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I am aware that the jumpiness, texture, flavor and smell of the tuner have been discussed to death and become somewhat of a joke on here. However, I still have trouble properly tuning with it on the fly. Every other tuner I use is considerably more stable and lets me tune spot on in a matter of seconds. Am I alone here? Will the tuner get some more work done eventually? I really don't wish to add a polytune to my rig as of now. Helix should be able to replace it.

 

 

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Neck pickup. Tone down.

The tuner is very specific and "granular". So it looks jumpy.

How hard you hit the strings and how old the strings are makes a difference, too.

 

Honestly, I have no problem with Helix Tuner. I do prefer my Strobostomp, but get along with Helix's tuner well enough that I rarely even get the Strobostomp out anymore except to tweak intonation on guitars.

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 Am I alone here? 

Yep...

 

Takes me about a minute or so to tune my guitar with the Helix.  But then, I don't really obsess over tuners.

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Tuner is fine. Works great on the gig. Could it be less jumpy, maybe?

But for serious intonation work you'd use something else anyway.

 

Let's focus on Snaps & Stomps selectable per preset instead of global.

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I think it works great.  I love the 2 scales so you can ball park it on the first scale and fine tune on the second.

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Thank you all for your replies. So reading the above, it is safe to sat 2 out of 4, (3/4 if you count me) users on this thread agree the tuner could be better? I am very aware it is now considered utmost uncool to say that on the forum, but for me this feels like a very jerky tuner.

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I am aware that the jumpiness, texture, flavor and smell of the tuner have been discussed to death and become somewhat of a joke on here. However, I still have trouble properly tuning with it on the fly. Every other tuner I use is considerably more stable and lets me tune spot on in a matter of seconds. Am I alone here?

 

No. On last Saturday's gig, I couldn't tune my low E string. Tuner was jumping around like crazy and would never settle in. And yes, I was using the neck pickup with the tone knob rolled back. Maybe that string was getting prematurely old. Or maybe the tuner needs some more work.

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No. On last Saturday's gig, I couldn't tune my low E string. Tuner was jumping around like crazy and would never settle in. And yes, I was using the neck pickup with the tone knob rolled back. Maybe that string was getting prematurely old. Or maybe the tuner needs some more work.

That's the kind of behavior I'm referring to myself. I have never had such an issue with a tuner, and I've been through dozens of them in the past 2 decades.

 

 

I'm seeing 4/5 saying it works fine for their purposes.

Under certain conditions, with specific reservations, while preferring other tuners .I'm not looking to create an argument Thurston, and I do not know the settings others use Helix in. However, in a professional environment, which is my purpose, Helix tuner for me is simply not dependable. I would expect my €1400 cutting edge rig to be easier for tuning than the free app on my phone.

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...Under certain conditions, with specific reservations, while preferring other tuners ...

 

 

Reading between the lines... I'd like to offer this: if you are asking a tuner in a multi-function box like Helix to be preferable to standalone devices that were made solely to tune and with no other function, you are asking too much.

 

So if the real question is "Will the Helix tuner ever be as good as or better than a Turbo Tuner or StroboStomp" not only is the answer yes, but the answer is "Yes, and PLEASE Line 6 don't sink a bunch of development time into this... model new amps and FX instead..."

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hi all i thought this from the first time i used it.its to ify,i thought that this new 2.20 would have fixed it

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Under certain conditions, with specific reservations, while preferring other tuners .I'm not looking to create an argument Thurston, and I do not know the settings others use Helix in. However, in a professional environment, which is my purpose, Helix tuner for me is simply not dependable. I would expect my €1400 cutting edge rig to be easier for tuning than the free app on my phone.

 

That's fine, I guess my point was that everyone who responded seemed satisfied enough to not have enough of an issue with it that they thought it needed to be fixed. I suppose that wasn't your question though.

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Reading between the lines... I'd like to offer this: if you are asking a tuner in a multi-function box like Helix to be preferable to standalone devices that were made solely to tune and with no other function, you are asking too much.

 

So if the real question is "Will the Helix tuner ever be as good as or better than a Turbo Tuner or StroboStomp" not only is the answer yes, but the answer is "Yes, and PLEASE Line 6 don't sink a bunch of development time into this... model new amps and FX instead..."

I understand what you're saying PH. My expectations are not that high though. I am just after a tuner that works for me in my environment. An average digital stable tuner. To be honest I've never had tuner issues before, and have been feeling really frustrated tuning with Helix . That's why I started this thread, I want to make sure it's not only me, (maybe I have some kind of tuning fetish I'm not aware of!) or maybe even faulty gear. Other guitarists that I've been working with, have also loved taking my Helix for a spin, but have found the tuner kinda awkward. Although, I along with them love the display.  When it comes down to it, a stable tuner is the meat and potatoes of any rig and I really wouldn't mind L6 resources being assigned to one, even if that means I won't get other toys for a while.

 

Don't get me wrong, I LOVE Helix, but the tuner makes Helix a sexy girl with man hands.

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I am aware that the jumpiness, texture, flavor and smell of the tuner have been discussed to death and become somewhat of a joke on here. However, I still have trouble properly tuning with it on the fly. Every other tuner I use is considerably more stable and lets me tune spot on in a matter of seconds. Am I alone here? Will the tuner get some more work done eventually? I really don't wish to add a polytune to my rig as of now. Helix should be able to replace it.

 

I fully agree with you the tuner is too jumpy. I could swear it seems a bit better since the 2.20 update but that might just be the placebo effect since I saw nothing in the firmware notes to indicate the tuner had been stabilized. I thought it had been improved once before after the last update until I did a gig and realized it was still too jumpy to tune quickly and accurately between songs.

 

 

...

 

So if the real question is "Will the Helix tuner ever be as good as or better than a Turbo Tuner or StroboStomp" not only is the answer yes, but the answer is "Yes, and PLEASE Line 6 don't sink a bunch of development time into this... model new amps and FX instead..."

 

This may be what is called the horns of a false dilemma. Stabilizing the tuner and new amps and FX are probably not mutually exclusive. If they are, I would prefer a pause to get a tuner that is stable enough to tune quickly versus another amp or effect. I am still enthusiastic about more amps and FX but there are enough already to keep me busy whereas fast and accurate tuning is an absolute necessity for a performance. I would hope improving the tuner would not require that much development time. I may be in the minority here but the tuner is the higher priority for me.  A stable tuner is important to a pro or prosumer level device even if it is not at the top of everyone's wishlist. Not looking for the perfect tuner here, just something that is stable enough to tune faster.

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Well, the tuner IS stable... (runs and hides...)  B)

 

LOL. You won't have to run far as you have plenty of fellow users to hide behind who agree with you. The OP's and my opinion appears to be in the minority which never ceases to surprise me as this seems like such a blatant issue to me.  B)

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LOL. You won't have to run far as you have plenty of fellow users to hide behind who agree with you. The OP's and my opinion appears to be in the minority which never ceases to surprise me as this seems like such a blatant issue to me.  B)

Just to pitch in...I'm not happy with the tuner either. When I'm tuning at home, I can hear how much the note is off, almost like a little microtone of range of give on either side of the note.

 

I can tell the difference at home, haven't gigged with it yet.

 

Edit: To clarify, I'm talking about the green zone, not implying the tuner isn't accurate. I'm sure it's reading the pitches fine, but I'd like the green space to be more accurate

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Just to pitch in...I'm not happy with the tuner either. When I'm tuning at home, I can hear how much the note is off, almost like a little microtone of range of give on either side of the note.

 

I can tell the difference at home, haven't gigged with it yet.

 

Hmmm, I never detected any problem with accuracy; it's just the "jumpy" thing before it settles. It takes longer to tune because of it.

 

The tuner on my Line 6 M13 works great! Can't help but wonder why a tuner on a (more expensive) product by the same company doesn't work as well, especially when practically everything else about it is awesome.

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This thread reminds me of the offspring of cross-breeding with a cat and a horse - something with nine lives that can't be beaten to death.

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This thread reminds me of the interbreeding of a cat and a horse - something with nine lives that can't be beaten to death.

 

Great metaphor! I will be using that one. There is an easy way to put this horse down though. Fix it already. I don't understand why this problem has been allowed to malinger for so long. I am as tired of seeing it mentioned as most everyone else here.

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This thread reminds me of the offspring of cross-breeding with a cat and a horse - something with nine lives that can't be beaten to death.

This thread was inspired by the offspring of a maraca on cocaine and Kim Jong il.

 

I have a feeling every time the tuner has been discussed there's been a certain ganging up on those, like myself, who find it performs poorly. I really don't understand why that is. Helix has the least useable tuner I've owned. I would like it to work properly. Not looking to stir up the pot or offend those with tuner sensibilities.

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This thread was inspired by the offspring of a maraca on cocaine and Kim Jong il.

 

I have a feeling every time the tuner has been discussed there's been a certain ganging up on those, like myself, who find it performs poorly. I really don't understand why that is. Helix has the least useable tuner I've owned. I would like it to work properly. Not looking to stir up the pot or offend those with tuner sensibilities.

 

Heh, the metaphors on here are starting to approach Dennis Miller levels (don't agree with most of what he says but he has a way with analogies, metaphors & similes) . Agreed, when will the filibustering on this issue stop and the self-evident problem with the tuner be resolved? We don't need no stinking 60% majority on the forum. That is likely to make us as dysfunctional as congress.   :P

 

Note: In no way am I advocating dispensing with the filibuster. Just in this particular case.  Damn, getting perilously close to violating my personal rule of never engaging in politics or religion on the forum.  ;)

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Until the Helix Tuner's Visual Display is properly dampened, such that it presents a stable and accurate graphic, such as the case with the majority of readily available free tuner apps and reasonably priced tuner's (Snarks, PolyTune Clip, BOSS inline tuners, etc.) this issue will persist.

 

Line 6 needs to resolve this and put the issue to rest.

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Does anyone know if note tracking and resolution fixes in the tuner would also work to improve the harmonizer and pitch effects?  I am not sure if thats the case at all, but I feel like both those spots could benefit from some attention.  

 

Even if its not, I like the idea of making existing features even better in future updates.  Wether its tweaked amps/fx, updated utility stuff, or buffing up the tuner.  

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Until the Helix Tuner's Visual Display is properly dampened, such that it presents a stable and accurate graphic, such as the case with the majority of readily available free tuner apps and reasonably priced tuner's (Snarks, PolyTune Clip, BOSS inline tuners, etc.) this issue will persist.

 

Line 6 needs to resolve this and put the issue to rest.

 

What if people like the tuner the way it is? I mean, I have no problem with it, and there are plenty of others who don't seem to have issues with it? Is it really worth investing a lot of resources into chasing a moving target?

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Is it really worth investing a lot of resources into chasing a moving target?

 

Yes it is worth investing the resources! This is a modest request for a refinement/fix for the tuner, not a major feature.  You put your finger right on the pulse and stated it perfectly. The whole problem is that the tuner is a "moving target"; way too much moving going on there.   B)

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What if people like the tuner the way it is? I mean, I have no problem with it, and there are plenty of others who don't seem to have issues with it? Is it really worth investing a lot of resources into chasing a moving target?

 

I suspect if the Tuner were improved, then people who are happy with it currently, would be even more delighted with it. Are people really going to complain and say "hey - I preferred it jumpier - put it back!!" No, they'd likely say "I made do with it before, but this is actually really nice." Or maybe they'd even say "I didn't realize how much it needed improving..."

 

Yes it is worth investing the resources! This is a modest request for a refinement/fix for the tuner, not a major feature. You put your finger right on the pulse and stated it perfectly. The whole problem is that the tuner is a "moving target"; way too much moving going on there. B)

I agree. As elegant as everything else is with the Helix, it's a bummer about the tuner.
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Are people really going to complain and say "hey - I preferred it jumpier - put it back!!"

Have you read the old tuner threads? A post on how jumpy the tuner was would be immediately followed by a post on how the tuner wasn't reactive enough. So to answer your question, yes, I think people will moan about the tuner forever no matter what. But it could be worse, at least we're not talking about Andy Summer's MIAB tone...

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I have been watching these assorted "Tuner" threads since they started.  Here are some observations and a plan-ish..

 

1.  The Tuner is great for some, and not great for others.

2.  The extent of great or not great knows no bounds, e.g. some can't use it all, and some won't use anything else and every option in between.

3.  Experience and skill do not seem to be a factor on where you fall in the usability scale of item #2 above.  Amateur to Pro, newbie or long time player.

 

So MY conclusion...  is we need to get at least TWO people into a room.  One who hates or at least dislikes the tuner, and one who loves it or at least uses it on a regular basis and let them tune each others guitars and document/observe each other and what works and what doesn't.  

 

This is the ONLY way this is going to get resolved.  

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Have you read the old tuner threads? A post on how jumpy the tuner was would be immediately followed by a post on how the tuner wasn't reactive enough. So to answer your question, yes, I think people will moan about the tuner forever no matter what. But it could be worse, at least we're not talking about Andy Summer's MIAB tone...

 

 

Ha - no, I'm new here.  But I guess I can see your point.  BUT - I have used a lot of tuners, and built-in tuners in various modeling devices, and I don't *think* it needs to be that erratic to be reactive and precise.  I could be wrong though. Wouldn't be the first time.   

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Personally I really do find it annoying, way more so than any other tuner I have. It's not an enormous deal to me, I can cope, but it makes tuning more of a chore than it should be, and slows me down.

 

It really is a mystery how Helix can be so good in so many much trickier respects, and still have this issue.

 

One strategy I've been trying recently is to ignore the high-res top display, at least until all strings line up on the bottom one, which jumps around a lot less. It's less accurate of course, but it bothers me less.

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So MY conclusion...  is we need to get at least TWO people into a room.  One who hates or at least dislikes the tuner, and one who loves it or at least uses it on a regular basis and let them tune each others guitars and document/observe each other and what works and what doesn't.  

 

I thought you were going to suggest a cage match. It'd be more entertaining at least.

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You can tune a piano, but you can't tuna fish.

 

Helix can tuna pair of Sharc's, though. :)

 

SHARC_ADSP-2146X_White_tif.jpg

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I thought you were going to suggest a cage match. It'd be more entertaining at least.

 

I have been watching these assorted "Tuner" threads since they started.  Here are some observations and a plan-ish..

 

1.  The Tuner is great for some, and not great for others.

2.  The extent of great or not great knows no bounds, e.g. some can't use it all, and some won't use anything else and every option in between.

3.  Experience and skill do not seem to be a factor on where you fall in the usability scale of item #2 above.  Amateur to Pro, newbie or long time player.

 

So MY conclusion...  is we need to get at least TWO people into a room.  One who hates or at least dislikes the tuner, and one who loves it or at least uses it on a regular basis and let them tune each others guitars and document/observe each other and what works and what doesn't.  

 

This is the ONLY way this is going to get resolved.  

 

FWIW I am dead serious about this.  It would be one thing if it was just a "works" or "doesn't" works issue, but it isn't.   Personally, I love the Helix tuner.   It's easier to tune my 10-String on the Helix than the Paterson strobe..  

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In my opinion it is a little jumpy, but I attribute that to it having a fine resolution. Otherwise it seems to work very accurately. I do miss the polyphonic tuning capability of my GT-100 which allows me to strum once and quickly check the tuning of all six strings in between songs.

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Have you read the old tuner threads? A post on how jumpy the tuner was would be immediately followed by a post on how the tuner wasn't reactive enough. So to answer your question, yes, I think people will moan about the tuner forever no matter what. But it could be worse, at least we're not talking about Andy Summer's MIAB tone...

Sure there is still the occasional person who does not find the tuner reactive or accurate enough but they are the extremely rare exception. If you look far enough back at the old tuner threads there were a ton of complaints that the tuner was not "granular" enough and that it read in tune even when it was not. There were few or NO complaints about it being jumpy. A few firmware versions ago they responded to the complaints regarding granularity with a firmware revision that made the tuner readout more granular and added the second tuning bar. That is when the complaints about it being too jumpy started and the complaints about granularity pretty much ended. Let's not start revising history by saying the complaints were alternating. We have moved from a stable tuner that people perceived as not responsive or granular enough to a jumpy tuner that I suppose you could describe as overly responsive. We just need to find a way to leverage the increased/improved granularity with a less jumpy readout or one that offers a momentary freeze (as discussed ad nauseam).

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It works fine if you select a particular pickup, turn the volume down, turn the tone knob down, play gently, and take lots of time.

In other words it's good enough for playing at home. Adequate for that purpose.

It is not good enough for gigs though.

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