what you're trying to change. The Home button is used to return you to your default main home screen which is the view of your signal chain. If you're already on that view it does nothing. I can only assume that you're referring to the Amp button which is located next to the home button when you refer to the "folder" button, which simply takes you to the amp model in your current preset. If you're wanting to change setlists, you press the knob just above the home button which then allows you to scroll through the setlists and select the one you want. Just remember, "reading is your friend" as is the manual and the big quick reference sheet.

Because you have your DAW setup so you monitor the source input which then feeds back to your Helix through the USB. Turn off monitoring source in your DAW and you'll always hear the source from the Helix.

It sounds to me like what you're looking for is not a standard "clean" tone as most of us would think of it and can get quite easily from the Helix, but rather a very specific clean tone you have heard from the two other units through the use of some specific effects they've added to a clean signal chain. Without knowing specifically what those effects are and how they're setup is all guesswork. Apparently some form of chorus which Helix has plenty of those variants, but which variant and which setting is still a mystery.

I just watched Jason Sadites video on the the same subject which was a bare bones, comparison removing any and all variables that could potentially cause an unexpected bias by a listener and rotating back and forth between the old and new system and played back on my Yamaha HS7 studio monitors, and I have to say I really didn't hear much at all in terms of a difference. It may have been there in a very slight fashion, but not enough for me to get overly excited by it.