codamedia

I thought it was just the older models of Variax it couldn't support (for updates), I stand corrected. Thanks for this bit of info... it's good to know. If I ever buy a used JTV or Standard I'll have to make sure it comes with it's dongle. That is something I definitely would have overlooked! I guess that is what surprises me... even if Monkey is not supported, why wouldn't they build an update function into Workbench HD? Oh well, it is what it is & at least now I know!

A lot of people don't realize this, but the preamp models also include cab and mic combinations unless you set that to NONE... they are just missing the POWER AMP section. I'm on a Helix these days, but most of my tones on the HD500 were setup with the PREAMP models along with the appropriate cab/mic combo's. I found them easier to tame through the system. It may have been a placebo effect, but I always found the full amps on the HD to lack low mids and punch on a stage. I don't experience that with the Helix... and I didn't experience that with the preamp models on the HD. YMMV.... that's just my experience.

. Rule number 1: Setup all your tones at full volume, then use the pedal to back those off when needed. Cutting almost always has less side effects than boosting. In this case, you have learned that you do not like the volume pedal in front of the EQ, therefore, run it after :) I always run mine after any gain/drives/wah, etc... etc..., but before any modulations (chorus, tremolo, etc...), delays or reverbs. I may place it just before the amp block, or just after it.... EG: Guitar in > wah > overdrive pedals > any other effects before the amp > Maybe put the Volume Block Here > AMP BLOCK > or Maybe put the Volume Block Here > Modulation Effects > Delays > Reverbs That's just a general rule... not the only way it can be done.

Create a blank preset then copy it over top of anything you want to clear. I know that is not the answer you are looking for, but that's how I get it done :)

For the record... The HX Effects can do it via A/B path but of course doesn't have the amps. You can still separate the dry and wet thought. The HX Stomp can also do it via A/B paths, but you will likely run out of blocks and/or processing power before you reach your goal. The nice thing about the Helix (Floor/LT/Native) is that it has TWO INDEPENDENT paths, each capable of it's own child A/B path. This patch doesn't even expand into those child A/B paths :)

IMO... separate feeds for wet dry can help the sound man... maybe a mono dry feed and a stereo wet feed. Then he can do what he wants with the effect portion. But... if you are just sending a stereo feed with a dry signal up the middle and stereo effects, IMO - you are still in the position that the audience may hear different things based on where they are sitting. I will say...the @DarthHollis post above is solid! That is someone that understand the pitfalls, and knows how to work with them and around them.

Strictly talking about a live setup: I'm not interested in hearing a glorious stereo tone that the audience will never enjoy unless they stand at the optimal listening position. My live tones are mono & If I'm in the mix the audience hears my tone the way I hear it, regardless of where they are sitting/standing! That's just my 2 cents.... If others want to hear themselves in stereo on a stage I would never try to stop them.

I just called up the preset in Helix Native.... it's just a wet dry setup. The top row is the dry tone with a couple of overdrives and a compressor into the front of an amp. The bottom row is the wet tone. There are two delays to choose, two reverbs to choose and two modulations. I can't tell from the Native version... but I suspect the volume blocks at the front of each chain allows you to blend the two as desired with the expression pedal. If it isn't setup automatically that way, it would be easy to do so. In the real amp world people run a wet/dry setup all the time. This is no different. It wouldn't surprise me one bit if Gilmour ran a setup very similar to this at some point.

That should be a sticky at the top of the forum! I can't tell you how many times I've tried to explain this to people, but never quite get it right :) I visit the TDPRI (telecaster) forum on occasion, and in their amp section I often see the complete opposite problem. People are always wondering why they can't get the sound of their favorite guitar tone - even though they have the same guitar/amp. They fail to understand (or accept) they are missing the entire studio chain from their tone.

Never said that and never will. FYI: My post was not directed at you... I purposely never quoted anyone, I just read a whole bunch of posts in this thread that I found very odd and decided to lend a general comment.

I don't understand how a You Tube Demo that is well put together is irrelevant just because most cannot play like that, or don't have the knowledge in producing a good looking, great sounding demo. There are three things I get from videos like that.... (regardless of the product they are promoting.... Helix, Kemper, AXEFX, etc....) It shows, without a doubt, that the "tool of choice" is more than capable of getting the job done If I want to accomplish that, I need to put in the time to LEARN how to use it. (Optional) If I want to play like that, I need to practice more! IMO: Too many people want to be spoon fed great tone and if they aren't willing put the effort into #2 (or in fairness, just don't have the knowledge or ability to figure it out), they may attempt to discredit #1 to justify their failed attempt. Good carpenters never blame the tools!

I used the HD500 to record bass parts for years. I don't play bass live so I never invested in the Bass Amp pack... I just used the Flip Top model for pretty much everything I did and it got the job done without fail.

TIP: Insert an EQ block (one with filters) after the amp/cab/ir and set your LPF and HPF there. Now, change you cab block or IR all you want and your default filters are still in place.

There you have it.... the only Line 6 POD Products I haven't owned - LOL!

Yes - in case I muddied the waters, I was agreeing with you :) I have upvoted your idea!

HX Effects is just effects, but it is a different product than the HX stomp. Even you said it was an HX Stomp that was in question... I'm not sure why/how HX Effects has been entered into evidence :)

I do like the idea of one "power amp block"... rather than separating every single amp. It could be as simple as choosing tube options (El84, 6V6, Single Ended, 6L6, EL34, KT66)... or as complicated as choosing PI Options (Cathodyne, Long Tail, etc...), Tube Options (as mentioned earlier) and Output Transformer Options. With option #2, if you knew much about the amp you like you could built your power amp to match. EG: Long Tail PI, EL34 Tubes, Partridge Transformer would give you a close replication of a Marshall Plexi or JCM 800. In combination with the pre-amp models this would be very useful.

^^^ This ^^^ I put my Peterson tuner away once the strobe was introduced on the HX line. I'm not suggesting the HX tuner is better than the Peterson, but it is comparable. As for hooking up an external tuner to the HX Effects... why not follow the tip provided on page 15 in the manual.. "TIP: If you have a favorite pedal tuner and wish to use it instead of the tuner within your HX Effects device, connect Send 1 or 2 to your tuner's input and turn Knob 1 (Tuner Out) to select "Send 1 or 2." This way, every time you hold the TAP footswitch, the HX Effects device will automatically route the signal to your favorite tuner"

IMO: The Helix Control would be a better fit for the Helix Rack... but YMMV. If an expression pedal w/toe switch (extremely useful for wah effects) has any importance to you, then the Helix Control will win the battle. The HX Effects cannot recognize an external toe switch at this time.

What Line 6 products had the option of storing different "default settings" for the Amps/Effects? I've had the original POD Bean, POD2 Bean, X3 Bean, X3 Live, HD500, HX Effects and now the Helix LT. Unless I've missed it, I've never seen that option. Don't get me wrong, it's a great idea and I will upvote it! I'm just curious where it may have been used before by Line 6.

For the record, in your OP you do NOT ask for any help on how to overcome this, you just look for confirmation on how you feel about the tone. Since you are struggling with this problem, I'd suggest you check out the Jason Sadites videos on you tube, in particular this one... "https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2oSUj8oK6Pg Another option is to try some IR's... although that can be overwhelming if you don't have a lot of experience with cabs/speakers/mics/positions. Are you suggesting the HX Stomp sounds different than the Helix? It's just a smaller version, the amps and effects are the same. The entire HX product line (Helix Floor, Helix Rack, Helix LT, HX Stomp, Helix Native) all share the same amps and effects. When talking about tone, a stomp owner has every right to voice his opinion.

From the manual of that amp.... ------------ NOTE: Because the MASTER Control determines the send level of the FX Loop, extreme settings may cause possible overloading of FX processor’s or pedal’s Input stage, but also may make balancing the two channels’ FX Send level difficult. ----------- It says the Master volume of each channel alters the FX SEND LEVEL? IMO, Randall Smith made a huge mistake with that design! I think you will have a hard time balancing a 4CM with that amp... I'd recommend just running everything into the front end of the amp. if you really want to try 4cm with that setup... Set your HX Effects LOOP to LINE in the global settings and turn down the SEND level (in the loop block) to -6 or maybe even lower so you don't drive the front of the amp to hard. Either that... or insert a SEND BLOCK (#1) set to Instrument level, and then add a RETURN BlOCK (#2) set to LINE level... but that takes up two blocks. Just my opinion!

IMO, it shows that the Helix is more than capable of the job. The rest is up to the user.

Great advice by rvroberts... start at the beginning and test everything to eliminate that as the potential problem. I will only add... is the loop in your amp LINE LEVEL or INSTRUMENT level? That is important to know so you can set the loop settings on your HX Effects appropriately.

In a test like this it is imperative to be volume matched or your ears will perceive a difference that doesn't actually exist. In my setup I have never noticed any difference in tone between the XLR and 1/4". If there was a difference in the video, it's marginal. More important, if there was a difference in the video who's to say it isn't the Alto's inputs that sound different. According to the video description on YouTube... the biggest difference was noise, with the XLR being quieter. That shouldn't surprise anyone.... as unbalanced lines are more susceptible to noise.