Carbonfold Posted February 2, 2018 Share Posted February 2, 2018 No one has ever waited on me to tune with my ST300. Works like a charm and super fast. The Helix tuner however.... Yes thats one of the best pedal tuner along with Peterson Strobostomp (some say its even better than Strobostomp) but you want do a quick tuning when playing live with it so you will be standing there for a while until you are in tune just like you would with the Helix tuner when my upper row stops at the green on my Helix i am in tune However it is so sensitive so as soon as the string starts to die out a very short while after it stopped on green for a very short while the upper row blocks starts to jump left/right. So for me i always know i am in tune when the upper row is on green for a short while then i tune the next string Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brue58ski Posted February 2, 2018 Share Posted February 2, 2018 Would you rather start sharp on every single note or go a little flat on only the longer ones? Try this. tune to the decay, and then record a passage. Tune to the attack, and record the same passage. That will tell you which way you should go. Also, players with severe playing dynamics (I am one, too), serve themselves and their music well by using heavier strings than the next guy. .011s on my (now only) electric, and .012s on my acoustics. If you have a lot of dynamics and play with .009 strings, no tuner will ever work. Lastly, old strings will make all tuners work $#!††y. Y'all ARE doing these tests with new strings... right...? I don't know if you saw this as I stated it before but I hit the note and then let it ring for about 1-3 seconds and then hit it again. Occasionally letting it ring out longer. That seems to work for my style of playing. I used to use 11's all the time but age, which brought a touch of arthritis, forced me to go back to the 10's I used decades ago. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
klangmaler Posted February 2, 2018 Share Posted February 2, 2018 No one has ever waited on me to tune with my ST300 So why not use it Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HonestOpinion Posted February 2, 2018 Share Posted February 2, 2018 Cleary you've never been to a Sizzler in Florida when the early bird special-ers arrive... At the risk of sounding ageist I have to admit you did just find the exception to the rule, you may need to discount a significant number of those reviews and probably safer to provide plastic forks. ;) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marmatkat Posted February 4, 2018 Share Posted February 4, 2018 So, you're comparing a tuner that is built-in to a box designed to do other things to the very best thing on the market in a standalone tuner. The Tuner in Helix will probably never be as good as a TT. Hey Peter, thanks a ton for all your posts. I always read yours. In this case you seem to be making an excuse for Helix, but couldn’t you do the same for any aspect of it, say the amps? “They’ll never be as good as a real amp†would probably not go down well in the Line6 offices. So, I don’t buy lowering the bar for the tuner. Again, thanks for being here. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marmatkat Posted February 4, 2018 Share Posted February 4, 2018 So why not use it If you said the same about any amp in the helix, people would (rightly) sh$t a brick! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Verne-Bunsen Posted February 4, 2018 Share Posted February 4, 2018 If you said the same about any amp in the helix, people would (rightly) sh$t a brick! Would they? Seems like using Helix with a real amp and/or cab is fairly common. Haven't seen any brick $hitting in any related discussions. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HonestOpinion Posted February 4, 2018 Share Posted February 4, 2018 Yet thats exactly what people here do when people say Helix sounds bad or digital or whatever do this and do that have you tried this and that bla bla People ssems to accept that but the tuner no way?? Not even when it didnt have the upper row. I say LEARN how the tuner works and youll be fine its exactly like learning how to dial in the tones you want It want just happen if you dont do something yourself aswell. I get your point but I don't think this analogy holds. Learning how to use the tuner is in no way "exactly like learning how to dial in the tones you want". If someone told you that the only way to get a good tone out of your Helix was to use only one particular pickup, with your tone knob set a in a certain manner, and only pick your guitar a certain way, you would politely decline and move to another modeler. The suggestions for better tones require you to make changes on the Helix or your monitoring equipment, they don't demand that you change your playing style or the settings on your guitar. The closest suggestion that fits your analogy was the one to change the input on the tuner from "Multi" to "Guitar". That does seem to help a bit but does not get many of us all of the way there (depending on your guitars and your performance requirements). Most people generally understand how the tuner works, they don't have to "learn" it, some of them just think it requires improvement or an alternate mode. Tuning is a vastly less complex process than learning how to use an advanced modeler properly to get a good tone. There are no elaborate options to tweak the operation of the tuner like there are with your tones. Additionally, tweaking your tones happens ideally before the gig and happens on the Helix. We are being asked to change our tuning methods that work just fine on most other tuners but don't seem to yield great results on the Helix. That might be acceptable if not for the fact that most of the suggested adjustments for proper Helix tuning unfortunately add even more of a delay to the time required to tune properly and still don't guarantee a good result. Generally you have the tone you want nailed with a preset or snapshot before you get to the show and the only reason you change your pickup or tone knob on the guitar is because it fits the tune. You don't want to have to do it twice, once to tune, and then again to reset for the song. Just my opinion, this never ending debate has plenty of traction on both sides. So we can keep the suggestions for how to tune, or recommendations for alternate tuners rolling for now but ultimately you are never going to convince those having a problem with it that the ideal solution wouldn't be a Helix tuner that suits a wider user base, any more than users having an issue with the tuner are going to convince the folks it is working fine for that it needs modification. Btw, if it was not for the fact that the Helix tuner is so freaking convenient and has such a large graphical display with so much potential I would have abandoned this tired discussion long ago and just resigned myself to using a third party tuner forever. I think this tuner is worth improving, it's a beaut. Additionally fast tuning is such a necessary core function for performing that it is not IMHO a minor issue easily ignored. Round and round we go, checking out for a while again. :huh: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PeterHamm Posted February 4, 2018 Share Posted February 4, 2018 Hey Peter, thanks a ton for all your posts. I always read yours. In this case you seem to be making an excuse for Helix, but couldn’t you do the same for any aspect of it, say the amps? “They’ll never be as good as a real amp†would probably not go down well in the Line6 offices. So, I don’t buy lowering the bar for the tuner. Again, thanks for being here. I don't think anybody using any of these boxes expects their tuners to compete with a TT or Strobostomp, though. And for guys who must have an amp, only an amp will do... that's true. But... again... I'm on the list of people who have no problem whatsoever with the tuner and don't even get my StroboStomp out anymore, so what do I know... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
willjrock Posted February 4, 2018 Share Posted February 4, 2018 Ive never had an issue with the tuner at all. Ive always used the top and bottom mechanism both. Ive never had to worry about setting the input block to guitar instead of multi - if that really even makes any difference. Ive never tried to intonate with the hlx tuner, but then i dont do much of that anyway. I havent used it a 5hit ton all in all, but it always did what i asked it to do, without giving me any grief. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spikey Posted February 4, 2018 Share Posted February 4, 2018 We are being asked to change our tuning methods that work just fine on most other tuners but don't seem to yield great results on the Helix. I'm on the list of people who have no problem whatsoever with the tuner Ive never had an issue with the tuner at all. A good tuner shouldn't require people to jump through hoops. Hit the note, tune it, done. And when I say "good" tuner...I mean one that gets you in tune accurately and quickly. It seems opinions vary on the tuner in Helix and how its supposed to react while tuning, and that's not unusual. I know from my experiences with it, it works, I cant set intonation with it but then it's not made for that purpose, and compared to other tuners I've used in the 40 years give or take I've used one, the one on the Helix display (not the one on the controller) is jumpy/sensitive as hell compared to a regular tuner. That's about as bluntly honest as I can be about it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cruisinon2 Posted February 4, 2018 Share Posted February 4, 2018 It seems opinions vary on the tuner in Helix and how its supposed to react while tuning, and that's not unusual. I know from my experiences with it, it works, I cant set intonation with it but then it's not made for that purpose, and compared to other tuners I've used in the 40 years give or take I've used one, the one on the Helix display (not the one on the controller) is jumpy/sensitive as hell compared to a regular tuner. That's about as bluntly honest as I can be about it. Everything you quoted above illustrates quite nicely why the "fix" some are fantasizing about it's likely. How does one go about fixing something, when they can't even get a consensus on whether or not it's broken in the first place? If they "fix" it for the vocal contingent who've all decided it's awful and unusable, how much do you all want to bet that it'll end up "un-fixed" for those who don't currently have an issue with it? They'd just be trading one group of pi$$ed customers for another... Yet another "damned if you do, damned if you don't" scenario. If I were L6, I'd carry on as if Helix didn't even have a tuner at this point...eyes front, no talking. What tuner? lol... 😂 No matter what they do, somebody is gonna be pitching a fit. They can't win... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
duncann Posted February 4, 2018 Share Posted February 4, 2018 Everything you quoted above illustrates quite nicely why the "fix" some are fantasizing about it's likely. How does one go about fixing something, when they can't even get a consensus on whether or not it's broken in the first place? If they "fix" it for the vocal contingent who've all decided it's awful and unusable, how much do you all want to bet that it'll end up "un-fixed" for those who don't currently have an issue with it? They'd just be trading one group of pi$$ed customers for another... Yet another "damned if you do, damned if you don't" scenario. If I were L6, I'd carry on as if Helix didn't even have a tuner at this point...eyes front, no talking. What tuner? lol... No matter what they do, somebody is gonna be pitching a fit. They can't win... You forgot the group of people that doesn't give a shit either way. Lol. So they can be at least neutral to some people. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spikey Posted February 4, 2018 Share Posted February 4, 2018 Me and the "don't give a lollipop" crowd can use it like it is now. That said, I still think its a bit to sensitive/jumpy... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jeremyn Posted February 4, 2018 Share Posted February 4, 2018 Everything you quoted above illustrates quite nicely why the "fix" some are fantasizing about it's likely. How does one go about fixing something, when they can't even get a consensus on whether or not it's broken in the first place? If they "fix" it for the vocal contingent who've all decided it's awful and unusable, how much do you all want to bet that it'll end up "un-fixed" for those who don't currently have an issue with it? They'd just be trading one group of pi$$ed customers for another... Yet another "damned if you do, damned if you don't" scenario. If I were L6, I'd carry on as if Helix didn't even have a tuner at this point...eyes front, no talking. What tuner? lol... No matter what they do, somebody is gonna be pitching a fit. They can't win... A 'fixed tuner' isn't going to totally change the behaviour, it'll most likely just properly damp and anti-alias the display of the frequency delta to make it behave like pretty much every other tuner out there. I don't think the few people that are happy with the current tuner will complain if it starts to behave more like a Korg, Snark, Boss, TC, etc. Yeah, I'd love if they added a properly anti-aliased strobe tuner, but I doubt that'll ever happen, and I'm not fussed either way if they never do that. I have a bunch of Turbo Tuners that I use regularly, and love the strobe tuner concept. I get by with the existing Helix tuner; the top bars jump around but I can work around that. To me it's kind of like a glaring spelling mistake on the home screen. There'll be a bunch of people that don't care, others that will say the spelling mistake 'adds character', and a final contingent that will complain that it ruins the rest of an otherwise great product. When someone fixes it, there'll be cheering from some, indifference from others, and some booing from the vocal minority. It'll settle down and everyone will forget about it. This isn't like a major rewrite of folk history where people still complain that Han Solo shot first and Greedo never shot at all. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cruisinon2 Posted February 5, 2018 Share Posted February 5, 2018 You forgot the group of people that doesn't give a shit either way. Lol. So they can be at least neutral to some people. Pleased to meet you...apparently there are two of us. 🤣 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
datacommando Posted February 5, 2018 Share Posted February 5, 2018 Pleased to meet you...apparently there are two of us. 🤣 Can you please make that three! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
soblivion Posted February 5, 2018 Share Posted February 5, 2018 I always read these tuner threads just to see what direction they will take. It can be quite amusing. That said, I've been using the Helix LT(and it's tuner) at gigs now for about 7 months. Sure it's a little jumpy, but nothin' I can't work with. I'm also in the "don't give a lollipop" category. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Carbonfold Posted February 5, 2018 Share Posted February 5, 2018 I do. Not going to rehash the obvious issues I stated with the helix tuner to begin with nor my positive opinions about the product. So why not use it Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
klangmaler Posted February 5, 2018 Share Posted February 5, 2018 + "don't give a lollipop" + OTOH, if you think you have better tools, use 'em, sky's the limit. Even if you want to win a whining competition, go for it, folks. Might help to balance your shanti... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lczegel Posted February 6, 2018 Share Posted February 6, 2018 I've found that the Helix tuner works well with one of my guitars but not with another, both work fine with other tuners. Many guitarists have one primary guitar, if the Helix tuner doesn't work well with it they think the tuner is poorly implemented, if the tuner does work for them they wonder what all the fuss is about. I haven't encountered this with other tuners. The Kemper has an incredible strobe tuner as well as other tuner options. The Kemper is more expensive than the Helix, but that doesn't explain why the Helix tuner can't compete with a $15 Snark. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spikey Posted February 6, 2018 Share Posted February 6, 2018 The only problem with all of this is, "Sure its a little jumpy", and "I dont give a lollipop that its a little jumpy", don't fix it being a little jumpy... 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MysticNL Posted February 6, 2018 Share Posted February 6, 2018 Using the Helix LT out of the box and tuning Works flawlessly and spot on here. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MarkeG Posted March 6, 2018 Share Posted March 6, 2018 Has anyone tried compared the the Kong Pitchblack Pro Rack Mount Tunerto the Helix tuner I just got a Helix Rack a few days ago and I'm really struggling with the tuner Was thinking about adding the below tuner to this new rack setup and was wondering if from here owns it could comment on how it compares to the Helix tuner ? https://youtu.be/wbTX9CNbzDo Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Verne-Bunsen Posted March 7, 2018 Share Posted March 7, 2018 I don't have the rack mount Pitchblack, but I have the pedal version and do like it a lot. I find the Helix tuner is fine for typical playing and tuning, but when I need gnats a$$ precision and consistency, for instance when setting intonation, I go to my Pitchblack. Not sure exactly what you are experiencing with the Helix tuner, but changing the tuner input from "Multi" to "Guitar" has helped a lot of us. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robbieb61 Posted March 7, 2018 Share Posted March 7, 2018 changing the tuner input from "Multi" to "Guitar" has helped a lot of us. Yep, that is definitely the thing that makes the most difference in the tuner. I actually used it tonight as I was re-stringing my Ibanez Prestige. I have been using my Les Paul HP with the G-Force robo-tuners exclusively the last couple of months so I haven't had to deal with the tuner at all. But it worked pretty well this evening with the Ibanez. Ever since I changed it from "Multi" to "Guitar" on the tuner input it has gotten a lot better. :) 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zooey Posted March 7, 2018 Share Posted March 7, 2018 Some day maybe, they'll add Tuner Time Constant and Tuner Sensitivity settings, then we can each duke it out with the imperfect reality of guitar tuning on our own. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MarkeG Posted March 8, 2018 Share Posted March 8, 2018 Got this Helix Rack just a few days ago this nice little desktop Procraft cabinet just came in today thinking the Korg Pitchblack Rack version would go great to fill a slot What you all think is there any better rack tuner out there worth considering ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robbieb61 Posted March 8, 2018 Share Posted March 8, 2018 Wow just looked at that on Sweetwater. That is a VERY cool tuner. And only $99!!! I think you found yourself a winner. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MarkeG Posted March 8, 2018 Share Posted March 8, 2018 Looks cool for sure but reading its made super cheap plastic and has some issues that worry me Read it sucks your sounds alters them no clean pass through ? and wondering how accurate it is ? I need a tuner i can use to play with and fine tune my intonation settings ? Anyone own it care to chime in ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
phil_m Posted March 8, 2018 Share Posted March 8, 2018 Looks cool for sure but reading its made super cheap plastic and has some issues that worry me Read it sucks your sounds alters them no clean pass through ? and wondering how accurate it is ? I need a tuner i can use to play with and fine tune my intonation settings ? Anyone own it care to chime in ? If you're worried about tone suck with it, I would just use one of the Helix's sends to send a signal to an external tuner rather than put it in the audio path. There's actually "Tuner Out" parameter on the Tuner page that allows to select the sends as an output to an outboard tuner if you want to do it that way. That way you wouldn't have to insert a Send block in all your presets. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MarkeG Posted March 8, 2018 Share Posted March 8, 2018 If you're worried about tone suck with it, I would just use one of the Helix's sends to send a signal to an external tuner rather than put it in the audio path. There's actually "Tuner Out" parameter on the Tuner page that allows to select the sends as an output to an outboard tuner if you want to do it that way. That way you wouldn't have to insert a Send block in all your presets. Thanks appreciate the help I'm beyond new when it comes to using the helix and still in the very beginning stages of learning just how use it So i see on the tuner page output selector i would select what and run a cable from where to where :) ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PeterHamm Posted March 8, 2018 Share Posted March 8, 2018 Looks cool for sure but reading its made super cheap plastic and has some issues that worry me Read it sucks your sounds alters them no clean pass through ? and wondering how accurate it is ? I need a tuner i can use to play with and fine tune my intonation settings ? Anyone own it care to chime in ? imho, there are only two to consider. Turbo Tuner (latest model) or StroboStomp 2. My StroboStomp 2 is the only thing I'd ever use for intonation. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jbuhajla Posted March 8, 2018 Share Posted March 8, 2018 If you're worried about tone suck with it, I would just use one of the Helix's sends to send a signal to an external tuner rather than put it in the audio path. There's actually "Tuner Out" parameter on the Tuner page that allows to select the sends as an output to an outboard tuner if you want to do it that way. That way you wouldn't have to insert a Send block in all your presets. ^^^^^^THIS^^^^^^^^ For everyone not happy with the on board tuner (like myself), use a different tuner. Problem solved, next thread please... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kidAmazed Posted September 2, 2019 Share Posted September 2, 2019 Hey! I'm so grateful for the Helix. Makes my life so much easier. Been playing for 20 years and it's just a blessing. I have one wish for the Helix and it's regarding the tuner in a live situation. I'll try to put words on what I mean here: I would like to access the tuner instantly. I've been thinking about this and from my perspective I see three possible ways. Add a choice to make the tap/tuner button engage the tuner when I push it once. Yes, I loose the tap function. Add the tuner as a possible block that I can put in the signal chain wherever I want. Add a "live-mode" where the tuner and the name of the preset is visible at all times. When I had my old pedal bord I used a switcher and one button sent my signal to the tuner, that of course was on at all times. I also used that as a "mute effect" making me absolutely quiet instantly. You guys are geniuses so I know you'll figure something out. If this would be added I would be so happy! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
datacommando Posted September 2, 2019 Share Posted September 2, 2019 25 minutes ago, jacobmilton said: Hey! I'm so grateful for the Helix. Makes my life so much easier. Been playing for 20 years and it's just a blessing. I have one wish for the Helix and it's regarding the tuner in a live situation. I'll try to put words on what I mean here: I would like to access the tuner instantly. I've been thinking about this and from my perspective I see three possible ways. Add a choice to make the tap/tuner button engage the tuner when I push it once. Yes, I loose the tap function. Add the tuner as a possible block that I can put in the signal chain wherever I want. Add a "live-mode" where the tuner and the name of the preset is visible at all times. When I had my old pedal bord I used a switcher and one button sent my signal to the tuner, that of course was on at all times. I also used that as a "mute effect" making me absolutely quiet instantly. You guys are geniuses so I know you'll figure something out. If this would be added I would be so happy! Hi, First up, the best thing to do would be to follow the suggestion posted above by “phil_m”. That option was devised by Line 6 to allow users to work with their own favourite tuner hooked up externally. Second, we all live in hope, but the chances of any member of Line 6 staff spotting your request are less than zero. This is a forum of users, so if you really want to request modification to the tuner, you really need to post on the Line 6 Ideascale site. At least there it will have a chance of being noted - although when I looked there was almost 100 posts regarding the tuner. Anyhow, follow this link and good luck - you’ll need it. https://line6.ideascale.com/a/ideas/search?templateId=0&query=Helix+tuner Hope this helps/makes sense. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kidAmazed Posted September 2, 2019 Share Posted September 2, 2019 20 minutes ago, datacommando said: Hi, First up, the best thing to do would be to follow the suggestion posted above by “phil_m”. That option was devised by Line 6 to allow users to work with their own favourite tuner hooked up externally. Second, we all live in hope, but the chances of any member of Line 6 staff spotting your request are less than zero. This is a forum of users, so if you really want to request modification to the tuner, you really need to post on the Line 6 Ideascale site. At least there it will have a chance of being noted - although when I looked there was almost 100 posts regarding the tuner. Anyhow, follow this link and good luck - you’ll need it. https://line6.ideascale.com/a/ideas/search?templateId=0&query=Helix+tuner Hope this helps/makes sense. Thanks for a fast respons! I understand. For me it's not interesting to add more hardware. Then I'm gonna use the tuner as it is now. I tried the link you posted but I need to create another account to get in there. What a hassle... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
datacommando Posted September 2, 2019 Share Posted September 2, 2019 2 hours ago, jacobmilton said: Thanks for a fast respons! I understand. For me it's not interesting to add more hardware. Then I'm gonna use the tuner as it is now. I tried the link you posted but I need to create another account to get in there. What a hassle... Hi again, Oh, yeah, sorry about that. I forgot to say that you have to sign up for Ideascale, but the only way to get noticed is posting on the "wishlist". As for patching your favorite flavour of tuner into the Helix, it's not exactly "more hardware" in the sense of a huge amount of extra stuff to transport around. However, as the man with the Helium filled cloven hoofed critter said - "Whatever floats yer goat!" Have fun. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kilrahi Posted September 4, 2019 Share Posted September 4, 2019 On 9/2/2019 at 2:31 AM, jacobmilton said: When I had my old pedal bord I used a switcher and one button sent my signal to the tuner, that of course was on at all times. I also used that as a "mute effect" making me absolutely quiet instantly. Are you opposed to a similar solution now? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kidAmazed Posted September 5, 2019 Share Posted September 5, 2019 14 hours ago, Kilrahi said: Are you opposed to a similar solution now? I just don't want anymore hardware. I'm mentioning this cause it would be an easy fix for L6. I like the tuner. I just wanna have more "turn on" options. As I mentioned above. Isn't it pretty obvious to have some kind of live mode for the display? I mean, who looks at the signal chain while playing? You can use the display for better things in a live situation. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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