intermittent joystick since update

[rwinking]

I found that my joystick had become intermittent after upgrading to 2.8. I thought it was a hardware problem but I called the company and they said that this was a known issue with 2.8 and told me to go to 2.81. I did that and the issue is back. Anyone else on this?

[rd2rk]

When you called them back and told them that you still had the issue, what did they say?

[datacommando]

38 minutes ago, rwinking said:

I found that my joystick had become intermittent after upgrading to 2.8. I thought it was a hardware problem but I called the company and they said that this was a known issue with 2.8 and told me to go to 2.81. I did that and the issue is back. Anyone else on this?

 

Hi,

 

Just when you think that everything is going perfectly,

 

Yes, just encountered this issue this afternoon and I have now reverted to v2.71 and everything works as it should.

 

The reason for my worry was that prior to v2.80, I had sent off my Helix for a repair to the Joystick which had a solder connection that had come adrift. When it returned from repair I installed v2.80 with no problems. This week I installed 2.81 and all was working fine until this emerged today.

 

As the Line 6 service engineers gave me a 3 month warranty on the repair, I needed to verify that this was not a repeat of the hardware problem. It seems that this is down to something in the 2.80 and the 2.81 firmware and all the usual reset procedures didn’t resolve the buggy Joystick.

 

Downgrade to earlier firmware fixes this.

 

Description; of bug:

While using the Joystick to select a block it would function normally in “jog mode”, but when you “press down to click select” It doesn’t always respond. Makes preset creation very difficult using only the Helix hardware.

[rwinking]

Yep, that is it....if I want to open up a block it takes about ten tries to get it to work Once I get to the choices (I.e. amp, cab, Distortion, etc.) it works fine. I have not called them back yet. I had the problem in 2.8 and he told me that 2.81 would fix it. I would rather not go back to 2.7 but may have to. Like you, I thought something was wrong with the joystick. It was good to hear that it was a software issue at least. Check out my other post about clipping in 4CM. That also started with 2.8 but could just be coincidental.....

[rd2rk]

OK, I'm confused. I'm on 2.81. I usually use HXEdit to create and mod presets. I guess I hadn't used the joystick for anything other than moving from one block to another to expose parameters since I don't really know when! So I just went over to my floor and tried it - all it would do was move from one block to another, pressing it wouldn't take me to the model list! Then I went to Globals and at the end of the Preferences section there's a Joystick Encoder setting - I never noticed this before. Is this new? It presents a choice between Model and Selection. It was on Selection. I switched it to Model and all was as it should be, same as it ever was. Using the arrows switches blocks, pressing it takes you to the Model list, turning it selects the next Model in the list. Pressing Actions and using the arrows moves the block. IOW, everything works the way it should.

 

Am I misunderstanding the problem?

[rwinking]

I’ll for sure try that when I get home. Are you saying that going into global and switching the joy stick encoder from Selection to Model fixed it? That is great if I am getting what you are saying.

[rd2rk]

12 minutes ago, rwinking said:

I’ll for sure try that when I get home. Are you saying that going into global and switching the joy stick encoder from Selection to Model fixed it? That is great if I am getting what you are saying.

 

Maybe. Your problem sounds different. I'm just saying that with that setting on Model, my joystick works the same way it always did.

[MonkeyXT]

... you might find that pressing and releasing the joystick push function quicker makes it act predictably - it seems to ignore 'long' presses since v2.8x, and 'long' isn't all that long either.

 

[rwinking]

I tried quick pushes as well as holding it and it just had a mind of it’s own.

[MusicLaw]

New Global setting option as of 2.80. 

 

The 2.80 RELEASE NOTES state:

Turn Joystick to Select Blocks

Helix Floor, Helix Rack, Helix LT

Currently, turning the joystick encoder scrolls through available models for the selected block. With 2.80, you can now choose to instead turn the joystick to quickly move across the signal flow.

From the Global Settings > Preferences menu, turn Knob 5 (Joystick Encoder) to choose “Model” or “Selection.”

“Model” remains the default.

SHORTCUT: Pressing and turning the joystick will provide the opposite setting; that is, when set to “Model”, press and turn the joystick to quickly move across the signal qow. When set to “Selection,” press and turn the joystick to scroll through available models for the selected block.

[HonestOpinion]

Maybe "joy"stick is not quite the right name for it :-)  Would be happy to see Line6 go to a recessed rotating dial surrounded by four recessed buttons in the next Helix iteration like the one Boss/Roland has used on some of its multi-effects and synths. Not only do I like the action better but it is pretty much flush with chassis so you don't have to worry that a tight fitting case might damage the soldering/assembly and disable the "joy"stick.

 

https://www.roland.com/us/products/gr-55/

[foxmeister]

 

 

 

 

2 hours ago, MusicLaw said:

From the Global Settings > Preferences menu, turn Knob 5 (Joystick Encoder) to choose “Model” or “Selection.”

“Model” remains the default.

 

To be fair, I think they got the last statement wrong!

When I initially updated to 2.80, I'm 99% certain that my LT was using "Selection", and I had to change it back to "Model".

[datacommando]

10 hours ago, MusicLaw said:

New Global setting option as of 2.80. 

 

The 2.80 RELEASE NOTES state:

 Turn Joystick to Select Blocks

 

Hi,

 

I was well aware of this change before I updated my Firmware. Someone had shown me a video of the fast scroll across the signal flow blocks while my Helix was away for a physical repair to the Joystick. What a novelty, I could hardly wait for mine to come back from the Service Engineer.

 

I had been running through a lot of stuff for the first couple of days after installing 2.81 and didn’t notice any weirdness. Then this not responding to “click, select” came from out of nowhere. Bizarre. Multiple, reboots and resets changed nothing so I thought it could be that the hardware was damaged and regressed to 2.71 to check - all was as it should be. Good - no need to ship it back to the Service Centre.

 

Now I am going to reinstall 2.81 and check out the thing again following the advice given above by MonkeyXT. This time I’ll  try not to be as ham fisted with the encoder.

 

I’ll report back later.

 

 

EDIT:

Update 3 hours later - BTW That's not how long it took, I had to do something else first.

Simple reinstall of v2.81 seem to have squashed the "bug". I specify "BUG" because this phenomena sprang from nowhere. Things had been working just fine for a couple of days then - Joystick encoder malfunction! My main worry was that it was a hardware failure again. I now have it working, as it should, in both modes and I don't think my "Press, Click to Select" technique has been modified in any way. I will see how it works out from here.

 

Extra special thanks to MonkeyXT for the tip. 

Edited August 9, 2019 by datacommando
Mark this as SOLVED! for me, at least for the time being.

[datacommando]

11 hours ago, MonkeyXT said:

... you might find that pressing and releasing the joystick push function quicker makes it act predictably - it seems to ignore 'long' presses since v2.8x, and 'long' isn't all that long either.

 

 

Thanks MonkeyXT,

 

See update note above.

[jpdennis]

3 hours ago, datacommando said:

 

Hi,

 

I was well aware of this change before I updated my Firmware. Someone had shown me a video of the fast scroll across the signal flow blocks while my Helix was away for a physical repair to the Joystick. What a novelty, I could hardly wait for mine to come back from the Service Engineer.

 

I had been running through a lot of stuff for the first couple of days after installing 2.81 and didn’t notice any weirdness. Then this not responding to “click, select” came from out of nowhere. Bizarre. Multiple, reboots and resets changed nothing so I thought it could be that the hardware was damaged and regressed to 2.71 to check - all was as it should be. Good - no need to ship it back to the Service Centre.

 

Now I am going to reinstall 2.81 and check out the thing again following the advice given above by MonkeyXT. This time I’ll  try not to be as ham fisted with the encoder.

 

I’ll report back later.

After a complete restore from Backup I resolved this by powering off, FS10-FS11 "Upgrade to latest format" then going into Global settings and changing the behavior to "Model", use it once, change back to "Selection", use it once, then shutdown and turn on again.  If it appears again I am going to try MonkeyXT's suggestion as well.

[datacommando]

40 minutes ago, jpdennis said:

After a complete restore from Backup I resolved this by powering off, FS10-FS11 "Upgrade to latest format" then going into Global settings and changing the behavior to "Model", use it once, change back to "Selection", use it once, then shutdown and turn on again.  If it appears again I am going to try MonkeyXT's suggestion as well.

 

Hi,

 

As I noted previously, I spent most of yesterday afternoon going through every reboot/reset combination on the list. Plus I had done the "Upgrade existing presets to latest format" soon after getting the firmware installed and everything had been working perfectly until this Joystick thing manifested itself. The main worry for me was that the malfunction could have been a hardware failure, especially since it had only recently undergone a repair to a solder joint on the Joystick encoder.

 

Once I had regressed to v2.71, I then knew it was not a hardware issue, phew, relief! My next plan of action would have been to re-install the latest firmware and see if the problem persists. So far, luckily it seems to be working fine once more. 

 

MonkeyXT's tip is worth knowing, although I am not certain that my touch on the encoder is any heavier or lighter, I'm just happy it works - for how long, who knows?

[rwinking]

On 8/8/2019 at 5:22 PM, rd2rk said:

When you called them back and told them that you still had the issue, what did they say?

They said they were well aware of the issue and that updating to 2.8.1 would fix it. It did not....

[rd2rk]

33 minutes ago, rwinking said:

They said they were well aware of the issue and that updating to 2.8.1 would fix it. It did not....

 

You should let them know that it didn't fix it. Like I said earlier, I don't now, nor have I ever, had joystick problems, though apparently I'm just lucky? Other than the 2.8.1 update (or could've been 2.8) setting that encoder global to Selection, I've had no problems.

 

Do let us know what they say when you tell them it's not fixed.

[krapo]

Hi, i bought and got a brand Helix 15 days ago. I played a little bit with it just after unboxing. 

Perfect but 2.30 version, so i updated to 2.81 and everything was working fine.

 

Then i tried to program using the joystick. It was working 1 time on 5...

I checked the forum and saw it was a known issue for years and it was a mecanic problem.

 

I call the shop to explain the problem and they asked me to return (2 days old unit...).

 

Today they told me I just had to reset the Helix (what they did) and everything is ok now.

They will send me back my Helix reseted.

 

You think it's ok ?

 

Thanks

 

 

[datacommando]

38 minutes ago, krapo said:

You think it's ok ?

 

Hi,

 

Yes, I think it will be O.K. now.

 

I had that problem back on August 9th, a reinstall and full reset seems to have fixed the issue and since then it is used every day and works perfectly.

 

If it is a hardware problem you can simply have the unit replaced under warranty, but the dealer must be happy with the reset fix.

 

Try it and see how it goes.

[krapo]

Thx, i'll only get back in 2 weeks...

 

[krapo]

Hi, just got back my Helix from the shop today.

 

They told me there was no problem and they just made reset.

 

But I was very desapointed because (after 2 weeks lost) the problem was not fixed...

 

Finally i tried MonkeyXT's recommandation, "pushing the joystick quickly", and it looks ok until now.

 

Thanks

[JOHNNYCORTESE]

Hi I have a helix rack version 2.81 and bought in October , everything was fine now joy stick encoder when pushing in can’t pull models,contacted  line 6 , tried pushing fast slow andwent in to preferences and changed selection  , nothing . Line 6 gave me many different solutions,now saying down load version 2.9 . I use this on live gigs so my local repair shop will look at but I had to get another as back up.I am new to this was a avid pedal board user and previous axe fx , sold my pedal board love the sounds but anyone have the same problem and how was the outcome NEED HELP !

[spikey]

58 minutes ago, JOHNNYCORTESE said:

Hi I have a helix rack version 2.81 and bought in October

 

Why have you not tried the update? If it's software (doubtful to me it is at this point) then an update may fix it. 

 

Just an FYI and I am not accusing you of anything so dont take this the wrong way. This joystick is NOT like the lug-nuts on your car wheels, as in you can not be forceful with this item or you will break it. Very light touch is all this needs to function correctly, so put away that "3-pound hammer" technic when adjusting. ; ) 

 

If that does not work, You may need that piece of hardware (the joy stick) replaced. Discuss this issue about sending it in with Line-6, via another ticket and look for a backup for your live stuff in the mean time.

 

 

[datacommando]

21 hours ago, JOHNNYCORTESE said:

Hi I have a helix rack version 2.81 and bought in October

The best advice would be to update your firmware to 2.91.

 

As noted in many of the posts above, lots of users found issues with the joystick which were due to a slight change with v2.8x in how it responded to the users touch. Some even reverted to an earlier firmware and everything worked as expected, so it was shown not to be a hardware fault. 
 

This quote from MonkeyXT states:

 

”... you might find that pressing and releasing the joystick push function quicker makes it act predictably - it seems to ignore 'long' presses since v2.8x, and 'long' isn't all that long either.”

 

If you do the update to the latest firmware and it doesn’t fix the joystick then it may well be a hardware problem (some joysticks needed to be re-soldered on the tags), which can be solved easily and quickly.

 

Eliminate the obvious things first.

 

Hope this helps/makes sense.

[JOHNNYCORTESE]

Will do update  ,and I don’t push the encoder in hard, I have never done a up load yet but will ,and if doesn’t work I have a local shop that does warranty work for line 6. Contacted line 6 they said same thing ,but think it’s a hardware problem , I did buy another helix rack for my other amp setup and back up coming soon. Was curious if anyone has had the problem and what the end fix was though?

[datacommando]

20 hours ago, JOHNNYCORTESE said:

Was curious if anyone has had the problem and what the end fix was though?

Well, I guess that was covered in the previous replies posted in the thread, which were, a bug/change in the firmware v2.8x caused an issue where the joystick didn’t work like expected or, the joystick tags needed to be re-soldered or hardware failure. Updated firmware fixed one problem and a soldering iron fixed the other two.  Can’t think there is anything else.

[JOHNNYCORTESE]

On 5/14/2020 at 9:40 AM, spikey said:

 

Why have you not tried the update? If it's software (doubtful to me it is at this point) then an update may fix it. 

 

Just an FYI and I am not accusing you of anything so dont take this the wrong way. This joystick is NOT like the lug-nuts on your car wheels, as in you can not be forceful with this item or you will break it. Very light touch is all this needs to function correctly, so put away that "3-pound hammer" technic when adjusting. ; ) 

 

If that does not work, You may need that piece of hardware (the joy stick) replaced. Discuss this issue about sending it in with Line-6, via another ticket and look for a backup for your live stuff in the mean time.

 

 

 

[JOHNNYCORTESE]

Updated to new version 2.92 the latest, and new driver to do so, nothing joy stick encoder still unable to get models when pushing in .i am extremely gentle using my equipment also , will bring to line 6 warranty repair shop, also purchased a second helix rack till it’s fixed.

love the line 6 just wished it was made as good as Fractual  audio in the USA .

[JOHNNYCORTESE]

Just got helix rack unit back , encoder joystick was a solder repair , now able to access models. New problem volume output up and down ,like a bad cord. All connections and cables good . Every preset what now? Update version 2.92 again . I don’t believe in coincidences back to shop , unbelievable, jut returned second unit , should not have all these issues Help again .

[datacommando]

2 hours ago, JOHNNYCORTESE said:

New problem volume output up and down ,like a bad cord. All connections and cables good . Every preset what now? Update version 2.92 again

Hi,

 

I would check the Global settings then try a re-install of the latest firmware and see if that fixes it. 
 

There were reports of strange things happening with the large volume knob malfunctioning on v2.9 and it was suggested that rebooting the unit 2 or 3 times seemed to fix it.

 

One suggestion from Digital Igloo says to reboot and do not touch any thing for 30 second and it should work, but this should have been fixed properly in the v2.91 hotfix update.

 

Check it all here:

 

https://line6.com/support/topic/16083-helix-bug-reports/page/46/

 

Hope this helps/makes sense.

 

[spikey]

5 hours ago, JOHNNYCORTESE said:

Just got helix rack unit back , encoder joystick was a solder repair , now able to access models. New problem volume output up and down ,like a bad cord. All connections and cables good .

 

Volume issues should be pretty easy to spot right off.

 

Johnnycortese, was this volume issue broken before, or after it was sent in for repair? Why does that matter? It matters because "IF" this issue sprang up after "hardware" was changed out/replaced in your Helix,  then QA didn't do their job in checking out "everything" out before shipping it back to your doorstep. Granted we all make mistakes occasionally, but either way it should have been spotted, and you are right in that you should not have all these issues after getting it repaired by an authorized Line-6 repair shop. Best of luck in getting it back all ok next time! 

[moonshine2015]

On 8/9/2019 at 2:03 AM, rwinking said:

I’ll for sure try that when I get home. Are you saying that going into global and switching the joy stick encoder from Selection to Model fixed it? That is great if I am getting what you are saying.

Going into the settings to change them doesn’t work, since I updated my Rack last night (Dec1st 2020 v 3) my Jog wheel does NOT function for scrolling or Clicking into parameters.

not happy with this happening , only had 3 hours use from this Rack since purchase 3 weeks ago.

[datacommando]

28 minutes ago, moonshine2015 said:

Going into the settings to change them doesn’t work, since I updated my Rack last night (Dec1st 2020 v 3) my Jog wheel does NOT function for scrolling or Clicking into parameters.

not happy with this happening , only had 3 hours use from this Rack since purchase 3 weeks ago.

Hi,
 

 See my reply to the post you made here: