no Good sound with line 6 helix

[lolo1973]

Hello.

I bought my helix in june and i m very disapointed by the sound. 1500 euros and I have had never a sound too bad in my life (25 years of guitar play ). I have tried all solutions that I found on the forums. Even with my torpedo cab the sound is bad. Even with the new firmware 2.01 the sound is bad e specially for crunch and distortion.Now i'm blocked with it and it's impossible to sell it. What is the solution?. I would like to discuss with a responsible from line 6 and said his that 1500 euros is not nothing for a workers in a factory.

May be that a person on this forum could help me to obtain an acceptable sound?

Sorry for my english i m french.

Thanks for your help.

[Joepeggio]

we will need more info to help. Your guitar? your Effects chain? what are you playing it through? what are you trying to achieve or comparing it to?

[lolo1973]

Thanks for your answer. I use a stratocaster us fender and an eastwood suprotone. Concerning the effect chain, I tried all preampli,ampli,distortion pedal and cab from helix. I also used IR from ownhammer and I tried also to integrate my torpedo cab.

. I Still obtain a bad noise with crunch or distortion like if you put directly a distortion pedal in a sound card. The sound is not natural.

I link the helix by the output 1/4 in a presonus studiolive 16 0 2. I used a headphone beyerdnamic 770 or Adam monitor or RCF Art 712 mkIi monitor.

Thanks. Regards

[bisognojm]

Have you tried the high cut and lo cut on the IR? That's the thing that used to really bother me. If you bring the Hi cut to around 6.5k and low cut around 80, it sounds a lot more natural.

[rvroberts]

Other people here are going to try to help you. I'm just going to say to you that a lot of top professionals are using the Helix and they use it because they get great sounds. So you have to realise that unless your device is faulty, it has to be how you are using it, not the Helix.

Setting global EQ or setting high and low cuts on your speakers (IR or Helix cabs) are the first thing you need to do. Guitar sounds should not have high frequencies or very low frequencies. Bad distortion sounds are a result of too much high end. Guitar speakers don't produce these frequencies. Bisognojm is giving you a good starting point. I'd start to cut the lows at more like 120hz, but I like a tight bottom end. Somewhere between 5.7-6.5k fit high cut. Depends on if you like smooth or agressive.

If you are using the editor on a computer, you can view the global eq as a curve. Make a nice big bow with seriously cut top and bottom. You really don't want to hear this bad frequencies at all!

[lolo1973]

Thanks for your help I Will try and Will keep you informed

Regards.

[Paolo_Maina]

This is an italian guitar player in a normal gig, no super stage.

Only a small gig in outside a pub or a restaurant i don't know, but it's something that you could do too.

Do you like his sound? no amp only Helix and Yamaha dbr 12 monitors.

I think is a great sound.

If He can do it...you can do it.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cXPHnJh7R8Y

[Paolo_Maina]

First of all

Where do you play?

At home?

Are you trying to record yourself?

live gig?

Rehearsal?

 

Second

When you use headphones connected to Helix do you ear bad sounds?

[bertwilson]

Your problem should be fixable with a little testing.  The Helix is a great sounding device.  Here are a few things to try:

 

1. Create a couple of basic patches for testing from scratch. Maybe a WhoWatt 100 for clean and a Brit Plexi Brt for crunch.  Keep these very basic.  

2. Turn Guitar PAD on.  I do not have active pickups, but with PAD off, I generally get bad sounds.  Definitely a good first step.

3. Make sure your LINE vs MIC output settings are correct.  This depends on what you are running the helix into, but Mic level vs Line level can make a big difference.

4. Keep your master volume at 50% (12 o'clock position) for testing just to make sure you aren't sending too much signal to the receiving device/speaker.

[mileskb]

Second

When you use headphones connected to Helix do you ear bad sounds?

 

I actually say this is 1st.  The headphone out is one of the best trouble-shooting tools on the Helix.   The OP stated "I Still obtain a bad noise with crunch or distortion like if you put directly a distortion pedal in a sound card. The sound is not natural."     This description does not sound like something that would come out of the Helix unless you programmed it too, but it does describe a possibly faulty unit.

[Quickdraw]

I actually say this is 1st.  The headphone out is one of the best trouble-shooting tools on the Helix.   The OP stated "I Still obtain a bad noise with crunch or distortion like if you put directly a distortion pedal in a sound card. The sound is not natural."     This description does not sound like something that would come out of the Helix unless you programmed it too, but it does describe a possibly faulty unit.

This is the sound you would get if your amp (head/ pre-amp) was not feeding a speaker cab or IR... that can be pretty hideous... just like a distortion pedal into a sound card...

 

Do all the pre-programed presets sound this way also?

[aepoc]

Impossible to sell?  

[lolo1973]

Dear all.

I tried yours ideas. I cut in global eq and in the IR the frequencies below 120 hertz and at 6,5khz. The clean is ok but there is still bad noise in distortion with my headphone and monitors Adam F7. I notice that the sound is little bit better but not acceptable to play in live. I verified also the guitar pad was in "on" position. I put the Master volume at 12h. For your information I use the 1/4 trs output and not the xlr output to link with my presonus studiolive live.

I tried also a simple preset with just a tube screamer, a brit plexi brt, a reverb and an IR from ownhammer. I have the same problem with my headphone link to the helix or the presonus and with my Adam F7 monitor.

Tomorrow I Will try the 4 method câble with my laney irt studio and I will use the distortion of the lany.I Will keep you informed.

Many thanks at all for your great support and help.

Regards

[mileskb]

The clean is ok but there is still bad noise in distortion with my headphone and monitors Adam F7. 

 

Could you record a clip?  Let us know the stock preset.  Do NOT change anything... just a plain stock preset, use the USB to record if possible.   If you are hearing a bad noise with just the headsets, than their might be a problem.  Especially because you mention you had the same thing before and after update to 2.01.  

[TheDaveDaveDave]

Couple other points:

 

1). Testing with headphones is a great idea, as you're isolating more potential problems....

2). Check the global settings and make sure that the impedance is set to auto.

3) do you have any spdif devices connected? I can imagine word clock issues causing the problems you describe....

4) perhaps try a factory rest and use only the factory presets? If.you still have the issues, then I'm afraid It really does sound to me as though you have a faulty unit though :(

[lolo1973]

Dear all.

Thanks to you I found the solution. I place low cut at 250hz and high cut at 5khz on global eq. On the cab or IR I place the high cut at 6khz. I don't Hear the bad noisy sound when I use distortion.

So many many many thanks at all for your help. My helix is my friend now

Best regards and I wish you all the Best for you in music and your life

Laurent

[soundog]

Best musical device support forum ever!  :)

[TheDaveDaveDave]

Congrats Laurent! Btw - if you up the high pass filter to 7000k or so, do you still have issues? Are you able to try different guitars?

 

Cheers!

[lolo1973]

At 7000k the sound is not very well in distortion. I tried with 4 différent guitars and all is ok.

 

Regards

[ercatto]

Hi all..

About frequencies cut of IR....

That sond strange to me.... I cut low at 80-100 max, and high at 12-15K, and it sounds very good to me.... but usually i use amp and effects tone control to get the proper sound, 'cause it seems to me that if i cut to much on the IR i lose all the "air"....

Obviously is a matter of personal taste.....

[zooey]

Yes, but also depends hugely on the amp and its settings, and on the IR itself.

[Lachdanan0121]

Hi all..

About frequencies cut of IR....

That sond strange to me.... I cut low at 80-100 max, and high at 12-15K, and it sounds very good to me.... but usually i use amp and effects tone control to get the proper sound, 'cause it seems to me that if i cut to much on the IR i lose all the "air"....

Obviously is a matter of personal taste.....

I am actually more in the boat with you on the High and Low cuts.

 

Sometimes I put the high cut a little higher at 16K-17K.  

 

Though I have only used a few models and cabinets. No IRs yet. As a lot of it sounds so good already. 

 

I guess one reason why I have the high cut higher than most recommend on here is to come through in a full mix, and stand out. A lot of the guys on here play live in full bands and when your rig is cranked the high frequencies can be very harsh... Which I figure could be another reason as well.

[regalpierot]

I have seen a lot of people say building your own presets is the way you'll really get the most out of the unit, and it's a fair point, but when i see people post that they have an overall quality question on the unit, building a preset and tweaking away all day seems like a really odd methodology to me. There's so may presets on CUSTOMTONE or made by incredibly adept folks like Glenn Delaune why the hell wouldn't you download some of those and use them as a baseline for working out if it's possible to get a tone you like. If not, your unit is faulty or something outside of the Helix is having a negative impact. I've been playing guitar for 25 year, owned so many rigs over the years, I can tell you that there's zero opinion to it. The Helix sounds really good when you have a well built preset, pure and simple.

 

I'm not saying the thing might be to anyone's taste, but there's no way one person is hearing a bad quality guitar tone and response when so many others hear the opposite. There's a point where quality is simply not down to taste.

[ercatto]

First of all I apologize for my english ....

I'm Italian, if we're on simple concepts usually I have no problems, but if the subject is complicated, I might make mistakes

so excuse me for this .....

 

I have seen a lot of people say ......

 

I almost agree with you ... almost, indeed ....

 

Without going too far, if you only need to prove the functionality of Helix, just use

 

Factory 1 - 1A Us Double Nrm

 

and already you feel if it sounds good or bad.

Not that you like or not like that tone ..... especially if you use good headphones to monitor ..... I use Beyerdynamics too

 

I'd like to listen to a record made with this patch .... well, just to see "how" it sounds bad .....

 

If you help someone understand if it's a hardware problem, I think you have to start from a common point (a Factory preset is a good starting point for me), you must only ensure that the output volume is not saturated (and any sound card allows you to verify it), because the gains of the individual blocks are already ok (the reason to use a factory patch), and the overall volume set at noon is not a reliable judge.... use a vu-meter....

record a short audio track and publish it on the forum, so other users can understand and judge it by ear which may be the problem

 

Usually I follow the KISS rule

 

No CustomTone Patch for testing (avoid mistakes made by other users)

No third-party IR for testing (possible gain match problems )

Possibly exclude all effects.....even Reverbs

Because variables only increase in number

 

For the rest, someone said to cut the frequencies of the CAB or IR, or adjust the global eq, I said my opinion about the frequencies cut...

And for the record, I have many doubts even about adjusting the global eq ....

if I'm not mistaken we are talking about headphone monitoring.....

[willjrock]

 

Other people here are going to try to help you. I'm just going to say to you that a lot of top professionals are using the Helix and they use it because they get great sounds. So you have to realise that unless your device is faulty, it has to be how you are using it, not the Helix.

 

Oh yeah? Can you please point me to one great recorded tone, on an album by a "top professional", using the Helix in the manner the OP is?

[ddmilne]

IF you cant easily connect to an amp or FRFR powered system without hours of fiddle lollipoping it is not an amp modeler. The amps they try to simulate have very few controls to work with and require little fuss. If you have to spend hours filtering out digital noise and trying to add coloration to get a pleasing sound to one patch aloe, yet still never getting a natural amp sound with flexibility. what is the point.

You can try to embarrass as many as you want in this forum because you are tone deaf and never actually ever played any of these amp models. The truth is that Helix , Boss GT1000,Fractal Audio and Kemper   all lack real true analogue quality of the real deal . I truly wish that were not true. I have had all of them, quite thankfully being able to return them to the dealer.

Lets be honest, There is too much discontinuity between manufactures to select one multi effects amp modeler with another front end amp or powered monitor.  While one sounds great though a FRFR system it sounds like crap piped to the front show and vice versa. At best this a patch by patch analysis. Analogue sound, digital control is the best you can get. That isnt even perfect.

 

We have a long way to go. So save your money and wait until these guys come to the plate with a real system worth the money

[cruisinon2]

Harrumph! Do you feel better? If you look around I'm sure you could find a few more 4 year old threads to whine in.

[datacommando]

6 hours ago, cruisinon2 said:

Harrumph! Do you feel better? If you look around I'm sure you could find a few more 4 year old threads to whine in.

You’re wasting you time with this idiot, but you are right.
 

If you check previous posts it seems that you have responded a few times to this total nonsense (trolling?).

 

For the past couple of years it has been constant negative attitude, but for some weird reason the posts keep on coming! Strangely - must still be a Helix owner/user.

A couple of examples:

 

 

 

[qwerty42]

I have a friend who used to work in tech support. He called these "ID-10-T" errors. They are usually solved by exchanging the user rather than the product. ;)

[Piranio]

I am worried that i have a hardware failure, but after reading all the above posts, i am at least willing to try to recover the old days i used to love Helix.  i have used it both studio and live many times. I love real amp overdrive, but i settle for the decent sounds from Helix, though i know they are far from realistic to the purist ear ( mine ), and yet, the public dont know and dont care, so i use it.   . . .   But these days, nothing sounds the same.  even factory presets stink.   I used to have ( made it myself ) a core tone that was clean enough to be heard every note, and yet distorted and boosted enough to drive for rock,  and seperate tones for leads and effects and all that. . but now. . .   the only setting that even sounds usable is Line 6 epic Amp + Cab , and i have to work off of that as my core, which was mud, until i put in Simple EQ, and managed to pull out a tone that at least works for heavy rock songs ( I do all originals ) , but little else.

 

    This could be a corrupt unit?  and if so. . .what can i DO about it?

 

Bren in Texas , of Tears No More band. 

 *** For those who may care to see what i used to be able to do with it in studio -  Bandmix.com/tears-no-more   and   Bandmix.com/brenmultimusician   everything on there , guitar and bass was through Helix.

[Punkyboy]

On 9/6/2016 at 4:36 AM, lolo1973 said:

Even with the new firmware 2.01 the sound is bad

The new firmware is 3.11 no?

Salut le dernier firmware est le 3.11 en tout cas c'est ce que j'ai sur mon LT, et tu parles du 2.01?

refait un update avec Line 6 updater

[datacommando]

14 minutes ago, Punkyboy said:

The new firmware is 3.11 no?

It is now, but that post was made in 2016.

 

 

[Punkyboy]

1 hour ago, datacommando said:

It is now, but that post was made in 2016.

 

 

ahahah omfg I didn't see it

But  why the lollipop is the guy responding on this post 5 year after?? OMFG

[Paulzx]

On 7/25/2020 at 12:59 AM, ddmilne said:

IF you cant easily connect to an amp or FRFR powered system without hours of fiddle lollipoping it is not an amp modeler. The amps they try to simulate have very few controls to work with and require little fuss. If you have to spend hours filtering out digital noise and trying to add coloration to get a pleasing sound to one patch aloe, yet still never getting a natural amp sound with flexibility. what is the point.

You can try to embarrass as many as you want in this forum because you are tone deaf and never actually ever played any of these amp models. The truth is that Helix , Boss GT1000,Fractal Audio and Kemper   all lack real true analogue quality of the real deal . I truly wish that were not true. I have had all of them, quite thankfully being able to return them to the dealer.

Lets be honest, There is too much discontinuity between manufactures to select one multi effects amp modeler with another front end amp or powered monitor.  While one sounds great though a FRFR system it sounds like crap piped to the front show and vice versa. At best this a patch by patch analysis. Analogue sound, digital control is the best you can get. That isnt even perfect.

 

We have a long way to go. So save your money and wait until these guys come to the plate with a real system worth the money

 

Slightly surprised to read this. I could write a book on my struggles with the Helix but most of the issues were down to things I was doing, most notably using the wrong speakers. It's all about the output device and then on from that, how you EQ the sound. The Helix is totally capable of sounding good. There are people with demo videos that have it sounding fantastic in fact. I don't know their particular methods but it sounds very good.

 

Personally, I don't think most people really care if various amp models sound exactly like the real amps, I don't think people are chasing that. I think what most of us want are a collection of different amp sounds that just sound good when you play them, if they're a bit off from the real thing who cares, as long as what you've got sounds good?

 

If you're suggesting that the Helix or any other modeller can't sound great - irrespective of accuracy of the actual modelling - that's not really true is it?

[cruisinon2]

11 hours ago, Paulzx said:

 

Slightly surprised to read this. I could write a book on my struggles with the Helix but most of the issues were down to things I was doing, most notably using the wrong speakers. It's all about the output device and then on from that, how you EQ the sound. The Helix is totally capable of sounding good. There are people with demo videos that have it sounding fantastic in fact. I don't know their particular methods but it sounds very good.

 

Personally, I don't think most people really care if various amp models sound exactly like the real amps, I don't think people are chasing that. I think what most of us want are a collection of different amp sounds that just sound good when you play them, if they're a bit off from the real thing who cares, as long as what you've got sounds good?

 

If you're suggesting that the Helix or any other modeller can't sound great - irrespective of accuracy of the actual modelling - that's not really true is it?

 

Don't waste your time with that guy... he shows up periodically, usually when a new "Helix sucks" thread appears (or an old one resurfaces),  to vomit the same negative assessment of every modeler under the sun. His ears are better than yours, his experience more profound, and skills more refined. Just ask him... he'll be only too happy to tell you, because he can't help himself. You see, that's why he and he alone can tell just how substandard all modelers actually are, while you, wallowing in your "tone-deafness", continue to labor under the delusion that it sounds great.

 

Just know that if you continue to engage him, that's exactly how the conversation will go... he knows better, and you're just a poor slob who can't tell the difference between a pile of $hit and Thanksgiving dinner... this scenario ain't new.