gunpointmetal

It doesn't need all the crazy DSP. It doesn't even need to be "FRFR" necessarily. If someone could take the amp/crossover section from something like one of those Peavey 3pc PA systems and put a 12" sub, maybe downfiring, and a couple of decent 8" drivers with matching tweeters on an angled baffle to give it the stereo spread, in a box with wheels about the size of a 4x12 cab, simple I/O....I can't believe that would have to cost anywhere near $1000 to be profitable. The Firehawk is cool, I didn't like the way the floor version sounded, except for the HD-series ports, so I have no interest in paying for extra modeling. I'm still going to give it a go when one finally shows up at GC, but for half the price I have a two-piece PA solution with more power, lighter weight (even with both pieces, I think), and easily enough volume to match a 4x12 in most performance settings. I tried the L2T speakers, but for extended range guitars, they can't handle it at volume very well. The L3T is out of my price range because I want the stereo option. I still think there's a "middle ground" market for something like this in the $500 price point if it can compete volume-wise with a standard cabinet.

Yeah, that I understand. My electrical noise problems are with ALL of the outputs (headphones, USB, 1/4", XLR) when I'm on crappy power, even with active pickups, so I know its the Helix being sensitive to it.

Why does everyone wanna add Bluetooth and Wi-Fi into a performance setting? Of all the other possible trouble-shooting issues...

The ground lift on the Helix only effects the XLR outputs as far as I know, and I'm not in the practice of "lifting" the ground at the plug on musical gear, especially expensive musical gear that is often plugged into a PC or other expensive musical gear. I don't have the problem in the "studio" office with a real power conditioner, and there are no problems in our rehearsal space where the wiring is less than 12 years old.

My Helix is definitely more sensitive to how clean the power coming in is, especially compared to the HD500X. I can't even use it in the front room of my house because it puts out so much static from the crappy wiring in the building,

I prefer to use the cab EQ's and effects block to make my individual patches sound good. 90% of the time the global EQ isn't even on unless I get in a room and hear something amiss. To me, leaving the global EQ engaged all the time isn't a great idea because if you're individual patches rely on its settings as your building them, when you DO have to use to tune a room its going to mess the "core" sound.

Unless, you know, you wanna keep making money off of your ideas...

Which is how I'm handling setting up my live patches right now. I'd prefer to be able to use the dual OD amp tones I have for home playing live, but there is too much lag between them and there isn't room in the DSP to fit my clean patches with the various delays/verbs/modulations on the same patch. Also, in doing it with a dual-chain patch for clean/dirty there starts to be more stomps required to turn things off/on between settings. What I was doing on the HD500 and my Boss modelers before that was to have sometimes up to four patches/per song with my main OD on patch one, clean w/mod/delay on patch 2, clean with chorus/verb on patch 3, and clean with every effect available on patch 4 to cover all the different parts of a song without having to ever turn an effect on/off, meaning no tap dancing. As it stands, I have to remember everytime I switch to a distortion channel that I need to turn off the delay and reverb on the clean channel, then turn on the phaser for the next time the clean part comes in, then turn that off when I switch back, then remember to turn the delay and chorus and verb back on before the next clean section.....so instead of three stomps to do all my switching, not I have to do three for each section, remember to do it while I'm playing the dirty parts, then remember to undo it and add in different things before the next clean part. I understand not everyone requires this type of all-over-the-place switching, but for the music I play, sometimes I'm, literally switching effects/channels/everything a quarter note/half-measure at a time, so as it stands, I'm having to dance around ALMOST as much as if I had analog pedals and a multi-loop patch bay....

I'm hoping that as the unit ages code will be optimized and this won't be an issue forever. The change latency on the HD500 when it was released was pretty much unusable, too, but a few firmware updates later and it was NEARLY instantaneous. I just really don't like that I can build these lush, beautiful clean patches and these thick, defined multi-amp distortion patches, but I can't actually use them live because I can't fit everything into one preset, so I'm stuck with "usable" versions with stripped down effects and single amp chains so I can switch clean/dirty without a hiccup.

Yeah, I'm pretty disappointed that the patch lag is WORSE than the HD500X. I'm probably actually gonna keep my Helix at home/practice and gig with the HD for a few more weeks because to do the switching I need to, its now much more of a dance to turn things off and on in the background when clean/dirt channels are switched, having to build song-specific patches to avoid spillover. Mostly, I'm pretty pissed that for live use, I'm basically limited to one clean amp and one dirty amp if I want seamless patch changes, or dealing with a long, non-musical gap if I want to use two amps. My guitars sound great with a combo of the Meteor and the Panama, but switching from a patch with both to a clean with delay, chorus, compression, reverb (and sometimes more, depending on the song) takes too freaking long.

That really doesn't make any sense to me..even if you're plugging into a "FRFR" PA speaker, you still may need to cut bass/treble or adjust the EQ...

Digitech should make that its own pedal..its such a random, seldom used effect, but they're the only ones doing it. I could never find a use for it, but I liked having it around to mess with on my own time.

So the L2/L3 speakers and the M20D disable the EQ for things coming via L6 Link? I can see with the DT amps where it might cancel out the onboard EQ in favor of the amp models, but I'm not familiar with the DT amps full functionality as I avoid anything with tubes like I'll catch something. I don't really understand why there has two be two separate global EQs if they have to share settings, why not just have one before the internal split out to the various outputs and save even more DSP....

You'd also, more than likely, be using the L6 Link output for something that has its own equalizer as well. I think a lot of people are using the Global EQ to try and fix their patches and thats not really what its meant for.

Depending on your tuning, and how low or high you're trying to shift, even most polyphonic pitch shifters will introduce artifacts. The way you can get around it a little bit for "standard" chords is to set a harmonizer up a third in the key your playing in and just do the root of the chord with the mix set where you like it. I just get a guitar with more strings and play stuff in different positions.

Check out the templates Set List, they have several set-ups that alternate amps with a switch, you can add/edit however you want.

so......compared to say, a cranked triple rectifier, will this move a similar amount of air? I've been seriously disappointed by most AIO stereo boxes, because the output volume can get loud, but when the bass gets cut down to stay out of the low end, the volume also disappears. I'll wait till GC gets one and find out for myself, I guess.

How does the overall output level compare to a pair of say Alto TS112s, or Mackie Thump 12s. I really like the idea of an AIO FRFR amplifier, but in trying my HD500X through the bigger AmplifI I couldn't get any sort of usable stage volume. 132dB SEEMS loud, but how much of that is going to be unnecessary low end from the center speaker? Will this box be able to compete in "in-room" volume with a loud 4x12? Basically, I need my rig to be able to push enough volume to be usable in scenarios where the guitar isn't getting PA support and there is a loud drummer. I can do that now with $600 worth of powered speakers, but I have to carry two boxes (admittedly, those two boxes together don't weight as much as this amp).

If Kemper and Line 6 designed their DI outputs properly, they would function the same as an external DI box, otherwise, it would seem that both units have XLR outputs for limited use and mostly for show. I don't really understand how there is a "No, really, its OK it doesn't work right, because you can just buy some other stuff to get the functionality that's supposed to be baked into the device" attitude towards this. Having exceptionally routing and modeling doesn't mean you get a pass on dumb mistakes/issues that should have been sorted in hardware development.

Why would anyone want to add a DI box to a device that's supposed to be its own DI box? If there is actually noise in the XLR outputs and not the 1/4" outputs, something is wrong. the more crap you have to add externally to a device like this the further you get from the reason a lot of us purchase a device like this...

Maybe you and Glenn can fit everything on one patch. I'm having to compromise greatly on which effects are available and adding more stomps to get there Helix-recreations of clean/dirty changes that I would have had on individual presets that I switch between on my HD500X when I'm playing live. I have to use simplified delays/chorus/etc because I have to have both my clean and dirty amps loaded in a patch to have seamless in-song switching. It's a "useable" workaround to load everything in a single patch, but I'd prefer to just switch presets.

I was having some noise issues, turns out a whole wall in my apartment has un-grounded three prong outlets.

That is too picky, the point of changing the impedance of the signal is to send it to a microphone input instead of a line input, so you can call the levels whatever you want. The picked the wrong functionality to accommodate. It would've been, to me, more logical to skip the summing, because its not hard to to make all your stereo patches mono in a different setlist should that be required for your gig. Or save different bundles of for mono environments, costing the user nothing but extra time. And saying that its a trade off would make sense if, when used summed to mono, the single XLR out was not affected by phantom power, but otherwise, its just poor implementation. I get it Phil, you really, really, really like Line 6. So do I. I really dig the sounds coming out of my Helix. I planned on using it in the same capacity as I had been doing my HD500(X, now) for years, but I will need to invest in outboard gear to make sure that I am able to do so no matter where I play, which is kinda silly considering this is advertised as, and I would imagine intended to be, and an all-in-one guitar rig solution.

If I hand a sound guy two XLR cables and tell him they're line-level, I'm gonna get a lot of funny looks. 9/10 times people are expecting a microphone level signal with an XLR (mic) cable. The whole reason people would need a DI box would be to turn the Line Level to microphone level, which the Helix already does, optionally, via the XLR outs which should, theoretically, eliminate the need for an external DI box. Having less crap to lug around and plug is kind of one of the the big draws of a MFX set-up like Helix, so adding in another DI box to get the functionality of a $500 unit doesn't really make sense. When have you ever seen, outside of special use, a DI box that even has XLR inputs on it. If I'm gonna have to run a DI in between me and the FOH, I'm just gonna patch off the 1/4" outputs and use the "through" outputs of the DI to send back to my on-stage monitoring, effectively rendering the XLR outputs pointless. I don't personally see how this could be anything OTHER than a design flaw. Everyone knows you're not supposed to connect non-phantom-powered gear to powered inputs, but most mixers under 20 channels either have it off or on, or they might have two sets of on/off switches. Hey, no big deal if I'm running my own sound, but I'm not going to expect the sound-guy at a club to rewire his whole rack to accommodate my input needs, so I'm going to have to invest in some phantom blockers, or another DI box to avoid it ever being an issue, which brings us back to full circle in that the Helix, like the HD500X, is supposed to be an AIO unit that doesn't need external anything for a complete guitar rig.... So yeah, its a design flaw.

I'm using a pair of Mackie Thump 12" speakers laid down like floor monitors on either side of the drummer, plenty of volume for most places where I would have usually used my half-stack in the past, and I build my live tones on the speakers with the EQ flat, so I don't even engage the global EQ. My HD500X sounded great through them, Helix sounds even better.