Helix LT drop out

[5mafre5br]

I’ve been gigging with Helix LT for several years just fine (XLR left output direct into mixer). At band practice last night volume decreased and then came back, and it started clicking/popping. Then it stopped working. No sound. Then bottom row of buttons made some noise, and top row worked ok, then stopped again. Same when changing banks. Tried power off – nope, change guitar cable – nope. Then it began working like normal, but had a few seconds randomly dropping out. Seems to be working fine now, but I am skeptical.  Any ideas what the problem is? 

Thanks, Joel

[rd2rk]

It's a computer. It glitches.

Do a factory reset.

 

 

[5mafre5br]

1) So you think this is not a hardware issue?

 

2) Did you have this problem?  Is reset what you did to fix it?

 

3) I imagine some others had this problem.  Is reset what they did to fix it?

 

Now I am feeling very insecure about my Helix LT reliability, and not sure I want to continue with it.  I'd feel better if I knew that hundreds of people fixed this problem with a reset, and it wasnt a hardware issue for them.

 

[rd2rk]

53 minutes ago, 5mafre5br said:

1) So you think this is not a hardware issue?

 

2) Did you have this problem?  Is reset what you did to fix it?

 

3) I imagine some others had this problem.  Is reset what they did to fix it?

 

Now I am feeling very insecure about my Helix LT reliability, and not sure I want to continue with it.  I'd feel better if I knew that hundreds of people fixed this problem with a reset, and it wasnt a hardware issue for them.

 

 

Just do the reset.

It either works or it doesn't.

If it doesn't, you've already done what the support tech is going to tell you to do when you call.

It really is troubleshooting 101.

Just do it.

 

DON'T FORGET TO BACKUP FIRST!

[PierM]

You gigged with it for "several years" without a glitch. Why losing confidence the first time you have a problem in years?

 

Just reset the unit and see if problem is gone. At least that way you know that if it will come back after a full reset, it's stuff that probably needs service attention.

 

[codamedia]

I agree with the full reset.... that is always solid advice when dealing with computer devices that are acting out of the ordinary. 

 

Two other things to consider...

• Did phantom power accidentally get turned on at the mixer? The Helix does strange things when phantom power is on. 
• These units are susceptible to power... are you sure there were no power issues at the practice spot that evening? 

[5mafre5br]

If I had the problem now, and do a reset, and then it worked, that would be proof that reset fixes the problem. But - it is working fine now, so there is nothing for a reset to prove. I am worried it will happen again, but on stage.

 

I checked - no phantom power, and no apparent power issues. Maybe I should buy another Helix and keep it as a backup on stage? 

 

This is all good advice, and I really appreciate it! 

[5mafre5br]

Even though I was not having the issue any more, I did a reset/update, which I should probably do anyway.  I did the following:

backed up bundle and set lists

factory reset the LT (buttons 10&11) - set lists seemed to remain intact

updated my HXedit to 3.11

updated my LT to 3.11

updated firmware

factory reset the LT, because it asked me to (buttons 9&10) - this time the set lists were erased

imported my set list

things seem to be working as usual

My question is:  Is this the procedure I needed to do to refresh the firmware and remove possible glitches?

thanks,

Joel

 

[Josh_guitarreiru]

Hi,

 

I'm getting the same issue in my Helix LT with 3.71 and was wondering whether the factory reset solved your issue?

 

I've performed my backups (preset, setlist, bundle and full backup) and then I have performed a factory reset (footswitches 9 & 10).

After that I imported my bundle and was wondering whether importing the bulndle created when the unit was showing the issue would somehow counteract the factory reset?

 

Thanks!

 

[datacommando]

On 7/28/2024 at 11:29 AM, Josh_guitarreiru said:

 

After that I imported my bundle and was wondering whether importing the bulndle created when the unit was showing the issue would somehow counteract the factory reset?

 

Hi,

 

You could re-import your backup bundle, and then restart your device while holding down FS10 & 11. This will upgrade your existing presets to the latest format. The “rebuilding presets” routine generally takes place automatically after an update to the Firmware and is part of the general “housekeeping” to keep your unit working as it should. Forcing the re-build should help eliminate any glitches in your presets.

 

Hope this helps/makes sense.

[Josh_guitarreiru]

Hi, many thanks for your advice.

 

I have not forced the re-build by pressing the footswitches 10 and 11 but the rebuild happened automatically anyway when I turned OFF and ON again after importing my bundle, so I guess that this step would not be necessary?

I'm not sure however whether the factory reset would eliminate my volume drop out / mute issue, I'll see how it behaves the next few days. Its a weird issue as the volume was drastically reduced (almost muted but I could hear a little bit of sound) even though the output meters in the output block were showing normal expected output level...

[shumphreysmusic]

Just posting to say I had this problem tonight at rehearsal, as well. Updated to 3.71  a month ago, and never had this occur before.  The sound stopped coming out on the left/main out (1/4" jack). The display and switch functions were working normally, and the input and output blocks on the screen showed signal (blank to green shading when playing).  A power cycle fixed it. (off, wait 10 seconds, power on).

 

I'm wondering if a UPS or other supply conditioner might be a good idea.

[theElevators]

On 10/15/2024 at 11:25 PM, shumphreysmusic said:

Just posting to say I had this problem tonight at rehearsal, as well. Updated to 3.71  a month ago, and never had this occur before.  The sound stopped coming out on the left/main out (1/4" jack). The display and switch functions were working normally, and the input and output blocks on the screen showed signal (blank to green shading when playing).  A power cycle fixed it. (off, wait 10 seconds, power on).

 

I'm wondering if a UPS or other supply conditioner might be a good idea.

Is this while running HX Edit?  For me, it often crashes my Helix and it becomes unresponsive. 

[silverhead]

On 10/16/2024 at 10:32 AM, theElevators said:

Is this while running HX Edit?  For me, it often crashes my Helix and it becomes unresponsive. 

I know you're a regular participant here and I know your presets are complex. Still these crashes shouldn't be happening. Imho it's either a USB issue with your computer or a bug in Helix/HX Edit. In case it's a bug it could benefit others if you could chase it down with Line 6. Have you opened a support ticket about it?

[theElevators]

On 10/16/2024 at 10:41 AM, silverhead said:

I know you're a regular participant here and I know your presets are complex. Still these crashes shouldn't be happening. Imho it's either a USB issue with your computer or a bug in Helix/HX Edit. In case it's a bug it could benefit others if you could chase it down with Line 6. Have you opened a support ticket about it?

I just opened a support ticket.

[shumphreysmusic]

On 10/16/2024 at 10:32 AM, theElevators said:

Is this while running HX Edit?  For me, it often crashes my Helix and it becomes unresponsive. 

Just the floor unit with guitar in, one line out, and power being the only connections.  (Good question to clarify the situation.) 

edit-  Also, this was while in the middle of playing a song, not immediately after any switch press or adjustment including the expression pedal.

If this occurs again, are there any other steps that might help isolate the problem?  For example, I switched presets and a few switches for snapshots and bypasses to no effect (output sound was still dead).

Edited October 17, 2024 by shumphreysmusic
added info

[theElevators]

Check all cables. All of them.  If they are older than 3 years, definitely throw them out, or leave it for home rehearsals.  That's what I do, I throw all the stuff out after some time because I cannot afford to have a fun diagnostic session on stage during my show. 

 

All I'm saying, is sometimes you can attribute a cable going bad to hardware failure.  Let me give you 2 examples of what I have seen myself:

 

1. I was playing a show on a very very hot stage.  My setup was guitar->wah->distortion->amp.  All of a sudden I started experiencing fade-outs in my sound.  I'm playing, and it's getting softer, then louder.  I thought the amp was dying... Long story short: it was the 1/4" cable that got un-soldered due to the heat on stage, and the amp being very very hot. 

2. Another time I was practicing for my shows at home.  All of a sudden on my Helix, all my acoustic emulator sounds began to sound extremely brittle, fizzy, and noisy.  Very strange that all other sounds were seemingly fine.  Long story short--it was the 1/4" input cable again! 

 

 

[shumphreysmusic]

@theElevators - Yeah, the clicking and popping 5mafr5br reports in his post does sound like a cable issue, potentially.

 

For me, this is not acting at all like a cable issue.  This output cable (and the guitar cable) is a relatively new cable that I keep as a backup, just a few years old, good quality, and lightly used a few times, always carefully "union wrapped" (over/under), and not stepped on much - mostly routed out away from where we stand. The connections and plugs are in great shape. There's heat shrink around the solder joints so I can't see the connections, but it's all clean, no damage to the heat shrink, strain reliefs and jacket or plugs.

 

The sound just cut out all at once, no hint of an issue, no crackles, etc. ever before that. The input and output blocks were responding to the guitar, so with the power still on we swapped in a different output cable to the PA with no improvement, still dead.  After power cycling both the swapped and original cable worked fine.

 

This is acting most like an output protection circuit tripped, perhaps a thermal shut off tripped, though I run at half volume for the line out (so most of heat is probably in the processor(s)), or possibly power-on-reset tripped and reset a processor or a serially programmed device like an active resistor type of component in the output chain. I'm not familiar with the architecture enough to say more specifically what it could be, but it's that kind of an immediate reset or "shut off" behavior.  A mains surge, high noise or droop might cause this type of thing if the internal DC power supply is not well filtered and bypassed, for example.  Switching presets, which I imagine should reprogram every stage, did not bring the output back, only a full power cycle.

 

If there is some sort of event log to check later that would be really helpful for debugging. Not sure if the Helix LT provides any?  Cheers