Is there any way to get the Variax electronics installed in other guitars

[arislaf]

What i would like to see is a 700 with HX technology and NO pickups. Untill then I enjoy my 69s.

 

https://1drv.ms/u/s!AugMNUffMM-8iFlOJ7R4TRjMVMRX

 

https://1drv.ms/u/s!AugMNUffMM-8jB2exbJn9xhVppb8

[soundog]

For https://1drv.ms/u/s!AugMNUffMM-8jB2exbJn9xhVppb8 could you just remove the pickups, and then custom cut a new pick guard without the pickup holes?

[romdos]

On 4/3/2019 at 3:04 PM, jerseyboy said:

I work with 2qty 59’s and they’re heavy but still lighter than a late 70’s Led Paul black beauty.  15lbs?  Is that verified on a scale?  

 

I do believe JTV59’s chambered (not sure - someone knows).  Gotta remember the beefy bridge, electronics and battery pack weigh something more than perhaps the wood removed to house all the electronics?  

 

Pretty sure the neck is Maple as my finish wears off reveals bright wood under there.  

 

Out of warranty thing to do of course but if you’re game, give it a go!  

 

Photos of the carnage and results please!  

When I wrote the post I guesstimated at 15 lbs but now it is verified at 11 lbs, while my 1980 LP custom is 10.4 lbs.  My Gibson 2010 LP standard weighs in at 8.8 lbs.

I can't imagine it's chambered at that weight but it is a very good point you're making about the hardware and electronics though.  Looking at the back of the JTV most of it is routed for the electronics so that could be the extra weight.  It might bump an Epiphone up into the same range or even heavier. 

 

I also don't like the fat neck and those speed bumps they call frets.  (My '80 LP has spoiled me on those low frets)

 

I bought my JTV on eBay so it's probably not under warrantee at this point anyway.  I'm not that worried about messing up the Epiphone - those are a dime a dozen.  I'm afraid of messing up the JTV electronics!.  But it's not like I'm planning on altering the electronics.  I'm just going to hopefully take out a bunch of screws to get it out.  My main concern is the bridge - stud spacing, etc.  If I use that wide Variax bridge then it might look weird with a tailpiece so close to it. 

 

Since I hate the neck the most, it might be less work to just rework the JTV and put in some wide, low frets and sand down the neck a bit for a better feel.  Thanks for the thoughtful response!

[jerseyboy]

1st Variax 500 I bought used and absolutely hated the neck. Felt like a ball bat where I prefer thinner boat V hulls.  And the finish fretwork was absolutely hideous.  

 

I proceeded to sand the neck more to my liking along with a nice level, dress & polish.  It’s now one of my old “faithful” playing guitars.  

 

Now I like tall frets saves my fingertips from contacting fretboard.  If I desired lower frets I’d merely level and dress JTV down more like LPs I’ve had over the decades.  

 

Later bought another used 500 (but newer) and that neck wasn’t anything like the 1st guitar.  Much thinner neck and slightly better fretwork.  Still better with a D&P.  

 

I snagged used 2013 JTV59 in 2017 and while it’s chunky I never felt compelled to break out the 80 grit.  However I’ve dulled and worn the finish off backside of neck and it appears to Maple.  Very bright looks nothing like Mahogany that’s for sure. 

 

My feeling if someone has the skills to rework an axe to their liking - go for it.  

 

That goofy slotted 59 bridge is much easier to change strings with locking tuner upgrade.  

 

Good luck!

[pir8matt]

Hello, finally getting the variax bug after seeing the capabilities it has. However, I'm a big Floyd Rose guy. I know the 89F has a Floyd on it, but I really like the look of the 69 better. 

 

Since there is a Floyd Rose system available on the 89F, is it possible to get the ghost saddles used with that guitar and replace the standard trem on the 69 with a Floyd? I'm aware that represents a good amount of surgery, but I have a good luthier local to me, and I'm confident he'd be able to handle the conversion. 

If it's not feasible I guess I'll just go with the 89F, but I thought I'd ask here first. 

 

Thanks! 

[cruisinon2]

48 minutes ago, pir8matt said:

Hello, finally getting the variax bug after seeing the capabilities it has. However, I'm a big Floyd Rose guy. I know the 89F has a Floyd on it, but I really like the look of the 69 better. 

 

Since there is a Floyd Rose system available on the 89F, is it possible to get the ghost saddles used with that guitar and replace the standard trem on the 69 with a Floyd? I'm aware that represents a good amount of surgery, but I have a good luthier local to me, and I'm confident he'd be able to handle the conversion. 

If it's not feasible I guess I'll just go with the 89F, but I thought I'd ask here first. 

 

Thanks! 

 

Routing for a Floyd removes a lot of wood... on the back of the 69, directly behind the bridge cavity, is a big plastic box where all the "brains" live. I'm not saying it's impossible, but it will be difficult.... and you may end up with a $1000 donation to the toothpick factory. Save yourself a whole lot of grief, not to mention money, and just go with the 89.

[pir8matt]

4 minutes ago, cruisinon2 said:

 

Routing for a Floyd removes a lot of wood... on the back of the 69, directly behind the bridge cavity, is a big plastic box where all the "brains" live. I'm not saying it's impossible, but it might be. You'll save yourself a whole lot of grief, not to mention money, if you just go with the 89.

Thanks, I was actually just coming back to post this: 

 

http://www.graphtech.com/products/product-detail/pn-0080-c0-ghost-lb63-floyd-rose-style-bridge---chrome?id=d38d9e98-0c8a-44db-93ee-19ef29cd030a

 

The 89 uses a graphtech licensed FR, so Im thinking this is the same bridge, and thats what I would probably try to replace it with. 

 

A bandmate of mine has a 69, and Im gonna borrow it to have my luthier check it out. I hadn't considered the cavity on the 69 though, so the trem on that guitar is strictly top mounted? No springs through the body? 

[cruisinon2]

5 minutes ago, pir8matt said:

Thanks, I was actually just coming back to post this: 

 

http://www.graphtech.com/products/product-detail/pn-0080-c0-ghost-lb63-floyd-rose-style-bridge---chrome?id=d38d9e98-0c8a-44db-93ee-19ef29cd030a

 

The 89 uses a graphtech licensed FR, so Im thinking this is the same bridge, and thats what I would probably try to replace it with. 

 

A bandmate of mine has a 69, and Im gonna borrow it to have my luthier check it out. I hadn't considered the cavity on the 69 though, so the trem on that guitar is strictly top mounted? No springs through the body? 

 

No, the are springs... same as any  Strat style 2-point floating bridge. Like Wilkinson, etc...

 

And that bridge in the pic is definitely not the same bridge that's on the 89...

[pir8matt]

13 minutes ago, cruisinon2 said:

 

No, the are springs... same as any  Strat style 2-point floating bridge. Like Wilkinson, etc...

 

And that bridge in the pic is definitely not the same bridge that's on the 89...

 

The one on the 89 is black, for sure, but graphtech offers that bridge in chrome and gold as well. I'm not saying I know for sure thats the right bridge, but from what I can see of the spec for the 89, its a graphtech FR with string saver saddles and piezos, which is what the LB63 is. Unless graphtech makes a specific unit exclusive to Line 6, I would think that's it. I've been wrong before, though. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

 

 

[brue58ski]

6 minutes ago, pir8matt said:

 

The one on the 89 is black, for sure, but graphtech offers that bridge in chrome and gold as well. I'm not saying I know for sure thats the right bridge, but from what I can see of the spec for the 89, its a graphtech FR with string saver saddles and piezos, which is what the LB63 is. Unless graphtech makes a specific unit exclusive to Line 6, I would think that's it. I've been wrong before, though. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

 

 

 

I actually asked Graphtech about this and this was their response

 

1) Yes, the bridge on your JTV 89F is one of our PN-0080-B0 ghost bridges

2) Yes, the saddles on this bridge are of the PN-0080-B6 variety

3) You can purchase the entire saddle (the price would be pro-rated) or simply the inserts themselves. 

4) We don't have printed instructions for this process but I can spell them out very easily. 

 

If an order interests you, please provide a complete shipping address and I will generate a sales quote for your evaluation.

[pir8matt]

5 minutes ago, brue58ski said:

 

I actually asked Graphtech about this and this was their response

 

1) Yes, the bridge on your JTV 89F is one of our PN-0080-B0 ghost bridges

2) Yes, the saddles on this bridge are of the PN-0080-B6 variety

3) You can purchase the entire saddle (the price would be pro-rated) or simply the inserts themselves. 

4) We don't have printed instructions for this process but I can spell them out very easily. 

 

If an order interests you, please provide a complete shipping address and I will generate a sales quote for your evaluation.

 

Well thats neat, so yeah it looks like the part number for the chrome one just varies from B to C (black vs chrome). 

 

That's good to know. I'll let my luthier get eyes on an actual 69 to see if its feasible. I know it probably seems kind of pointless to some, but I don't mind doing a little extra work to get what I want. I'll probably buy an 89 anyway just to get up and running on the Variax thing. I always need two guitars for gigging anyway (full-time cover band guy). 

 

Thanks for the responses! 

[cruisinon2]

32 minutes ago, pir8matt said:

 

The one on the 89 is black, for sure, but graphtech offers that bridge in chrome and gold as well. I'm not saying I know for sure thats the right bridge, but from what I can see of the spec for the 89, its a graphtech FR with string saver saddles and piezos, which is what the LB63 is. Unless graphtech makes a specific unit exclusive to Line 6, I would think that's it. I've been wrong before, though. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

 

 

 

OK, maybe it is then...I played one some time ago, and thought it looked like a slightly different design, but who knows? 

[burningyen]

On 4/3/2019 at 4:23 PM, burningyen said:

I have a Variax Standard transplant project in the works. I have the cavities designed, but Fusion360-to-SVG file conversion issues are stopping me from loading them into my CNC at the moment. I'll let you know if I ever get to the finish line successfully.

 

The intended recipient guitar:

 

 

After months of programming and file import errors, finally got this going again. First, a test cut to make sure I have a good handle on the Shaper Origin. Workspace mapped and the PCB cavity placed on a piece of scrap pine:

A few passes to get the deepest layer roughed out:

And a pass for the outer perimeter:

Testing the PCB fit:

Next two layers:

Testing the cavity cover fit:

The test cuts worked, so now for the real deal:

Point of no return. Engraved the cavity cover outline so I don't have to worry about the finish chipping:

Many passes later:

I don't have quite the right touch with this thing yet. You can see burn marks where I was too slow and some jitter in the lip outline where I was too fast:

Testing the fit:

Hope I have another update before another 11 months pass.

[cruisinon2]

Perhaps this is stupid question... but what's with the domino strips all over everything?

[burningyen]

29 minutes ago, cruisinon2 said:

Perhaps this is stupid question... but what's with the domino strips all over everything?

Not stupid question. I'm using a Shaper Origin, which is a handheld CNC machine that sees where it is on the workspace based on the domino strips and moves the cutter accordingly. So I slide the Origin around the piece and it drops, lifts or moves the cutter sideways to autocorrect for my movements.

[cruisinon2]

2 hours ago, burningyen said:

Not stupid question. I'm using a Shaper Origin, which is a handheld CNC machine that sees where it is on the workspace based on the domino strips and moves the cutter accordingly. So I slide the Origin around the piece and it drops, lifts or moves the cutter sideways to autocorrect for my movements.

 

Ahh...interesting. Learn something new every day, lol. Good luck with the project!

[burningyen]

Yay, less than a month between updates! Widened the output cavity for the VDI and 1/4" jacks the caveman way, with a drill, hammer and chisel:

 

 

Rather than spend hours designing the top cavity expansion on my Mac I actually drew it freehand right on the Shaper Origin screen, just a polygon with a couple of round corners.

 

[burningyen]

Control plate sketched out:

 

[tonypearce]

I’m so glad I’m not alone in making a JTV transplant guitar.

 

This work is amazing!
 

I’m taking the easy way with a 335 body using the JTV 59 as the donor.

 

[burningyen]

Made progress on the control plate:

 

 

Next I have to sand and prep for chrome plating, then it's time to cut and bend the output jack plate.

[tonypearce]

This is great work!

 

I'm going to be transplanting my JTV59 into a 335 body soon.

 

I'm aware it'll sound different (nothing that the Helix can't fix or at least improve). Is there a guide anyone can point me towards or is just trawling the forums the way to go?

 

 

[burningyen]

30 minutes ago, tonypearce said:

This is great work!

 

I'm going to be transplanting my JTV59 into a 335 body soon.

 

I'm aware it'll sound different (nothing that the Helix can't fix or at least improve). Is there a guide anyone can point me towards or is just trawling the forums the way to go?

If you find a guide please let me know! I’m just feeling my way through this. But I did make progress on the control and jack plates:

 

 

Now I’m working on the wiring. Prised the connector off the Standard bridge’s wires:

 

 

Currently hunting for the right crimp terminals to lock the Ghost wires into the connector:

 

[burningyen]

Terminals found and crimped. It was a hard-fought battle with the evil Mr. Crimper:

 

[jerseyboy]

Glad I poked my head in here.  That’s mad skill scientist stuff and then some!  Impressive and sure to be a sweetheart when finished.  

 

What did you source for connector contacts, JST?  I work with similar contacts and crimp tools from li-ion battery BMS kludging.  

[stoofer13]

This is the Variax Standard into Ibanez RG transplant I did with Graphtech Ghost floyd bridge. My problem - Variax Standard nut width is way too narrow for me.

 

I 3D printed router templates for the job and the new cavity covers I needed - I even routed the guitar so the output connectors don't stick out the side of the guitar (line 6, you should really do this, it's so much better than having a black plastic plate sticking out). I ditched the "surrounds" for the lit knobs and instead used a "fibre optic" glass tube from the LED up to the knob - I think it looks better.

 

The humbucker mags don't seem to cause me any problems, it's been like this for a long time, running with a Helix.

 

What I'd *really* like to do it move all the Variax "guts" to an external box so I can non-destructively add Variax to another Floyd guitar (a Washburn N4 in this case) so I'm looking into options for running the piezo wires long to a "Variax box" on the floor.

[burningyen]

2.5 years later, finally done with mine. Shielded:

 

Soldered:

 

Installed:

 

Lit:

 

Done:

[drryan]

burningyen, 

 

The finished conversion looks hot. What is the weight with battery? How does it play?

Is the Variax completely working ok? What is the recipient guitar you have?

 I have a jtv59 which I like but I prefer a Les I have. The jtv neck is a little narrow on me.

 

Would you do a conversion for someone else, and how much would you charge?

 

thx,

Dave Ryan 

 

[jerseyboy]

Nailed it!

[burningyen]

8 hours ago, drryan said:

burningyen, 

 

The finished conversion looks hot. What is the weight with battery? How does it play?

Is the Variax completely working ok? What is the recipient guitar you have?

 I have a jtv59 which I like but I prefer a Les I have. The jtv neck is a little narrow on me.

 

Would you do a conversion for someone else, and how much would you charge?

 

thx,

Dave Ryan 

 

Thanks, Dave! I had the battery cavity CAD file ready to go, but in the end realized I was never going to use a battery and would prefer to leave as much wood in the guitar as possible. I don't have a postal scale and haven't weighed the guitar yet, but I'm guessing it's ~7.5 lbs.

 

The recipient guitar is a B-Way Mercury Head (b-wayguitars.com). Since I make and sell these guitars, it would be self-serving for me to brag about how it plays, so I'll just say it plays well enough for me. :) I played it at a jam session this past Sunday, where I used the acoustic sims and alt tuning functions, and all the Variax stuff worked great.

 

I don't think I'll be doing these transplants other than for my own builds. I build for fun, and there's a lot about these conversions that isn't fun. There are techs out there who are more than qualified to do this kind of work. If you Google "Variax transplant" you'll come across a bunch of previous projects, and I bet most of the people who posted about them would tell you who handled their transplants.

[drryan]

Hi Ben,

I hadn’t seen your answers here before I asked basically the same questions in another thread of yours. Thx for the info.

Dave

[m6255]

I have done many conversions.. Because of family reasons, I haven’t done any in about 7 years. I finally got a building for a shop. I still have to set it up but I’ll hopefully get started before Christmas. Check with me then. Text 920-539-0447. I no longer have a website it was Markscustomguiars.com

[drryan]

Oyster,

have you done a jtv conversion? Or know of anyone who does this? I’m looking to transplant Jtv59 guts into an Epi les Paul.

It’s weird, there’s a guy in Germany, Costa Rica, Canada, but no pro luthiers in PA area that have done it or even know what I’m talking about. Thx Dave 

[burningyen]

5 hours ago, drryan said:

Oyster,

have you done a jtv conversion? Or know of anyone who does this? I’m looking to transplant Jtv59 guts into an Epi les Paul.

It’s weird, there’s a guy in Germany, Costa Rica, Canada, but no pro luthiers in PA area that have done it or even know what I’m talking about. Thx Dave 

In PA I’d ask Greg Platzer at BCR Music. Not sure if he would be interested, but he certainly has the skills.

[psarkissian]

This is a mixed signal device, so whoever does the work will have to know about grounding a

mixed signal circuitry or there may be problems.

[m6255]

Sure, purchase a used Line 6 Standard, ( I can’t believe they stopped making/selling the standard. I own many Variax guitars and basses, that’s because I’m a luthier and befor line T was installing magnetic pickups, I was building the Variax electronics into Les Paul clones and PRs clones, right off the bat because used Variax standards are no longer commercially sold, you’ll have to look on eBay or reverb and expect to pay close to a grand for one. By the way everyone has their opinions but of all the Variax guitars I’ve ever bought I like the actual standard the best. One reason is it’s based on the Yamaha Pacifica. I love the neck, the body is a tad smaller than a Strat although you’re limited to black, off white and tobacco sunburst. The other thing is if you want one custom built, consider 1 will you keep it? 2 do you plan to use a Variax friendly modeler like the Pod HD 500X or the Helix. Because those power the guitar as well as midi control. The only reason I brought that up is when I purchased my first standard, I had just finished a nice swamp ash strat body, I used to call StratovariX. Everything was going to line up and fit with no further routing EXCEPT. If you have a Variax standard you notice your missing something/ the belly cut in the back. Why? Because if you hog out that much wood you’ll have no room for the battery. For me, I installed a line 6 Variax 700 into a Gibson Les Paul Double cut. A 3k dollar guitar. Line 6 has one main thing over me that I can’t do. Electronics engineering. I have no idea how to make the magnetic pickups share the digital system pots switches. With the standard you can use the mag pickups in one stereo channel and the Variax in a second. You can do that with my Les Paul, but that’s because I literally have the comp,etc set of variax knobs along with the Les Paul knobs along with micro switches . I live the guitar but I hate all the knobs. I used as many double pots as possible but a couple years later when I bought my first variax standard, I was blown away with the minimum of knobs.  Cirrently on my second variax standard I want to replace the magnetic pickups wit a set of 3 Seymour Duncan JR jr strat sized humbucker. I fell in love with the bridge pickup after installing one in a clients guitar. The standards mag pickups aren’t horrible, they have some tone but they are a bit thin even for a single coil. I already changed the mag pickups out of my first standard, I installed a 300 dollar set of Raw Vintage 60s strat pickuox. Huge improvement.  I wanted a pickup set with mini humbucker, the JR jr set in both single coil size and humbucker size is famous. The humbuckers been around since the 7ps, the JB sysnds for Jeff Beck. Signature pickups. I was testing my clients guitar out after the upgrade in my LINE 6 DT 50 it just so happened to be set on the 4th position the Mesa Boogie Dusl Rectafier. I turned off standby and just did a couple hammer ones as I was strapping up. Omg, the sustain the ring the tone. Btw if you’ve never played a line 6 DT 25 or DT 50. Try it. I’ve been playing since the mid 60s, my first amp was a silver tome built into my guitar case, a tube amp, next a 63 black faced dual showman, a Ampeg V 4 double stack I 8 q2s man was that loud. They all had great tone, I had dozens of other amps too. U til one day after reading advertisement for the dream rig I bought a line 6 DT 50 head designed by Bogner. Since then I purchased another DT 50  212 there’s too many haters out their of line 6 partly their fault. This is the best sounding most versatile amp I’ve ever had, I will never sell them, my grand kids can if they want. YouTube search the line 6 DT 50 or DT 25, you won’t find a bad review. The case for the amp is 11 ply birch, an unmatched pair of Celestion speakers again designed / selected by Bogner, I never thought mixing speakers was smart, it just opened a huge pallet of tone, my 412 cabinet for my DT head is a Marshall cabinet with a quad of 1970s Celestion Green Backs, 25 watt ea, 16ohm a d I steD of 75 hrtz like e dry other speaker these are  55 nrtz, which give me rich clear lows and mids. I wouldent sell that cabinet for 2000. Dollars, oh it’s only a 100 wat cab, but check out the 70s Marshall Plexi cabinets same speaker with a 150 watt rms amp. They are the brown cream speakers. On eBay 70s greenbacks sell close to 300 ea or more.  I have a lot of guitar cans the green backs are the absolute best. Anyway, came on hoping to find someone who installed the JB Jr on a Variax standards, I can add other mini switches remember the 5 way switch controls all the Variax. Ideks too. 

[m6255]

Btw the small picture icon is of a wonderful clone of a Gibson double cut standard with a Variax 500 inside, a John Mann Tremolo, I love those, I may make a few more in the future but like someone else said, they are fun to do for your self, or if I build one from scratch, but I don’t like installing a Variax into someone’s PRS custom 24. I’m skilled and very cautious never work tired, plus if I ever make a mistake I’m pretty good at fixing it, something about the thought of a chip out of a top of a 10k guitar, naa I can’t handle it, but you might find some guys out there. I did do a few custom conversions but by the time the customer keeps making changes for free, I never made any money at it, for the pressure.