Make Your Variax Sound 100% Better

[katiekerry]

Well recently in another discussion I ran across an Idea to help eleviate some of the sympathetic resonance that occurs with the variax guitar.Link here http://line6.com/support/message/485558#485558  (quite amplified do to the Full Range of the Variax and HD500 capability's).  I expanded on his Idea and chose to add vibration relief on the Bridge also.  (there are pictures showing what I did on the other discussion).  I wanted to express my extreme satisfaction in the results I am getting.  Over the last few days of practice I am amazed at the sound quality of the modeling. (greatly improved I think from the lack of sound artifacts being modeled along with what I was playing).  Also the quality of the alternative tunings I used to never use the 12 string models cause I thought they sounded terrible at times especially tuned down.  Now they sound phenomenal no warble sounds, just true to what I was playing.  I am not kidding I sat for about an hour going through the different models and tunings amazed at how great they sounded.  ( the last time I was ever impressed by a piece of gear was about 16 years ago I bought a 5150 combo and fell in love with tube distortion, just loved the sound of it.) made me enjoy playing.  I am hoping that others try this technique and have the same results (Truely I do)..  Thanks for Others in these forums that have always been helpful for me...

[silverhead]

Thanks for posting this. I remember seeing your double-ended fixit in the other post and thought it was very creative. I can't say I have really noticed the artifacts, but your comments here and the previous comments make me want to try out your technique especially on the 12-string and acoustic models. Can't say when I'll get around to that but if I do I'll post my thoughts here. Interesting and simple modification in any case. Thanks.

[katiekerry]

I am actually hoping people try it out ( and it works for them as much as I thought it worked out for me). I just think the problem is there is a processor designed to model different guitars and tunings. But it doesn't take in concideration the physical guitar and its flaws or imperfections translating over to the models. No guitar design out there is perfect and they all suffer from nuances ( some likeable some not). But for a guitar that is trying to be many guitars it needs to be more of a Blank canvas not show character of its own. I feel by muting the strings in areas help accomplish that. I think also they need to create algorithms to help isolate and remove stuff like that, it has all that DSP put it to use. Also I think the bridge designed is flawed, it amplifies cross talk between strings. The way its just floating on two screws and not bolted directly to the body just amplifies the vibrations. Thanks though for the responce..

[pugdealer]

I always noticed a strange harmonic sound when playing the acoustic on my jtv-59. I had a jtv-69 before and used an elastic thing my wife has after the nut so it'd kill the ringing. I don't use it on the 59 cause I didn't feel the strings did the same ringing after the nut, and I assumed the warble and harmonics on the acoustic had to do with the variax part...now I'm very compelled to try that thing again after the nut and on the bridge too, though some of the piezos are sitting against the bridge...I'll change strings and try this double damping mod and let you know the outcome!

 

Thanks for sharing

[katiekerry]

Good luck I hope it yields Better than you expect results..

[spikey]

Interesting.... Thanks for the pics and link...

[Lurotex]

hi guys,

i have noticed that sometimes when i'm trying to make a personal tuning using the virtual capo solution on the Jtv69

it doesn't take always the notes i play on the string for all the six string so i have to restart several time since it understand

what i want.

this is what i'm doing.

 

Perhaps the solution you are suggesting in this topic could help to solve  this problem too?

 

bye

thanks

[jefflynyrd]

warble... warble... I'm going to try this fix, as I've noticed it too.

[jefflynyrd]

tried this 'fix' and didn't notice any difference. :/

[Ruttster]

I tried this and it really seemed to help tame some of those nasty high overtones on my JTV-89. Thanks for posting!

[katiekerry]

I tried this and it really seemed to help tame some of those nasty high overtones on my JTV-89. Thanks for posting!

Well i am stoked it helped I think for some it does and some it doesn't....  I never cared for all the funky vibrations I was getting on it ( it transfered to easlily throught the piezo pickups)..

[clay-man]

Well i am stoked it helped I think for some it does and some it doesn't....  I never cared for all the funky vibrations I was getting on it ( it transfered to easlily throught the piezo pickups)..

 

Remember, a piezo pickup pickups up the sound by EXACTLY that, physical vibrations, whereas a magnetic pickup captures the magnetic field in front of the pickup, which would be the strings in front of it.

 

It's why a piezo has to be in contact with the strings, hence why it's in the saddles since that's where the strings will physically sit.

 

The good thing about it is that you'll get killer sounding replications of guitars, the downside is a bit of sympathetic sounds can come through, so muting the sources of that is a smart idea.

[CBTL]

Has anyone tried this on the 69 at the bridge? The strings are recessed quite far inside the saddles and I can see how you could put a piece of Velcro across them? The only thing I can think of is individual heat shrink on each string?! Any thoughts

[snhirsch]

Has anyone tried this on the 69 at the bridge? The strings are recessed quite far inside the saddles and I can see how you could put a piece of Velcro across them? The only thing I can think of is individual heat shrink on each string?! Any thoughts

 

I remain unconvinced that the tiny length of string between ball end and bridge piece could possibly be affecting the sound of the JTV-69.  I reached in mine with a jewelers screwdriver and plucked them - absolutely nothing in terms of resonance.  If anything on a 69 is likely to produce unwanted vibration it would be the tremolo springs. 

 

The length between tuning machine and nut is a different story and there's a fair amount of anecdotal evidence to suggest it's worth trying a damper (made no difference on mine, but YMMV).

[katiekerry]

Has anyone tried this on the 69 at the bridge? The strings are recessed quite far inside the saddles and I can see how you could put a piece of Velcro across them? The only thing I can think of is individual heat shrink on each string?! Any thoughts

You might try it, ( the heat shrink thing) your only out a set of strings if it doesn't work...  If you feel you have problems with sympathetic resonances, try to look out side of the box.  Some people just don't notice it for me it drove me nuts..  In all actuality I felt putting the velcro on the bridge did more to cure the issue than behind the nut but each to their own.  Good luck though..

[guitarno]

Well recently in another discussion I ran across an Idea to help eleviate some of the sympathetic resonance that occurs with the variax guitar.Link here http://line6.com/support/message/485558#485558  (quite amplified do to the Full Range of the Variax and HD500 capability's).  I expanded on his Idea and chose to add vibration relief on the Bridge also.  (there are pictures showing what I did on the other discussion).  I wanted to express my extreme satisfaction in the results I am getting.  Over the last few days of practice I am amazed at the sound quality of the modeling. (greatly improved I think from the lack of sound artifacts being modeled along with what I was playing).  Also the quality of the alternative tunings I used to never use the 12 string models cause I thought they sounded terrible at times especially tuned down.  Now they sound phenomenal no warble sounds, just true to what I was playing.  I am not kidding I sat for about an hour going through the different models and tunings amazed at how great they sounded.  ( the last time I was ever impressed by a piece of gear was about 16 years ago I bought a 5150 combo and fell in love with tube distortion, just loved the sound of it.) made me enjoy playing.  I am hoping that others try this technique and have the same results (Truely I do)..  Thanks for Others in these forums that have always been helpful for me...

Hi,

 

   I'm very interested in what you did to the bridge to decrease resonances, but it looks like the link to the other post is broken now. Can you re-post that info here?

 

Thanks!

[johnnyayyy]

Hi,

 

   I'm very interested in what you did to the bridge to decrease resonances, but it looks like the link to the other post is broken now. Can you re-post that info here?

 

Thanks!

 

It was a narrow strip of Velcro (the soft fuzzy part) stuck between the saddles and the string slots.

 

See the first pic shown here: https://www.google.com/search?q=variax+bridge+velcro&client=firefox-a&hs=ydG&rls=org.mozilla:en-US:official&source=lnms&tbm=isch&sa=X&ei=b_ZSUsPbL43jigKciYHACw&ved=0CAkQ_AUoAQ&biw=1280&bih=587&dpr=1#imgdii=_

[guitarno]

    Excellent, Thanks!  :D  I have to re-string my 59 - I'll probably try putting on 11's as this was also recommended for improving the acoustic models which I am using a lot. I think I will try this when I put the fresh strings on. I used to use a VG-99 with a Godin LGX-SA, and I had a similar problem and solution. On the LGX-SA, the strings taper down to the body behind the bridge, and go through the body to the back side. That leaves short lengths of all 6 strings behind the bridge, and when driving the VG-99, the piezos were very sensitive to any extraneous vibrations. I used to put a thin strip of rubber under the strings behind the bridge to dampen those vibrations, and it really did seem to help.

 

 

    I have also recently see references to a little clamp that is available (I forget what it was called) to put above the nut, in front of the tuning pegs to do the same function. I may look into putting something on that end too, just to see if it makes a difference.

 

Thanks again! B)

[diggerbarnz]

Well recently in another discussion I ran across an Idea to help eleviate some of the sympathetic resonance that occurs with the variax guitar.Link here http://line6.com/support/message/485558#485558  (quite amplified do to the Full Range of the Variax and HD500 capability's).  I expanded on his Idea and chose to add vibration relief on the Bridge also.  (there are pictures showing what I did on the other discussion).  I wanted to express my extreme satisfaction in the results I am getting.  Over the last few days of practice I am amazed at the sound quality of the modeling. (greatly improved I think from the lack of sound artifacts being modeled along with what I was playing).  Also the quality of the alternative tunings I used to never use the 12 string models cause I thought they sounded terrible at times especially tuned down.  Now they sound phenomenal no warble sounds, just true to what I was playing.  I am not kidding I sat for about an hour going through the different models and tunings amazed at how great they sounded.  ( the last time I was ever impressed by a piece of gear was about 16 years ago I bought a 5150 combo and fell in love with tube distortion, just loved the sound of it.) made me enjoy playing.  I am hoping that others try this technique and have the same results (Truely I do)..  Thanks for Others in these forums that have always been helpful for me...

links a dead end...would like to see WHAT to do w/69 bridge if ya can fix link

[sacapuntas]

Hi all

could you please provide this tip again as it is not anymore accessible?

Thnx

Sacapuntas

[jpmull]

Hi all

could you please provide this tip again as it is not anymore accessible?

Thnx

Sacapuntas

Try this video.

 

I think it explains the tip discussed above.

[jpmull]

Here is the link. Sorry!

 

[stefanlindmark]

Or clip on a rubber pick holder or two. They will also serve a double purpose as pick holders  :) 
http://www.thomann.de/gb/harley_benton_hb_a10c_pick_holder.htm
 

Photo attached

[sacapuntas]

That's amazing. THanks guys - you made my day. It was never so easy to get rid of a real annoying problem.

 

Rock on

Sacapuntas

[daedae]

links a dead end...would like to see WHAT to do w/69 bridge if ya can fix link

I think this video is what you're looking for, on a JTV69:

[guitarno]

I remain unconvinced that the tiny length of string between ball end and bridge piece could possibly be affecting the sound of the JTV-69.  I reached in mine with a jewelers screwdriver and plucked them - absolutely nothing in terms of resonance.  If anything on a 69 is likely to produce unwanted vibration it would be the tremolo springs. 

 

The length between tuning machine and nut is a different story and there's a fair amount of anecdotal evidence to suggest it's worth trying a damper (made no difference on mine, but YMMV).

 

   I know what you mean. I went home to re string my 59 and the length of strings between the ball ends & the bridge saddles is very short, and for the most part, tight up against the curved surface of the bridge, so it seems unlikely that they are producing any significant resonance. Still, the OP says it made a big difference, so there must be some reason it did. I did re string and put a Velcro strip there as described, but I haven't had even a minute yet to test it.

 

   Years ago I ran across a posting describing a modification done to a Godin LGX-SA to alleviate issues with the piezos on that guitar, when driving a VG guitar synth. In that case, the poster built a thin stepped strip that fit right behind the piezos in the bridge. His take on the issue with the piezos on the LGX-SA was that the piezo's were being driven too hard due to the geometry of the bridge design, and that changing the angle that the strings contacted the piezo's reduced the pressure on them and prevented or reduced microphonics and extraneous noise. He was not trying to eliminate string resonance, just changing the angle of the strings hitting the piezo elements.

 

   He also claimed it made a huge difference on that guitar. Maybe there are other dynamics at play other than string resonance on the JTV wraparound bridge. I installed the Velcro strip on my 59 and I will have to spend a few days to see if it makes any noticeable difference for me. Unfortunately, I’m out of town for a few days, and might not get much time before I leave. If it does work, it's a pretty cheap and easy fix. If not, nothing lost but a few minutes of my time.

[katiekerry]

photo

[katiekerry]

head stock

[katiekerry]

I posted the two pictures from before,  Basically all I did was purchased some heavy duty adhesive Velcro.  Cut it about a 1/8th of an inch wide for the bridge and placed it behind the saddles but right up close to them.  For the nut I attached a piece of velcro about a half and inch wide to a piece of packing foam.  I oddly notices more vibration relief when I attached it to the bridge than I did behind the nut.  I think it is because the way the bridge kinda floats on the set screws and is not directly bolted to the body.  I think the design carry's vibrations from string to string allot more than a standard bridge.  I don't get any crosstalk, where before I noticed it like crazy doing arpeggios..  I think any subtle vibrations affect the modeling but that's my own opinion,  I think the more flat or stock your guitar starts off sounding the better with modeling. (no funny characteristics of the physical guitar sounding through)..  good luck thought I hope it helps.  69 owners can probable do something similar, just have it go directly across the saddles, but not the piezo's..

[katiekerry]

I now have taken the Velcro off of the bridge, when I changed strings the last time I must have done something that raised the velcro up a little (which cause unwanted buzzing much like what I was trying to avoid).  Now I just have a piece of Electrical tape in the string slot where the thickest string goes..  That seems to get rid of the vibration of the top string, which is the only one I have problems with now...  Still using the velcro at the nut though gets rid of a lot of cross talk or funny vibrations..

[Charlie_Watt]

I just use a piece of scrap fabric about a half inch wide that I interleave with the strings above the nut.  It is loose but it touches all 6 strings enough to dampen any vibration.  I started with it on my Variax 500 but I use it on all of my guitars now.  I have an acoustic that I could really hear those short string sections singing.  It was very annoying.

[scodges81]

Bump!

[tscoolberth]

Ive done this with a firm foam that I had laying around. I also used 11s because that Is what I am used to.  With the exception of extreme hi gain scenarios .. with no real warbles or anything. I've very happy as a I recently started working on a song that uses Bariton Drop -A.  The Variax is outperforming my cheapo 7 string .. which was my plan all along.  On the acoustic side, I have a song where it is great though I'm going to recut that track using a lighter pick and  lighter touch as recommended by Sean Haley. I'll post songs within a few weeks .. just gotta firm up my playing a bit as these tunes are on the outter edge of my capabilities (cover of I Despise by Chimaira and and original tune)

[brianreidguitar]

I specifically came onto the forum last night hoping for a resolve to this very issue, so thanks a bunch all of you who've addressed this and provided your time and results.  For me, it really does improve the instrument a lot.  Thank You.  Thank You!

[changingparadigm]

Does anyone have the first link from katiekerry

 

When i click he link, it takes me to an invalid page.

[cruisinon2]

Does anyone have the first link from katiekerry

 

When i click he link, it takes me to an invalid page.

Really old post...not surprised the link went dead. Not likely that it'll work anymore.

[katiekerry]

 

Unfortunately the link is to the old forums is gone.  So they have finally killed it.  Basically all that the old link stated was that I had found some resolve from the funky warble sounds and the artifacts that the piezos were picking up and in turn disrupting the modeling.  ( they are highly sensitive so any nuances are amplified ).  By me deadening the vibrations in both the head stock and the bridge it relieved allot of the problems I was having..  But in all truth I have removed the velcro on the bridge on my own guitar I now wrap the heavier gauge strings with a little plumbers tape.  So they don't vibrate across the bridge so much.. I am satisfied with the results..  Good luck to those who need it hopefully this helps..

[Segomil]

When i see a guy who just makes music at home & finds a way to correct what Variax division cannot found or do : its make me sick !

Hey Line Variax are so in need of help more than us if i can say ! .. A SHAME !

[jegler]

 

 

Unfortunately the link is to the old forums is gone.  So they have finally killed it.  

 

any posts on how to achieve something similar with the JTV tremolo bridge? looks like you may be able to thread a thin, narrow strip of fabric underneath the saddles between the string and the vertical bridge screws. wondered if it was worth investigating...

[katiekerry]

 

any posts on how to achieve something similar with the JTV tremolo bridge? looks like you may be able to thread a thin, narrow strip of fabric underneath the saddles between the string and the vertical bridge screws. wondered if it was worth investigating...

 

You could try wrapping some plumbers tape around the string where it crosses the saddle to cut down on vibrations.  I wish they made replacement saddles similiar to graph tech or something with a coating.  I have problems yet with the 59 bridge cause the Ernie ball strings I use (the wraps on the ball ends go up the string too far and the string sticking out at the end vibrates againts the bridge and rings through).  Its a pain I may just install a tailstop.. 

 

  I think also possible the reason why some people have issues with it is that Some are using Full range systems and some are not.  I noticed a big difference running through a regular amp and my FR system.  You don't hear nuances nearly at all with the limited range of a regular amp..