scias23 Posted February 18, 2015 Share Posted February 18, 2015 It seems like my crunch tones are too compressed. I've already used dual cab setup but setting it up is pain in the @$$. How can I make the sound more open and amp-like? When I'm not using screamer or tube drive, the slightly clean tone from the amp sounds OK. If I kick the distortion pedal on, oh my goodness but the sound is horrible. I have a Fender strat and Texas Special PUps. I always set the Brit P75 bias to 80% and excursion 50%. Am I doing this right? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
edstar1960 Posted February 18, 2015 Share Posted February 18, 2015 There are a lot of parameters that affect the sound. You need to have a look at all the DEP parameters for the AMP and CAB. Plus you also need to adjust the values on the SCREAMER or TUBE DRIVE to get the effect you want. If you are happy with the amp sound on its own then I suggest you tweak the settings on the SCREAMER or TUBE DRIVE to see if you can get the sound you are after. Perhaps you just need to lower the output and/or drive of each one? I have recently found out from other threads on this forum that the RESONANCE parameter default of 50% is not ideal and that for live use starting with a setting of 0% along with a THUMP value of 20 to 25% may produce a more realistic sound. Also the MASTER parameter for the amp in the DEP section may need adjusting - try reducing the value to see what that does. Experiment with these things one at a time to see how they affect the sound. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NucleusX Posted February 18, 2015 Share Posted February 18, 2015 Not sure what genre your trying to achieve, but this is my perspective from a high-gain metal point of view. Good distortion is one of the most hardest things to nail in any modeller. 2 things I learnt over the years in the analogue realm, which I stick to in digital modellers as-well is, 1, don't front-end a high-gain amp channel with a distortion pedal, and use an TS or OD instead, with gains well balanced. 2, Don't front-end a clean channel amp with a TS or OD and use a distortion pedals instead with gains well balanced. A compressor and EQ before the OD or Distortion can help as-well, the EQ has a large impact on the Distortion character if placed before gain stages. DEP "ER" always sounds better at %0, one of the most useless parameters in there imo. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
amsdenj Posted February 18, 2015 Share Posted February 18, 2015 Generally as distortion increases, bass and treble need to decrease. Too much bass makes the distorted sound muddy and indistinct. Too much treble makes it sound bright, fizzy, ratty, or has an ice pick feel. I use the Vintage Pre or Mid Focus EQ right before the amp to control the distortion tone. When I turn on the Vintage Pre, it pushes the amp harder and I use the low and high pass filters to adjust the boosted tone. Then I use the Tube Drive or Screamer in front of the Vintage Pre to get even more distortion. Bass, Treble and/or Tone controls on the Tube Drive or Screamer can further tailor the tone for the increased gain. Basically these effects are used to voice the amplifier for different gain settings. By using these two effects in front of the amp, I can get 4 different settings on two switches: 1. Clean - Vintage Pre and Tube Drive off 2. Blues - Vintage Pre on, Tube Drive off 3. Crunch or more aggressive - Vintage Pre off, Tube Drive on. 4. More metal-like - both on You can set these combinations up differently for different amps. High gain amps will behave quite differently than low gain amps and will need very different settings. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cruisinon2 Posted February 18, 2015 Share Posted February 18, 2015 It seems like my crunch tones are too compressed. I've already used dual cab setup but setting it up is pain in the @$$. How can I make the sound more open and amp-like? When I'm not using screamer or tube drive, the slightly clean tone from the amp sounds OK. If I kick the distortion pedal on, oh my goodness but the sound is horrible. I have a Fender strat and Texas Special PUps. I always set the Brit P75 bias to 80% and excursion 50%. Am I doing this right? There is no "right" way to do it, but "always" sticking to any one setting(s) might be part of the problem. Playing around with the deep edit parameters can make a substantial difference in how things sound. Any one setting might work for one amp model but not necessarily the next. If you're not happy with what you're getting, you need to experiment...try another amp, different distortion pedal, EQs, etc...the combinations are almost endless. It'll take a while, but when you nail it, you'll know. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pfsmith0 Posted February 18, 2015 Share Posted February 18, 2015 Also, make sure your input settings are Guitar/Variax (unless you use a Variax). This will reduce your signal by 6dB and give you more headroom for decent crunch tones. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brue58ski Posted February 18, 2015 Share Posted February 18, 2015 The SAG knob in DEP Amp Parameters acts kind of like a compressor. The higher the level the more "tight" it is. Try turning the SAG parameter down. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
duncann Posted February 18, 2015 Share Posted February 18, 2015 The SAG knob in DEP Amp Parameters acts kind of like a compressor. The higher the level the more "tight" it is. Try turning the SAG parameter down. In addition to this, here's a couple more terms to describe the the SAG parameter: the lower it is, the more "spongy", "springy", or "loose" it feels, and the higher it is, the "sponginess", "springiness', or "looseness" becomes more dense, or compacted. Does it actually add any compression though, or just a "feeling" of compression? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cruisinon2 Posted February 18, 2015 Share Posted February 18, 2015 In addition to this, here's a couple more terms to describe the the SAG parameter: the lower it is, the more "spongy", "springy", or "loose" it feels, and the higher it is, the "sponginess", "springiness', or "looseness" becomes more dense, or compacted. Does it actually add any compression though, or just a "feeling" of compression? Isn't that backwards? Or are we just getting confused by a bunch of adjectives? If I turn the SAG # up, that's when the "mushiness" shows up, pick attack starts to get lost, etc...turning it down gives me a sound that I would describe as "tighter". Maybe it's me... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
duncann Posted February 18, 2015 Share Posted February 18, 2015 I suppose it could be either way or my perception is bass ackwards, but when I turn it down, it gets "mushier". Guitarists should have their own dictionary. lol. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cruisinon2 Posted February 18, 2015 Share Posted February 18, 2015 I suppose it could be either way or my perception is bass ackwards, but when I turn it down, it gets "mushier". Guitarists should have their own dictionary. lol. It would only have one word in it..."faster". ;) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
radatats Posted February 18, 2015 Share Posted February 18, 2015 In addition to this, here's a couple more terms to describe the the SAG parameter: the lower it is, the more "spongy", "springy", or "loose" it feels, and the higher it is, the "sponginess", "springiness', or "looseness" becomes more dense, or compacted. Does it actually add any compression though, or just a "feeling" of compression? SAG refers to a drop in voltage or current within a real amp that affects response. If you "increase" the knob above 50 you are "lowering" the SAG, very counter-intuitive. And yes, as you "lower" the SAG (increase the knob setting) it gets spongier, less attack and vice versa. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cruisinon2 Posted February 18, 2015 Share Posted February 18, 2015 SAG refers to a drop in voltage or current within a real amp that affects response. If you "increase" the knob above 50 you are "lowering" the SAG, very counter-intuitive. And yes, as you "lower" the SAG (increase the knob setting) it gets spongier, less attack and vice versa. Well there ya go, lol. At least I'm not nuts... :P Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
duncann Posted February 18, 2015 Share Posted February 18, 2015 SAG refers to a drop in voltage or current within a real amp that affects response. If you "increase" the knob above 50 you are "lowering" the SAG, very counter-intuitive. And yes, as you "lower" the SAG (increase the knob setting) it gets spongier, less attack and vice versa. Thanks for fixing my perception. Now I know why I like the parameter turned slightly below 50. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
duncann Posted February 18, 2015 Share Posted February 18, 2015 Nice videos explaining the amp dep parameters. I've seen these before, but it's always good to go back and watch stuff like this frequently. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pianoguyy Posted February 18, 2015 Share Posted February 18, 2015 I've found it to be a volume issue. Sort of like running a power soak on a cab. It just doesn't sound the same at low volume. It IS the same, but there is something that just doesn't click when testing out sounds at low volumes. Distortion needs POWER, other wise its wimpy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scias23 Posted February 19, 2015 Author Share Posted February 19, 2015 I've found it to be a volume issue. Sort of like running a power soak on a cab. It just doesn't sound the same at low volume. It IS the same, but there is something that just doesn't click when testing out sounds at low volumes. Distortion needs POWER, other wise its wimpy. volume issue? if so, should i set the output of the distoetion effects to 100%? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pfsmith0 Posted February 19, 2015 Share Posted February 19, 2015 No, he means it's a sound pressure issue (SPL). You need to move more air. Our ears hear differently based on what the sound pressure level is. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pianoguyy Posted February 19, 2015 Share Posted February 19, 2015 No, he means it's a sound pressure issue (SPL). You need to move more air. Our ears hear differently based on what the sound pressure level is. I am glad you answered that. I am not sure I could have said it as well as you did. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Triryche Posted February 19, 2015 Share Posted February 19, 2015 Fletcher-Munson curves. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scias23 Posted February 20, 2015 Author Share Posted February 20, 2015 No, he means it's a sound pressure issue (SPL). You need to move more air. Our ears hear differently based on what the sound pressure level is. The problem is, I can't turn my volume up some more as the recorded mix would be full of electric guitar. Sure it sounds good live when the volume is turned up, but I want to address this issue in the context of recording. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pianoguyy Posted February 20, 2015 Share Posted February 20, 2015 turn the volume up on your guitar and then lower the volume in the recorder. That's why each track has its own volume. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JTSC777 Posted February 20, 2015 Share Posted February 20, 2015 Hurghanicos guide turned my whole POD HD500 journey around.Read and implement all that he suggests and you will get real good tones out of your POD. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scias23 Posted February 20, 2015 Author Share Posted February 20, 2015 Hurghanicos guide turned my whole POD HD500 journey around.Read and implement all that he suggests and you will get real good tones out of your POD. What guide? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jandrio Posted February 20, 2015 Share Posted February 20, 2015 meambobbo's guide ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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